Home charging options

[Bhavnish]

Hi all.

very interesting thread.

Being a Dentist.. i know nothing about electrics etc

I am picking up my Model S (Facelift) in Oct so have plenty of time

I have two practices, one with three phase supply (I am only there one day/week) the other is a regular supply.

Pod point have been very good in my case in terms of response

I live nowhere near a public charger so most of my charging will be at home or work and to add to that i travel by car a fair amount.. many 200mile+ day trips (luckily mainly to area where there are more chargers)

I am swaying to the pod point 7kW option as I believe that is the 'fastest' or high 'range/hour' option i have

your thoughts would be very much appreciated

Thanks in advance

Bhav

 

[Jebus]

In the first instance 7kw should be more than enough at 22 miles of charge per hour. I have that at home which can fully charge over night and at work which can fully charge while I work.

If you're after faster than that of you should be lucky enough to have a shorter working day, I believe there are options with the three phase although I'd await a more electrically experienced reply than myself.

Pod point may be a great option and looked great when I looked however I went for a commando socket installed myself at £90. A much cheaper and just as efficient option.

Hope some of this helps!

 

[arg]

I am picking up my Model S (Facelift) in Oct so have plenty of time

I have two practices, one with three phase supply (I am only there one day/week) the other is a regular supply.

By October, the Tesla wall connector should be available in the UK. For your workplace installs, where there's no prospect of a grant, that is the obvious thing to install; at your location with three-phase, you can take advantage of that to get the 50% greater (11kW vs 7kW) charging rate at probablvery little extra cost (the Tesla unit is only available in a three-phase capable model, though you can use it on single phase if you wish, and it's approximately the same price as single-phase units from the likes of Rolec/Pod-point). Another advantage of the Tesla unit is that you can install multiple of them with intelligent sharing of the power - a potential consideration at your practice if your partners may be impressed by your S and decide to get one too?

You could potentially get even faster charging at your three-phase location by paying the extra for the uprated charger in the car - but unlikely to be worth it unless for example you were working half-days there combined with zooming around the countryside for the other half of the day.

At home, 7kW should be plenty especially as you are planning to have charging at work.

As others have said, the cheap option is to install commando sockets and plug your UMC into them. However, in your case with wanting to charge in more than one place that means you will be unplugging your UMC every morning and rolling it up to take with you, plus that leaves you with no backup option if your UMC fails. You could of course buy a 2nd UMC to leave plugged in at home, but the wall connector is both cheaper and better.

You haven't said how far apart these places are - if they are all close to home, then planning to charge 99% at home (on a proper chargepoint) and just having a socket at the other locations for occasional use via the UMC wouldn't be unreasonable - though still penny-pinching to my mind. Plugging in is something you want to do every time you park the car, so making it convenient is money well spent IMO.

 

[Bhavnish]

Thank you very much...

My two practice are about 30 miles apart and i live in between the two practices...

I am happy to spend some money on getting the charging efficient

 

[thegruf]

with your practices so close, charging should not be a big worry for you.given the cars range.

I have a 90 mile daily commute and just plug it in when I get home, I dont bother with charging at work.
Just becomes second nature to get home plug it in, next day over breakfast use the app to turn on the heat/aircon go out to car stick the connector back on the hook at drive off. Simle and a delight to use.

There's no appreciable difference in charging efficiencies between the different solutions, so as I think the government know enough about me already and all the OLEV ones report back to HQ, I just put a commando socket in for now, and will replace it with a Tesla wall connector when it becomes avaiable really just to complete the look.

I did however spend out £90 for the 3 phase UMC adapter just to cover myself, though have never used it yet. And silly money for the (ridiulously large and heavy) Chademo adapter and havent used that either!

 

[arg]

My two practice are about 30 miles apart and i live in between the two practices...

I am happy to spend some money on getting the charging efficient

Well, with that short a distance you'd probably be OK with just having charging at home - but extra options are a nice luxury to have.

I stand by my recommendation for the Tesla Wall Connector, but it seems unlikely you could justify the upgraded charger in the car.

 

[WannabeOwner]

Some tangential thoughts:

I prefer a tethered charging point - just stuff the cable/socket into the car, no need to also have to disconnect and store (a possibly rain-soaked) adaptor in the car - every time you charge.

We put an OLEV charging point at home, alongside a tethered one, in case we had visitors with EV that could make use of it. It was grant-assisted, and I suppose I will charge on it occasionally to keep the phone-home data logging happy.

At work just a tethered connection.

Plan is to charge primarily at work. Work can pay for the electricity and, AFAIK, there is no benefit-in-kind issue with that (presumably would be hard to monitor any abuse). Assuming work charging is enough (an 80% charge will comfortably get me home from work, and back again the next day, including a reasonable amount of additional running around), and presuming I charge at home on Weekends "sometimes", my expectation is that Work charging, plus some adhoc Super Charger use, will account for 80-90% of all charging [cost]

 

[vitz]

Hi,

New to the forum and to driving EVs, or I will be once my Model 3 arrives! Found out about this forum from Ryan McCaffrey's Ride the Lightning Tesla podcast.

I'm looking to get my home ready for charging my new Model 3, normal driving will be 50 miles a day. I've spoken to Tesla who mentioned their Wall Connector box (at £438) and installation charge via Phoenix Wings of £400+VAT. But do I really need all that?

I have single phase electricity in the new house I'll be moving into this Summer, so I'm wondering whether it's easier to get the charger installed now while it's still being built rather than having the electrician do a bunch of drilling after the house has gone up.

Also, does anyone know if I'll actually benefit from having a Tesla Wall Connector over a third party charger (i.e. get 16kW of power charging roughly 20 miles per hour), or would I also need to get the upgrade to the charger port on the car itself?

Thanks in advance, sorry for opening with a bunch of questions, just trying not to pay through the nose for tech that I may not even need.

 

[WannabeOwner]

I would like to have the wall connector that they have in the USA - Tesla branded etc. and tethered - but its not available in the UK yet.

You might want to wait for that. You might also want to put in an additional "Plain Jane" socket suitable for any visitor to charge their vehicle with (of course different cars use different types, and that may change in future). Tesla currently provide (or they did until recently) a Voucher for "free" installation (for new models I think this has happened once car choices have been finalised ... although I suppose there is a strong possibility that they may phase out that offer by the time the Model 3 is in mass production). Your local council (or government even!) might have a grant now / by then.

Flip side is that I have read people saying that the price of a grant-assisted install was exactly the same as just asking their local Sparky to do it and the later provided a) more choice and b) no "ET Phone Home" monitoring.

So you might want to wait!!

My suggestion would be to get an appropriate cable routed to where you want the external socket(s) and leave it at that. Dunno how easy it will be to predict what cable you would need - maybe a fat-enough duct and a draw string would be a better answer?

 

[vitz]

I would like to have the wall connector that they have in the USA - Tesla branded etc. and tethered - but its not available in the UK yet.

You might want to wait for that. You might also want to put in an additional "Plain Jane" socket suitable for any visitor to charge their vehicle with (of course different cars use different types, and that may change in future). Tesla currently provide (or they did until recently) a Voucher for "free" installation (for new models I think this has happened once car choices have been finalised ... although I suppose there is a strong possibility that they may phase out that offer by the time the Model 3 is in mass production). Your local council (or government even!) might have a grant now / by then.

Flip side is that I have read people saying that the price of a grant-assisted install was exactly the same as just asking their local Sparky to do it and the later provided a) more choice and b) no "ET Phone Home" monitoring.

So you might want to wait!!

My suggestion would be to get an appropriate cable routed to where you want the external socket(s) and leave it at that. Dunno how easy it will be to predict what cable you would need - maybe a fat-enough duct and a draw string would be a better answer?

Thanks for the reply!

I spoke to Tesla in Leeds last week (it's not a service center, but it is an official store) with a raft of questions - most of which they couldn't answer. But they are the ones who said I could order a Wall Connector, so I think they are actually available to order now (even if they are on back order). Guess it was more a question of whether my single phase electricity actually warrants a Wall Charger, or do I only need one if I buy the upgrade for the car as well.

Might belong in another thread, but they did confirm that the invite to configure would go out at the same time, regardless of the date that people made their reservation (I know, it shocked me too). Its an opportunity to effectively jump the queue if you're quick to configure and make your reservation into a deposit payment! I thought that these invites would go out in the order that people reserved, but according to the Tesla staff at Leeds, that isn't the case.

 

[WannabeOwner]

I could order a Wall Connector, so I think they are actually available to order now

Last I heard was October, so seems likely that it will be soon or soon-ish

whether my single phase electricity actually warrants a Wall Charger, or do I only need one if I buy the upgrade for the car as well

I don't know the answer to that, but the wall charger delivers significantly more Umph than just stuffing it into a 13AMP socket (if that was your other alternative). I think the standard wall socket will get you 7kW (21 MPH ?), if you have 3-phase you get 11kW (34 MPH ?) and if you also have the second charger (in a Model S) then 3-phase can deliver 22kW (68 MPH ?) (but you'd need to be wanting to charge quickly at that location, and my guess is that a dual-charger will have little usage except at private 3-Phase sites; for charging at non-Supercharger sites I carry a CHAdeMO adapter which can get 38kW (117MPH ?)). Supercharger can be 300 MPH if the battery is close to empty

I thought that these invites would go out in the order that people reserved

With new models in the past I think it was the case that invites went out in ordering-order ... but delivery periods were given for various specs so that production could batch the builds, with higher-spec models delivered first, so unless you ordered high-spec you had to wait longer. Tesla can't make the 500,000 pre-ordered Model-3 cars in one batch! so my best guess is that early orders will be batched and given first configuration choice, and within that batch high-spec delivered before low-spec. Then then next 100,000 will be given their chance ...

... but that's all speculation of course.

 

[vitz]

Thanks for the info, makes sense for them to be built in batches.

I've been looking at the options list for the Model S and working out what potential Model 3 options would cost (based on if they were 75% and 50% of the cost of Model S respectively) and I think I'm going for a relatively modest spec list (metallic paint, autopilot, air suspension, glass roof (not pano sunrooof), dual motors, maybe next gen seats) so I'm guessing mine will be in the 3rd/4th batch that will be produced.

In terms of charging, I don't need a super high rate of charge as I'm only doing a relatively small amount of miles per day. I think a 7kW charger will be more than sufficient (21mph of charge with my single phase electricity). Naturally, Tesla is going to point me towards their branded option which is a lot more expensive. Still, we have some time to decide as Model 3 isn't exactly arriving next week!

As you say, it's all speculation until we know more confirmed details. Hopefully the phase 2 unveil will be towards the end of this year.

 

[bryand]

...I've been looking at the options list for the Model S and working out what potential Model 3 options would cost (based on if they were 75% and 50% of the cost of Model S respectively).

Why do you think something like air suspension on a model 3 will cost less than it does on a model S? It will be the same hardware and software.

 

[WannabeOwner]

Sorry for my ignorance, but is there a significant benefit to air suspension?

 

[arg]

Sorry for my ignorance, but is there a significant benefit to air suspension?

Tesla originally made a big point of the fact that it lowers the car to the ground at motorway speeds, hence improving aerodynamics and hence range. The amount of lowering was reduced after the two accidents where cars struck road debris causing battery damage and fire (it appears that those events coming close together were a statistical anomaly, there having been none before or since, but Tesla were forced to react due to the bad publicity). The lowering is still reported to have a measurable improvement to range (my car doesn't have air susp, so can't comment personally), but not huge.

The other Tesla-specific feature is the ability to select greater ground clearance (eg. to go over a high curb or speed bump) and have the car remember the location and automatically raise the suspension next time you go there.

There's also the obvious and traditional benefits of air suspension - smoother ride and self-levelling - though arguably the choice of wheels and tyres has a bigger effect. There's an argument that the air suspension is more important if you select the 21" wheels with their very low profile tyres and consequent harsh ride.

On the other side of the coin, air suspension is said to you less steering 'feel' - more of a limousine than a sports-car ride. And air suspension generally has had a poor reputation for reliability, requiring expensive repairs - this doesn't seem to be true as yet on Model S, but it remains to be seen whether that's just a matter of time or whether the industry have managed to improve durability. Aside from the software control, Tesla's air suspension just uses off-the-shelf parts (IIRC from Contental) so has the same pros and cons as on, say, a Mercedes.

 

[WannabeOwner]

Very helpful ARG, thanks.

 

[Flux Capacitor]

Picking up my ex-demo 70d on Tuesday, and due to a combination of factors (mainly being out of the country for 2w after ordering and then waiting forever for Tesla to send me the home voucher) I still haven't got my home installation sorted.

I have a 3pin that I can use for the interim, and am getting a chademo adapter with the car (there are plenty of service stations on the way to work and back) and I don't live 'too' far from a supercharger.

What options did you guys go with? Due to olev and home installation voucher changes I'm looking at (7kw versions):
£500 pod point tethered
£330 rolec tethered
£300 rolec socketed (+~£150 cable)
Commando point installation £250+vat = £300 + using the UMC

I can understand the cost of the olev options as the hardware may be expensive, but the commando point is literally a £20 socket, £20 of cable, £5 for an earth spike and £20 for an RCBO + minimal labour + part P cert, how on earth does that cost £600 (including the tesla voucher)? I just can't bring myself to give these promoted companies £400+ in profit, so have got some leccies coming round to quote for the install of the socket myself.

I'd appreciate some input on whether the rolec (likely installed by blythe-electrial in west mids area) are ok, or whether to go with podpoint (they look nicer).

edit: how are these companies with a 'standard' installation? most of the blurb seems to suggest they just trail a cable through the hallway out of the front door and if you want anything else you pay extra for it.

Hi I have just installed a Rolec tethered charger point 7Kw at my home which charges my Model S at 21 mph. However I have twin chargers fitted so at work we have installed a 3 phase Rolec charger point 22kw which charges at 64mph. Both charger points were easy to install and are working great I tend to top up every night at home to 80% charge but if I need to top up in a hurry I go to the office work for a few hours and charge up quicker there.

 

[Flux Capacitor]

Tesla originally made a big point of the fact that it lowers the car to the ground at motorway speeds, hence improving aerodynamics and hence range. The amount of lowering was reduced after the two accidents where cars struck road debris causing battery damage and fire (it appears that those events coming close together were a statistical anomaly, there having been none before or since, but Tesla were forced to react due to the bad publicity). The lowering is still reported to have a measurable improvement to range (my car doesn't have air susp, so can't comment personally), but not huge.

The other Tesla-specific feature is the ability to select greater ground clearance (eg. to go over a high curb or speed bump) and have the car remember the location and automatically raise the suspension next time you go there.

There's also the obvious and traditional benefits of air suspension - smoother ride and self-levelling - though arguably the choice of wheels and tyres has a bigger effect. There's an argument that the air suspension is more important if you select the 21" wheels with their very low profile tyres and consequent harsh ride.

On the other side of the coin, air suspension is said to you less steering 'feel' - more of a limousine than a sports-car ride. And air suspension generally has had a poor reputation for reliability, requiring expensive repairs - this doesn't seem to be true as yet on Model S, but it remains to be seen whether that's just a matter of time or whether the industry have managed to improve durability. Aside from the software control, Tesla's air suspension just uses off-the-shelf parts (IIRC from Contental) so has the same pros and cons as on, say, a Mercedes.

Hi before buying my Model S I test drove two Models S cars on the same day back to back one with air suspension and one without specifically to see what was the difference and which I preferred. The result was I like the handling and sporty responsive steering feel of the non air suspension car best, but after driving the two cars over the same roads with pot holes I settled for the air suspension version because of the more comfortable ride quality as the roads in my location being pretty awful.

 

[vitz]

Why do you think something like air suspension on a model 3 will cost less than it does on a model S? It will be the same hardware and software.

Just going off from Elon Musk said about the options for Model 3 costing less than Model S and X. I accept that it may be the same hardware and software, perhaps they are willing to sacrifice margin on these options to offer a lower price.

It probably down to the Model S being a 'luxury' car whereas the Model 3 is aimed at a different, more mass market crowd. I agree that air suspension is a premium upgrade, but until we know more confirmed details - it's all speculation!

 

[WannabeOwner]

I find the Model S "bumpy" on some country roads (i.e. ones that do not appear to be knackered, and aren't littered with potholes). Purely subjective, and just my "feel" compared to other cars I have driven over the last few years, on the same roads.

19" wheels, not air-suspension.