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Honest P90D(L) Quarter Mile Performance

Discussion in 'Model S: Driving Dynamics' started by George Parrott, Mar 17, 2016.

  1. George Parrott

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    I have been searching and trying to discover is ANY OWNER cars have come close to the advertised 10.9 second quarter mile times promised for this model. Only the Motor Trend "loaner" car has come under 11 seconds in an official timing setting as far as I can find.

    Has anybody actually seen timing tapes for their P90D(L) with under 11 seconds in the quarter mile?

    The BEST I have seen was lAST NIGHT, March 16, at Sacramento Raceway, when I ran my P85D(L) against an almost brand new P90D(L) that came up from the Bay area to test out performance under virtually IDEAL conditions.

    11.22 seconds was the BEST TIME for the P90D(L) at 118.59 mph

    (My best time was 3 weeks earlier when I turned 11.366 in my upgraded P85D(L) and another upgraded P85D(L) turned 11.34 seconds)

    ANYBODY have track tapes with quarter mile performance for the P90D(L) under 11 seconds? Because IF no actual owner car can produce the advertised performance....then Tesla may have to face a "false advertising" class action....
     
  2. sorka

    sorka Active Member

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    The previous best time I've seen posted or in any video or time slip was 11.24 but that wasn't with stock wheels. Was the 11.22 with stock wheels and tires??? With or without pano? If so, that would beat the previous best time I've seen for a completely stock setup of 11.3x.
     
  3. George Parrott

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    She had the stock 21" performance wheel and tire combination AND the panoramic roof. YES, as far as I can tell, she turned the FASTEST EVER quarter mile time by an owner car P90D(L).
     
  4. George Parrott

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    Also, she did NOT even lower her tire pressure!
     
  5. SabrToothSqrl

    SabrToothSqrl Active Member

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    I thought one maxed tire pressure for less rolling resistance?

    Off road we drop to 8 or 12PSI for flex and grip... (35" tires on 16" wheels)
     
  6. George Parrott

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    The quarter mile is a balancing between "soft enough to get grip" and smooth as speed increases. Most drivers lower their normal road driving tire pressure about 10lbs or so for more grip off the starting line.
     
  7. P85DEE

    P85DEE Active Member

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    Thanks for the update George.

    In reviewing all of the info we have so far, it appears to me that 11.1 is going to be the current low end capability for a minimally optioned P90D with Ludicrous.

    This is the second P90D I've heard of running 11.2x and the third 11.2 quarter mile pass recorded on a drag strip, with a fourth 11.2 recorded on Vbox.

    That car, while on aftermarket wheels, was on stock rubber.

    Both cars known to have hit the 11.2 mark were generously optioned.

    From reviewing available time slips of P90D 11.2 second times, it appears that a 60ft time of 1.61x is necessary to have a shot at 11.2x.

    A stock wheels and stock rubber P85D with Ludicrous has achieved that 1.61x 60ft time. However it did so on an 1/8th mile track. It ran an 1/8 mile et and trap speed right in line with that of the 11.2x time slips.

    That car was also generously optioned.

    I'm thinking that the C/D time of 11.1 and in a minimally optioned P90D with Ludicrous is going to be the current low end quarter mile capability of the P90D with Ludicrous.
     
  8. George Parrott

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    The P90D(L) at Sacramento last week had a 1.635 second 60" time. a 7.123 1/8th mile time @ 97.23 mph
     
  9. P85DEE

    P85DEE Active Member

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    #9 P85DEE, Mar 20, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2016
    If it ran 11.22 with a 60ft time greater than 1.61x, thats impressive. It would have been interesting to see if it would have broken 11.2 with a 1.61x 60ft time. I'm thinking that it would have.

    A 1.63x 60ft time, from the slips I've seen, usually produces a quarter mile time of 11.3x in these cars.

    The car you saw which managed an 11.22 on a 1.63 60ft time, seems to have made up some of it on the top end.

    97.23 mph is the fastest trap I can recall for the 1/8 in one of these cars and could be a record.

    11.22 is right there on the doorstep of the C/D reported time, and you report that this was a sunroof equipped car.

    I'll be very happy if I can make it to 11.3-11.2, a crazy capability for a 2.5 ton sedan, following my update, but I'm a P85D owner.

    We're I a P90D ludicrous owner, I'd be a bit disappointed that the cars seem thus far to be struggling so mightily to break the 11 second barrier.

    But then no more disappointed than I am right now with them dragging their feet on calling me in for my update.

    Last time I spoke with my SC, they told me to give it 3 weeks.

    That was on 2/12/16 which was what, 5 weeks ago?

    2015 Tesla Model S P90D Ludicrous

    And

    1:45 of the video.

     
  10. radami1

    radami1 Member

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    I have trouble understanding why, with a Tesla with AWD and electronic traction control, you would need to get that much of a grip of the line. When you get up over 60 you really start to pay a price for those soft tires. Anyone ever done an actual comparison where they do a quarter with say 40lbs vs. a quarter with 50lbs of pressure in the same Tesla D model on the same track?
     
  11. AWDtsla

    AWDtsla Active Member

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    Because there is still room to deliver more horsepower to the ground off the line. The alternative is more power needs to pulled when the car is (theoretically) battery power limited.
     
  12. sorka

    sorka Active Member

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    Just keep in mind that to deliver the same power at earlier RPMs will mean higher peak torque at earlier RPMs. The drivetrain stress is proportional torque, not the amount of power. The drivetrain from the motor on down to the the driveshafts might be near their maximum torque handling already.
     
  13. AWDtsla

    AWDtsla Active Member

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    There is no data that indicates that how much torque can be handled by the powertrain. Even if anecdotal, I have yet to hear about anyone breaking driveshafts or gears.
     
  14. George Parrott

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    @AWDtsla

    Lolachampcar opines that it may be that Tesla has moderated the power delivery for just this reason: To make sure that nothing breaks. You are absolutely correct that we have not heard about anyone breaking driveshafts or gears, but perhaps at full power potential from the motors....that might happen?

    Still, I want...MORE POWER to the wheels; I want to see a P90D(L) OWNER car go under 11 seconds in the quarter. I believe that MT got the performance they have reported using a Tesla "fleet loaner," but I want the "rest of us" to have that same wonderful, brain-bruising, experience.
     
  15. sorka

    sorka Active Member

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    Sure. I wasn't making a claim. I was just pointing out that if they allow more power at lower RPMs, it will mean higher peak torque and *maybe* this is a limiting factor. Otherwise why not just fix the 10.9 second issue by expanding the powerband to the left :)
     
  16. George Parrott

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    WHERE are all the P90D(L) owners who could or will be soon, actually getting their cars to the nearest convenient drag strip, typically on Wednesday afternoons/evenings for actual full testing? There is NOTHING risky in "testing" one's car to confirm it performs as openly advertised. Tesla has advertised, and that is a contractual promise, in the view of most courts, that the P90D(L) will do "0-60 mph in 10.9 seconds" but so far NOT A SINGLE OWNER CAR has actually come very close, in the fractions of a second that drag strips measure.

    Motor Trend recorded a trap speed at the end of the quarter of 121 mph, and NO OWNER CAR has gone over 118 mph, NONE! At least so far reported.

    EVERY previous Tesla Model S interation has equalled or bettered its advertised performance until the current $10,000 upgrade to P90D(L). Come on fellow owners of P-series AWD cars, let's see what your car can actually do and not just the "seat of the pants" feel which of course is better than anything we have ever driven before...

    Post more "data." PLEASE
     
  17. eclipxe

    eclipxe Member

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    Ahem. The 691hp* mega thread would like a moment with you
     
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  18. Andyw2100

    Andyw2100 Well-Known Member

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    I fear, George, that many of the owners who, like you, have purchased expensive cars that are not meeting specs aren't going to bother to come forward for a few reasons. One may be that they saw the grief those of us who were on the front lines of the 691 HP battle took, and want no part of that. Another could be that they saw how much we gained from our battle, even after Tesla essentially quietly conceded that we were right, and are thinking, "why bother?"

    I hope I am wrong.
     
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  19. P85DEE

    P85DEE Active Member

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    #19 P85DEE, Mar 26, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2016
    Like many other 6 figure performance vehicles in private hands, most P90Ds with Ludicrous will never see a drag strip.

    Of the few owners who are inclined to do so, well 10.9 is very quick. 11 seconds is quick. A low 11 second car will scare the avg driver not used to such a quick car.

    Thus the number is going to shrink even more if you are looking for owners who are actually willing to go to a drag strip with the pre meditated mindset to "flog the hell out of the car if necessary to get that 10.9 time out if it, no matter what", and "drive it like you hate it" and run the car balls out without holding back, even though they're on a drag strip.

    Some will go to the strip to have a mad minute and drive more aggressively than they do on the street. They won't even care as much about the time. All they wanted to do was drive the car as fast as they could without fear of being pulled over by the cops. Something you can't do on a public road.

    But it's going to take a driver who is first willing to even go to a drag strip, where first off, most auto insurance policies do not apply, and secondly who has at least some experience, some skills, and who has little fear whatsoever of putting his 6 figure car into the wall or having another driver hit him in a car costing a fraction as much that the other driver put together in his garage specifically for drag racing and who simply wants to try his hand against a Tesla.

    You fold your car up on that strip, you're very likely to have to eat the entire cost of replacing it. Even if it wasn't your fault because you're signing a waiver before you go onto the track holding the track and other drivers harmless. Notifying your insurance company afterwards???, well, on the off chance that they do cover you that one time, you can bet they will cancel you immediately afterward. More likely is that they don't cover you and then add insult to injury and go ahead and immediately cancel you too.

    It also goes without saying that if you do hit something, or lose control while attempting to cover a distance of a quarter mile in less than 11 seconds, that there is a reasonable chance that you'll not just simply walk away from it.

    And whatever you do, don't call your insurance company and ask them if you're covered beforehand. At that point they'll consider you not just a higher risk, but also a fraud risk and could cancel you just for asking, feeling that if you do have a track mishap, that you're likely to fraudulently claim that it happend on the street.

    This is the reason why many track rats with expensive cars, won't run those cars, or run them sparingly, and run dedicated track cars, sometimes rebuilt "R title" cars, that they have little invested in on the strip.

    It will take someone who also has no fear of busting anything mechanical and having to be towed from a drag strip by "Bubba's Towing and Recovery" before the drag strip closes. Hopefully he'll have a flatbed and will accept credit cards and doesn't insist on cash.

    The owner also will not know or care about the toll that racing takes on any car. If you're doing a good bit of racing in a street car, I don't know what it is, but as time passes, something always sounds funny, smells funny, or feels different from then on.

    So we're getting into a smaller and smaller group.

    Of that group, those who miss the spec and run 11.2 or 11.1, only a few will have any interest in raising such a stink about it to the point of talking about taking it to lawsuits and such, and certainly not to the extreme that horsepower discussion went to.
     
  20. Andyw2100

    Andyw2100 Well-Known Member

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    You make a lot of great points as to why many P90D with Ludicrous owners won't be able to show first-hand experience that their cars don't meet the 10.9 second quarter mile specification. But many of those points you make would be the same reasons, I expect, that if any sort of legal action was started the affected owners should be able to point to proof already on record that the cars don't meet the specifications, rather than having each and every car involved have to show that it specifically doesn't meet the specification.

    Interestingly, there may soon be even more people interested in seeing this come to some sort of resolution, as Tesla is now selling the Ludicrous upgrade through Tesla Gear, the online Tesla store, for $10,000, and using the 10.9 second quarter mile time as a selling point.

    Ludicrous Upgrade P90D.jpg
     

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