how come no one talks about gas anxiety?

[wdolson]

Its important that we not conflate anxiety with annoyance.

Range anxiety is only a topic for non-EV drivers and EV noobs--all the rest of us have already gotten over range anxiety, so this entire thread is a waste of bandwidth. In any case, what's really important is being able to communicate to that audience in an understandable and non-threatening manner...to them. Even the term 'range anxiety' is new to many of them; trying to correlate that fear into an equivalent ICE emotion will leave them--at best--confused. Just as likely, they shut down and ignore you because you're some tree-hugger anti-ICE nut.

The fastest way to EV adoption is evangelizing positive aspects of EV ownership, not belittling via the negative aspects of ICE ownership.

There is a lot of annoyance as opposed to anxiety, but you haven't seen my SO when she's running late for an appointment with a client and she just remembered her car is running on fumes. Anyone who has even minimal skill at reading emotions would probably recognize anxiety.

But you do have a point, there is a meme out there among those who don't really understand EVs that they are both very short ranged, and they perform no better than golf carts. I saw something a few days ago where a conservative was trashing the "lib-tards" in general and referred to their gutless golf carts they want everyone to drive. It was a throw away line in a bigger rant about liberals in general. I don't recall where I saw it, I don't watch Fox News, but it may have been a clip from Fox shown somewhere else.

The ignorance about what EVs really can to is amazingly deep.

 

[AMPd]

I get that we hate ice cars but the “range anxiety” is non existent because there are gas stations with a few miles of where you are at all times. (Although I live in a heavily populated area)
Out of all the downsides of ice cars, their ability to refuel at anytime within a short distance of your location is not one of them.

 

[SSedan]

ICE are very inefficient to begin with, so if you drive hard and reduce efficiency further, you don't notice it as much as you do in an EV which has very high efficiency when driven in its optimum zone. Most ICE are about 20% efficient at their best and can drop to around 15 when driving hard. A good hybrid driven carefully might get 35%. An EV driven in the sweet spot is around 90% efficient, but unfortunately that is around 25 to 40 mph at constant speed. However driving 65 on the highway it can still be 70% or better.

Because the potential efficiency is so much higher for an EV, everything that hurts efficiency has more impact.

As for supercharging on the highway, the Tesla supercharger network was mostly laid out with the original S 60 in mind. The oldest superchargers are mostly spaced about 180 miles apart. A 60 can just make it between them if driven carefully even in cold conditions. A longer range, newer Tesla should be able to make it even driving hard.

I haven't been on a road trip since the fall of 2016, but I found I was having to charge when the car still had over 100 miles of range left because of the spacing of the superchargers. And I was keeping up with traffic on the highway and climbed the Siskyus doing 90 mph (the pass at the top is a little over 4000 ft). I did have the wind and elevation app open much of the time, and I did have the bad luck of bucking some headwinds going both south and north. I was a bit nervous at the start because it was the first time I was hitting more than one supercharger in a day and I planned everything, but I was a lot less concerned on the way back.

The newness of it still made it a bit of an adventure, but overall the anxiety level was pretty much null.



The low fuel light on my Buick became intermittent, but if it did start coming on, I knew it was about to start sucking sludge.

Bologna, fuel pump pickups are in the bottom of the tank, sludge would immediately and permanently plug injectors.
Now what can happen with ICE is the fuel level gauge can get inaccurate over time, but something like Techron fuel system cleaner can improve that. Tiny amounts of deposits on the sending unit affect the resistance of the fuel level sending unit.

Anyone who has range anxiety in an ICE wants to, gas stations are everywhere. Many people activity seek reasons to be a victim of stress.

My entire adult life I have comae across one place where there was no gas station for 40miles on the highway and it was well labeled. Between cities it is hard to find L2 chargers even that often and let's be honest a gas pump adds more range per minute than a L2 does in an hour.

EV are the future but the unreasonable manufactured "negatives" so many Tesla owners want to attribute to ICE cause people not to listen to you.

 

[nutts1]

I think maybe I've matured a bit since I've started driving my Tesla's. We occasionally take a road trip to Stamford CT which in my MS always required a bit of a charge up to get back home. This past weekend we took our new M3 for the first time and expected we could go round trip without the charge up. While in Stamford we made a quick trip out for dinner and so on the way home I'm doing the math and looks like I'll get home with right around 40 miles of range left. From experience I know that means about 30 miles in real life because I don't like to nurse my range. After the 3rd time doing the math I decided the anxiety wasn't worth it so I touched the supercharger icon on the map and popped into the one ten miles ahead. It took under ten minutes as I added 45 miles of range for $1.10. Got home at almost exactly the same time and no anxiety. I would have made it either way but much more pleasant with the stop.

 

[Motorolabizz]

If you really a cared about your car you'd know how many many miles you can travel on a tank of fuel. And no that doesn't mean relying on the dummy gas light.

My only annoying ICE thing is traveling 140+ miles a day knowing that I will have to stop on the way home or to work to fill up...every other day :-(

 

[McRat]

It's very simple:

1) Has anybody not purchased a car because the gas engine might run out of gas?
2) Has anybody not purchased a car because the EV battery might run out charge?

I'll vote. No on #1, yes on #2. We did not buy a Model S because it was to be my wife's car. She did not want a BEV due to remote charging limitations. She waited for the Cadillac CT6 PHEV, but it sucked, and bought the gas version.

We have never bought a car or truck and knew how much gas they held prior to purchase or were concerned about it.

 

[GatorGuy]

Anyone who has range anxiety in an ICE wants to, gas stations are everywhere. Many people activity seek reasons to be a victim of stress.

Exactly. If range anxiety with gas vehicles is a real thing, it's 100% self induced.

 

[bxr140]

There is a lot of annoyance as opposed to anxiety, but you haven't seen my SO when she's running late for an appointment with a client and she just remembered her car is running on fumes.

Lol, no doubt.

Now play that story in a non-EV environment and the overwhelming consensus will be that the offender was absent-minded or lazy, exhibited poor time management skills, or some combination therein. Play that same story but with an EV that wasn't plugged in overnight and the overwhelming consensus will be "yeah, that's what's wrong with EVs", "that's why you always need an ICE backup", etc.

The practical difference between those scenarios, of course, is that refilling the ICE is likely a 5 minute (or less) detour, whereas waiting for the EV to charge is straight up hopeless despair type anxiety.

The real concern I have is the pervasiveness of negativity when trying to elevate EVs over ICE. Its not easy for those of us evangelizing EVs to begin with; unwavering viewpoints like the OP's just make it that much harder for the rest of us to advance the adoption of EVs. Even more troubling are the people who support/like the OP's angle, because that indicates they're either adding to or reinforcing their own negative methods of approaching the EV vs ICE conversation.

Its a hard battle when you first have to get past your own side while trying to fight the good fight for EVs.

 

[FlyinLow]

If we could somehow start petitioning the local gas stations in our towns to put in one “pay-Charger” like Charge Point or CHAdeMO it would be a start.

Yeah, we are supposed to charge at home, but unplanned errands or trips in any EV (not just a Tesla) can be interesting. Apps like PlugShare and ChargeHub help, but what if I chose not to have a smart phone?

Transitioning to sustainable transport is not just about Tesla.

The “public” is coming to EVs, and after the 500,000 Model 3s get on the road the word will be out about Tesla too.

We still have an ICE for towing our box trailer. When I used to tow a 5th wheel camper trailer with a diesel range anxiety was a reality in some areas off the beaten path that didn’t have diesel. After almost getting stranded once I carried 10 gallons of diesel with me from then on as an emergency back up and used it several times traveling about the US.

 

[McRat]

Yes, not all places have diesel, not all are 24hr, and the distance between stations can be very high out west. Most folk carry 5+ gallons just in case.

 

[Altes]

because...gas stations

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

They don't talk about it because it simply doesn't exist.

Now we do talk about the advantages of electric over gas quite extensively.

Electric allows us to be lazy in that we don't have to go to the gas station before work. This is pretty much number one on why I wanted an electric car. My laziness is pretty epic.

Electric allows us to a lot of things guilt free. In a gas car I would always be a bit self-conscious of wasted idle time. Sure I could have got a modern German car that shut itself off at every stop light, but that would cause some anxiety. Actually it would probably annoy me so much that I'd turn it off.

Electric also allows us to keep our hands free of that gas smell.

Now there is one type of gas anxiety that some gas buyers will have. That anxiety is diesel anxiety. Where you have to take into consideration the future of diesel in various areas before getting an expensive diesel vehicle. I have that right now with the Winnebago Revel that I plan on buying. In the US I probably won't have much issue for the foreseeable future. But, I won't have as much freedom to take it everywhere like I'd really want. I so wish it was electric, but that won't happen for at least 5-10 years.

 

[wdolson]

Bologna, fuel pump pickups are in the bottom of the tank, sludge would immediately and permanently plug injectors.
Now what can happen with ICE is the fuel level gauge can get inaccurate over time, but something like Techron fuel system cleaner can improve that. Tiny amounts of deposits on the sending unit affect the resistance of the fuel level sending unit.

I never investigated the fuel system much on ICE cars. I never really cared all that much about cars at all. However, the service manager of the local shop where we took our cars took a special interest in my car and wanted to buy it. When we discussed the fuel issue I thought he said the fuel draw on that car was built into the float in the tank. Though that was more than 10 years ago so i may have misremembered.

 

[McRat]

I never investigated the fuel system much on ICE cars. I never really cared all that much about cars at all. However, the service manager of the local shop where we took our cars took a special interest in my car and wanted to buy it. When we discussed the fuel issue I thought he said the fuel draw on that car was built into the float in the tank. Though that was more than 10 years ago so i may have misremembered.

There are several different gasoline tank pickup designs today, but most have the fuel pump inside the tank and the pickup is surrounded by a mesh enclosure. Filters last a very long time today. Sometimes they are inside the tank. They are not considered a wear item anymore, they last the life of the car under normal conditions.

 

[ig_epower]

Exactly. If range anxiety with gas vehicles is a real thing, it's 100% self induced.

I can honestly say I have experienced gas range anxiety two times in the last 2 years and sure they are 100% self-induced but they were real anxieties that I wish I planned around:

1) Driving all night from Kentucky to Canada, we were faced with trying unsuccessfully gas station after gas station that would not accept my Canadian credit card (they asked for a zip code of which our Canadian postal code is invalid at the pumps). There were no human operators at the pump because it was in the middle of the night and in rural US, the stations seemed to be few and far between.
2) In Europe, I thought I would top up my rental car with gas before returning it at the airport and I ended up driving through village after village with no gas stations.

Sure, where I live, there are multiple stations at every corner but in some unfamiliar places it has turned out not to be the case.

In either case, EV's have reminded me to be better prepared whenever I go on a trip - a habit that I have carried over when occasionally driving an ICE vehicle.

 

[Jim R]

Gas Anxiety? No way! My Mercedes E250 gets 800 miles to a tank of diesel, so I can get a full day of driving without a fuel stop. OTOH, I may have a few adjustments to make after I get a Tesla.

 

[wdolson]

There are several different gasoline tank pickup designs today, but most have the fuel pump inside the tank and the pickup is surrounded by a mesh enclosure. Filters last a very long time today. Sometimes they are inside the tank. They are not considered a wear item anymore, they last the life of the car under normal conditions.

I recall the mechanic said the fuel pump and filter were in the tank. That car was a 1992.

 

[ucmndd]

Was thinking about this today and I realized I had the perfect illustrative scenario happen to me a couple weeks ago. I have a pretty long commute, use about 60% of the available state of charge each day I drive to work. I present you two scenarios:

ICE: hop in to leave in the morning and realize I don’t have enough gas to make it to work. Crap. Swing by gas station on the way out and get to work 15 minutes later than intended.

EV: get in car to leave in the morning and realize that my scheduled charge didn’t happen overnight because the newest 10.4 firmware update wedged my MCU sometime between when I parked and when my charge starts at midnight. 29% on the dial, which won’t even get me to the office. Nearest supercharger is a hundred miles away. Decision time. Do I wait 3+ hours to gain enough charge at home to make a round trip? Do I wait an hour to give me enough to go one way then drive across town to the nearest ChargePoint L2 charger at some point in the evening to charge for a couple hours before I head home? Do I just say “eff it” and skip the whole work day? Do I tell my wife tough cookies and take her ICE for the day whilse she sits at home with the dead car?

This is why “gas anxiety” isn’t a thing.

Don’t get me wrong - I love my car and wouldn’t trade it for anything. But I’m also honest about the compromises and trade offs. Trying to convince myself or others that a similar type of range anxiety or fuel sourcing issue with ICE cars exists as a serious problem to consider is just silly.

 

[Uncle Paul]

Gas anxiety is low because they are used to it.
If the tables were turned, and people were used to electric cars, and suddenly someone invented a gasoline powered car, the anxiety could be caused when they learned:
You need to add 20 gallons or so of highly flamable combustion fluid every couple hundred miles.
The gasoline will polute the air and cause thousands of people to get sick more often and die earlier.
It will produce Carbon Dioxide that will kill you in just a few minutes if you forget to open the garage door when it is running.
It will need 5 quarts of motor oil disposed of twice a year (25 times over the life of the car). Do not get the contaminated motor oil on your skin as it is cancer causing.
You cannot just throw the used oil away or you will be fined.
The fuel will cost 3X what you are used to paying for electric miles.
If everybody changes to the fuel cars the cities will become so polluted that breathing will be uncomfortable and difficult.
The gasoline is extremely flamable, and thousands of people will be burned to death every year.
If it leaks and catches fire in your garage your whole house may burn down.
The fuel will be heavily taxed.
Most of the fuel stock will come from foreign nations, damaging your countrys balance of trade and draining its treasury.
The fuel gauges will be very inaccurate. The first 1/4 tank will last for a long time, but when it gets down to the final 1/4 is will last far fewer miles.
The fuel will not be renewable. When it runs out all those cars will grind to a halt.
Instead of one smooth transmission you will need up to 10 gear changes every time you go from start to cruise. When you drop into drive or reverse your whole car will shake with a thunk.
One foot driving will be a thing of the past. You need to move your foot back and forth between the gas pedal and the brake every time you wish to go faster or slower.
No more autopilot. Not even a moments rest, even on the longest, most boring trips.

Bet people would have some anxiety then. The anxiety is caused more by fear of change than actual driving factors.

 

[Uncle Paul]

Was thinking about this today and I realized I had the perfect illustrative scenario happen to me a couple weeks ago. I have a pretty long commute, use about 60% of the available state of charge each day I drive to work. I present you two scenarios:

ICE: hop in to leave in the morning and realize I don’t have enough gas to make it to work. Crap. Swing by gas station on the way out and get to work 15 minutes later than intended.

EV: get in car to leave in the morning and realize that my scheduled charge didn’t happen overnight because the newest 10.4 firmware update wedged my MCU sometime between when I parked and when my charge starts at midnight. 29% on the dial, which won’t even get me to the office. Nearest supercharger is a hundred miles away. Decision time. Do I wait 3+ hours to gain enough charge at home to make a round trip? Do I wait an hour to give me enough to go one way then drive across town to the nearest ChargePoint L2 charger at some point in the evening to charge for a couple hours before I head home? Do I just say “eff it” and skip the whole work day? Do I tell my wife tough cookies and take her ICE for the day whilse she sits at home with the dead car?

This is why “gas anxiety” isn’t a thing.

Don’t get me wrong - I love my car and wouldn’t trade it for anything. But I’m also honest about the compromises and trade offs. Trying to convince myself or others that a similar type of range anxiety or fuel sourcing issue with ICE cars exists as a serious problem to consider is just silly.

Like with any car. If you wake up in the morning and realize you are having a problem (flat tire, dead battery, out of fuel etc) simply take the other car.

In your case you could simply have taken your Wife's car and plugged in your Tesla to give her enough range to do any running around she might need.