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Honda Clarity PHEV 47 Mile AER Midsize Sedan

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RobStark

Well-Known Member
Jul 2, 2013
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61,550
Los Angeles, USA
Parking lot review


2018 Honda Clarity Plug-In Hybrid First Drive | Review | Car and Driver

On the road, the Clarity feels a lot like an overloaded Accord. Honda says the plug-in Clarity has a curb weight that tops 4000 pounds, which makes it between 600 and 900 pounds heavier than the company’s family sedan. While the Clarity has a premium feel to its well-damped ride, the tidy handling of the new Accord is nowhere to be found, compromised by the many extra pounds of batteries under the back seat. Their placement gives the car a low center of gravity, but the Clarity feels as if it reaches the edge of its cornering limits prematurely, despite relatively wide 235/45R-18 tires. Steering effort is low, with plenty of electric assist and some feedback (but not a lot). Isolation from road and engine noise, however, is mostly excellent—at least until you encounter a steep hill with the battery depleted, in which case the little gas engine has to rev to the sky to keep the car moving.

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My brother in law will not consider a pure BEV because of range anxiety. A Detroit brand is a tough sale for him because concerns over reliability.

He has driven Toyotas and Hondas for the last 30 years. The Volt is too small. Prius Prime,Fusion-Optima-Sonata PHEV AER covers about half his daily commute and he doesn't think they are worth the trouble.

He was leaning Toyota Avalon. I seemingly convinced him to get a Buick LaCross mild hybrid for the same cash as a base Avalon in part because Buick is rated in Top Ten in Reliablity by Consumer reports rising as high as 3 a couple of years ago. Then he decided to delay his purchase.

If he finds Clarity styling acceptable this may be just the ticket for him and buyers like him. After Federal,State, and Utility incentives a Clarity Touring is cheaper than a base Avalon or LaCross although these are a bit bigger.
 
As far as PHEVs go, it's the closest thing to a Volt from anyone else. The sad part is the full EV Clarity only has a max range of 89 miles, which in this day and age is embarrassing. It seems like Honda is sandbagging the EV to pump up the Fuel Cell and PHEV models.

They designed the car for the FCEV version. Originally set to be a ~$65k car.

The BEV and PHEV were an afterthought.

It only fits a max 25 kWh pack. Unless they went with two packs like 25 kWh plus 15 kWh.

Fortunately, the Clarity fits a 17 kWh pack plus 1.5L ICE and associated hardware for the PHEV.

They were not selling enough FCEV to meet their ZEV credit obligations to CARB.

BTW The Volt is a compact while the Clarity PHEV is a midsize car. Whereas the Volt has a hard time fitting an adult size male sitting behind another adult size male the Clarity PHEV does just fine; including actual leg room for the 5th passenger where the Volt's 5th seat is vestigial.
 
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@RobStark Yes, I know the Clarity is a different size and configuration, but I was saying from a functionality standpoint as a PHEV. Its range is closest to the Volt (47 vs 53 mi). I just think it was a serious miscalculation on Honda's part to give the EV model such a short range.

I know what you meant, but it is important to note the interior functionality is superior in the Clarity. It is not just "almost a Volt."

Honda only intends to sell a handful of Clarity BEV in CA and OR. Mostly to former Honda Fit EV owners. I think they calculated accurately how many BEVs they will sell. They have no intention of selling as many BEV as GM, Nissan, nor Tesla.
 
It may have been a calculated decision, but still disappointing they're not taking more of a leadership position in EVs. Seems a lot of the OEMs are taking a very tentative, pinkie toe in the water approach. I think the companies to watch in the next 3-5 years in the BEV space (besides Tesla) are VWAG, GM and Hyundai/Kia.
 
Honda's current and immediate future BEV offerings are disappointing but the Clarity PHEV is not.

Well, Honda apparently licensed Voltec from GM. Don't know how much they used and how much was avoiding patent infringement.

GM has had 7 years to offer a midsize PHEV and when they do it cost $75k, gets an AER of 31 miles with a combined 26 MPG in hybrid mode.

To be fair, it's $75k because it's a Cadillac and ...

2017 Cadillac CT6 Plug-In
MSRP: $75,095
EPA Fuel Economy
Electricity + Gasoline
Combined: 62 MPGe* (.0 gal/100 mi of gas plus 54 kw-hrs/100 mi of electricity )
Premium Gasoline
Combined: 26 MPG
City: 23 MPG
Highway: 29 MPG

2017 BMW 740e xDrive
MSRP: $89,100
EPA Fuel Economy
Electricity + Gasoline
Combined: 64 MPGe* (.0 gal/100 mi of gas plus 52 kw-hrs/100 mi of electricity )
Premium Gasoline
Combined: 27 MPG
City: 25 MPG
Highway: 29 MPG

The BMW has _14_ miles of range.

There's only so much you can do with a full-size PHEV.

Note: S100D is 33 kw-hrs / 100 miles

(Copied from fueleconomy.gov, don't blame me for the small w).
 
Well, Honda apparently licensed Voltec from GM. Don't know how much they used and how much was avoiding patent infringement.

It is a Honda ICE plus a Panasonic pack with the hardware in between licenced from GM but made by Honda/Honda suppliers with Honda modified GM software.

This makes the fact the GM has not made an Impala PHEV worse not better.

The fact that BMW/MB PHEVs suck harder doesn't make the CT6 PHEV suck less. A base CT6 has a base MSRP of $54k.
 
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It is a Honda ICE plus a Panasonic pack with the hardware in between licenced from GM but made by Honda/Honda suppliers with Honda modified GM software.
As far as I am aware, there is no licensed Voltec-related hardware from GM in the Clarity PHEV. Rather, I believe it uses essentially the same powertrain as the Honda Accord hybrid but with a different, much larger externally rechargeable battery pack.

If you have specific evidence for the “GM theory” being discussed here I’d love to get a link to it. I know there have been past assertions floating around that Honda licensed Voltec from GM but I have no personal knowledge if this is true. I’m just confident that Voltec-based designs have not appeared in the Accord or Clarity hybrids or any other Honda product that I’m aware of.

I wrote a somewhat in-depth review article on the Honda Accord hybrid and talked to Honda’s chief Accord engineer visiting from Japan via a translator as well as other Honda officials. I also read SAE technical papers about Honda’s design and I know a lot about and have written technical articles about the Voltec design.

2017 Honda Accord Hybrid Review – First Drive - HybridCars.com

I was told at the time of my Accord hybrid article that the Clarity PHEV would have the same core powertrain design. I have not written an article on the Clarity PHEV but I’ve skimmed articles on it and I’ve seen no evidence that appeared to conflict with my earlier understanding.

Here’s more than you may want to know....

The Accord/Clarity Hybrid transmission is unique to Honda and, yes, its design was likely motivated by a desire to evade competitor’s patent rights (my speculation).

It has a clutch so it can either operate as a fixed gear parallel hybrid or as a series hybrid at speeds under 35-40 mph (where parallel operation would be at too low of an rpm for the ICE) or when high power is demanded and the fixed gear is not within the ICE peak torque range. In some sense, this is like a first-generation Volt except the Volt would clutch from series mode to a Prius-like series/parallel continuously variable (CVT) mode.

The 2nd generation Volt is completely different and is a “two-mode” design with a first mode conceptually identical to a Prius that takes the place of a series mode and a second mode that is somewhat similar to the CVT mode on the 1st-gen Volt but different in detail. Technically, the 2nd Volt also has a third mode which acts as a single fixed gear parallel hybrid mode like the Honda design although the Volt uses it less often than the first two modes.

At first glance it seems odd that Honda can get away with only a single fixed gear but it works well-enough within typical vehicle speed ranges. It runs at around a 25% higher rpm than when the regular Accord’s automatic transmission is in its 6th gear highway overdrive but the hybrid design gains efficiency from lower internal friction with its simple gearing design.

The main downside is noticeable higher engine rpm at ~70 mph and above and a brief “upshift-like” delay when suddenly flooring the accelerator at highway speeds as it clutches from one mode to another. It also tends to rev up the engine more during strong acceleration at city speeds.

If you are a calm and sedate hybrid driver it can be an efficient design. From a cost standpoint, they save money on the simple mechanical gearing but spend money on needing two large similarly-sized motors and associated inverters to act as generator and traction motor. The 2nd-gen Volt, Prius Prime, and Chrysler Pacifica hybrid use a clutch when the ICE is off to join their generator and main traction motor together for EV operation which allows them to downsize both motors for the case when the ICE is running. The Honda design can’t do that.

This makes the fact the GM has not made an Impala PHEV worse not better.
GM has already dropped the 2nd-gen Voltec transmission with only modest internal tweaks into the mid-size Chevy Malibu hybrid which gets 46 mpg. They also use it in a Buick LaCrosse hybrid in China. They could relatively easily do what they did in the Caddy ELR and stuff a reconfigured Volt battery pack in the trunk of those cars and turn them into PHEVs. Most likely, they may take an upcoming mid or full-size sedan model platform redesign and try to find a less clunky way to hid the battery. I have no specific knowledge of their plans.

The fact that BMW/MB PHEVs suck harder doesn't make the CT6 PHEV suck less. A base CT6 has a base MSRP of $54k.
You can make an efficient hybridized car with modest performance like the ~180 HP Chevy Malibu hybrid that does 0-60 in ~8 seconds (from memory) but the CT6 and BMW/MB hybrids are designed for high power. The CT6 is 335 HP and ~460 lb-ft torque that gets 0-60 mph in 5.2 seconds. Nobody has figured how to have high performance and high efficiency in the same ICE powertrain design in a large luxury car.
 
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Edit Inside EVs has now split Clarity BEV from PHEV sales.

Dec 2017
Clarity BEV 527
Clarity PHEV 898
I'm surprised that many people in CA and OR elected to buy or lease the Clarity BEV. Those leases must be pretty attractive. I fully expect the Clarity PHEV numbers to go up. Maybe not to Volt & Prime numbers, but easily 1,500/mo if the supply is there and they spread around the inventory.
 
I'm surprised that many people in CA and OR elected to buy or lease the Clarity BEV. Those leases must be pretty attractive. I fully expect the Clarity PHEV numbers to go up. Maybe not to Volt & Prime numbers, but easily 1,500/mo if the supply is there and they spread around the inventory.

I am shocked Honda moved 527 Clarity BEVs in Dec 17. When I originally quoted 1425 I did not note it was a combined number because I assumed virtually all 1425 were PHEVs.

Then again Clarity BEV is a lease only proposition. $899 down and $199/month for 36 months. And that includes 20k miles per year.
 
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The fact that BMW/MB PHEVs suck harder doesn't make the CT6 PHEV suck less. ...

So all PHEVs that have < 32 miles of AER combined suck?

That's most of the non-GM PHEVs including all Toyota PIPs / Prius Primes (9 to 25 miles AER). Toyota has had 6 years to extend AER, and the best they can hit is 25 miles.

Tell me how many miles you THINK the typical commuter drives each workday.

EDIT - BTW, the truth is any PHEV that doesn't have 53 miles of AER today is sub-standard, since the standard PHEV is the Volt. The 53 mile Volt AER is not optimistic either. At >4000lb unladen the Clarity will suffer far more range degradation if you do jackrabbit starts, or drive in mountains.
 
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Picked up a Clarity PHEV this weekend. I’m pretty happy with it, but I’m also not a racing driver type. It has a very nice ride, beautiful interior, and well over 90% of my driving will be pure electric. It’s pure “no drama” Honda. I will also get $12.5k in tax credits for it next year.

It is a bit odd after driving pure EV for the past 3.5 years to have a gas motor, but it’s a nice compromise for now to get the range I need a couple of time per month when I have to travel regionally.
 
Picked up a Clarity PHEV this weekend. I’m pretty happy with it, but I’m also not a racing driver type. It has a very nice ride, beautiful interior, and well over 90% of my driving will be pure electric. It’s pure “no drama” Honda. I will also get $12.5k in tax credits for it next year.

It is a bit odd after driving pure EV for the past 3.5 years to have a gas motor, but it’s a nice compromise for now to get the range I need a couple of time per month when I have to travel regionally.
You are the ideal PHEV owner. I think there could be a huge market for PHEVs if people just thought of them a a “regular” car with extremely good mileage, with advantages from the point of view of quietness and performance. And zero range anxiety.
 
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