How do I know my car's max charging rate for Supercharging?

[ualdriver]

TMC Brain Trust-

I have a 2019 "Raven" Tesla Model S that I recently purchased. I'm reading about how Tesla is coming out with these new Supercharging stations with increased charging output, but how do I know the maximum theoretical charging input my car can accept? I realize charging input changes with battery temperature, and that it tapers off as the battery approaches higher rates of charge, etc., etc. I just want to know how much my car COULD theoretically take per the onboard hardware, and can this change in the future via over the air updates?

Unrelated question sort of......back when I was a new Tesla owner back in 2014, I was told that one shouldn't park right next to another Tesla charging at a Supercharger because then the two cars would have to "share" the output of that Supercharger. I think you were supposed to go to every other Supercharger if you could so each car could get the maximum output of the Supercharger. Is this still the case?

 

[GtiMart]

Yes, the maximum charging speed could change in a future update but has a maximum bound based on the installed hardware. I'm unsure what battery you have but you can look at this for some guidance: Tesla Supercharging - Summer 2019 Update

V2 superchargers have a shared maximum of 150kW between two stalls typically named A and B. Ideally you arrange to be alone on a cabinet so you don't share, to get maximum speed. V3 superchargers are 250kW and don't share, although there are other limitations (site, transformer etc).

 

[Twiglett]

The guideline for older superchargers was to leave a gap, this was because pairs of stalls shared a charger.
So you would start out with 120kW but is someone parked next to you and plugged in you would drop to half that.
The newer supercharger stalls don't have that problem. You can tell from the stall labelling - usually.
Older sites are labelled 1A, !B, 2A, 2B etc, newer ones are either 1,2,3,4 or 1A, 1B, 1C, 1D, 2A, 2B, 2C etc

I can't answer the charge rate for you car with any degree of confidence

[edit] to mention that your nav will also tell you what type of supercharger it is.
120/150kW=shared so leave a one stall gap
250kW=use any stall

 

[ucmndd]

Assuming your Raven is the long range 100kwh variety (there was briefly a standard range version) you could expect to see brief peaks around ~180kw under ideal conditions and low state of charge (~20%), dropping off quickly from there.

That's as fast as it gets, it's hardware limitation, so you shouldn't expect any improvements in the future.

 

[DerbyDave]

In May or June 2020, Tesla added larger wires and other hardware that allows the S to use the 250 KW full power. Older model S are capped below that because of hardware limitations in the car. My June 2020 accepts the max for awhile. I have a photo of it charging at 248KW and adding 1031 miles per hour of charge

 

[ZenRockGarden]

Assuming your Raven is the long range 100kwh variety (there was briefly a standard range version) you could expect to see brief peaks around ~180kw under ideal conditions and low state of charge (~20%), dropping off quickly from there.

That's as fast as it gets, it's hardware limitation, so you shouldn't expect any improvements in the future.

To be fair, 180 kw is a LOT of power. Like enough to power a typical suburban city block with 20 houses on it...

 

[ualdriver]

All through Derby Dave-

Thanks. Interesting article with the charging rates vs. battery state of charge. Didn't realize ROC peaked so early at 20%. I don't even know how large my battery is. I guess I'll have to look in my menus. I know I have a Raven because of the types of motors it has and when I charge it fully, I think it states around 280 miles of range? I never charge it more than 80% or so.

 

[ucmndd]

All through Derby Dave-

Thanks. Interesting article with the charging rates vs. battery state of charge. Didn't realize ROC peaked so early at 20%. I don't even know how large my battery is. I guess I'll have to look in my menus. I know I have a Raven because of the types of motors it has and when I charge it fully, I think it states around 280 miles of range? I never charge it more than 80% or so.

The "standard range" 2019 Model S was rated at 285 miles when new, so it sounds like that's what you have. The Long Range car had 370 miles.

In that case, you have a 75kwh battery. Those used to peak in the ~140kw range but these days with recent firmwares it seems to be more like 120kw.

 

[ualdriver]

The "standard range" 2019 Model S was rated at 285 miles when new, so it sounds like that's what you have. The Long Range car had 370 miles.

In that case, you have a 75kwh battery. Those used to peak in the ~140kw range but these days with recent firmwares it seems to be more like 120kw.

Yes, thanks. I definitely have the standard range. Didn't realize that was a 75kwh battery......a smaller battery than the S85 it replaced! So with 120-140kw, these new Supercharger upgrades don't really matter to me I guess.

Now just waiting for that CCS adapter.........

 

[brkaus]

Yes, thanks. I definitely have the standard range. Didn't realize that was a 75kwh battery......a smaller battery than the S85 it replaced! So with 120-140kw, these new Supercharger upgrades don't really matter to me I guess.

Now just waiting for that CCS adapter.........

They do help with the load sharing. So not a total waste - even for those of us with older cars.

 

[Rocky_H]

I was told that one shouldn't park right next to another Tesla charging at a Supercharger because then the two cars would have to "share" the output of that Supercharger. I think you were supposed to go to every other Supercharger if you could so each car could get the maximum output of the Supercharger. Is this still the case?

I notice you are getting a couple of responses that are reinforcing the incorrect part of this assumption. The paired stalls are NOT always next to each other. This depended on how the building contractor made the connections and placed the stalls. @Twiglett explained that it is determined by the naming of the labels on the stalls, which you really should look at.

Each number goes to one of the cabinets of the charging equipment, and the A and B are the two that share from that.

So at some sites, the contractor placed them in this order:
1A 2A 3A 4A 5A 1B 2B 3B 4B 5B
It's an order that still looks like it makes sense. But do you see how the paired ones of 1A 1B are several stalls apart? They are not always next to each other.

 

[DerbyDave]

So at some sites, the contractor placed them in this order:
1A 2A 3A 4A 5A 1B 2B 3B 4B 5B
It's an order that still looks like it makes sense. But do you see how the paired ones of 1A 1B are several stalls apart? They are not always next to each other.

I am amazed there isn't already a Tesla specified standard positioning of the shared pairs of Supercharging stalls. Maybe they need a little led on each stall to indicate if the stall is sharing or not, or a notification in the car and app. Most people will not be looking for this type of all A and all B setup. When someone pulls into sharing a stall I am connected to when a full power stall is available, I let them know we will be probably only getting 1/2 the power unless the stalls are V3. With future updates, every stall will likely get full power at some point.

 

[ucmndd]

I am amazed there isn't already a Tesla specified standard positioning of the shared pairs of Supercharging stalls. Maybe they need a little led on each stall to indicate if the stall is sharing or not, or a notification in the car and app. Most people will not be looking for this type of all A and all B setup. When someone pulls into sharing a stall I am connected to when a full power stall is available, I let them know we will be probably only getting 1/2 the power unless the stalls are V3. With future updates, every stall will likely get full power at some point.

Given Tesla isn’t building new v2 chargers at this point, I can’t imagine them spending time on any novel solutions for this.

 

[brkaus]

Given Tesla isn’t building new v2 chargers at this point, I can’t imagine them spending time on any novel solutions for this.

I figured it out. A humanoid robot standing at each Supercharger directing people to the correct stall . It was that or lasers...

 

[roblab]

To be fair, 180 kw is a LOT of power. Like enough to power a typical suburban city block with 20 houses on it...

Yeah, 180 kW is a bunch: It could fill my car in a half an hour. But as far as speed goes, my car sometimes charges near 500 kw when it first starts up on a low battery. So, big deal. The car uses what it needs.

 

[ucmndd]

But as far as speed goes, my car sometimes charges near 500 kw when it first starts up on a low battery.

No, it doesn't.

 

[GtiMart]

Probably a case of looking at the wrong place... 500 must be miles per hour. Would make more sense. It'S indeed impossible to get 500kW out of a 250kW max supercharger. Some people might have seen 253kW but clearly not 500.

 

[airborne spoon]

since there are a thousand variables in supercharging your best bet is to get the car down to 6-10% on a warm (not hot) day and navigate to the supercharger so the car will preheat the battery if necessary and when you plug in make a note of the speed in (kW not miles) and see how it starts and slows down.

That level SoC will get you the most accurate max speed, lower than 6% sometimes it doesn't max out the speed as its spooling up so if you start with it there it'll be most accurate.

For my car since the great nerfing of the 85 packs i still hit 128kW but its only for a split second before it drops and levels out closer to 100kW and the curve angle changed as well.

 

[Smileysam]

Wow the most I've seen on my second hand 75d is 60kw. I reckon it must have seen a lot of supercharging in the past.

 

[ucmndd]

Wow the most I've seen on my second hand 75d is 60kw. I reckon it must have seen a lot of supercharging in the past.

You should see about twice that max, regardless of any past DC charging frequency. Highest power of about 120kw in my observation happens at ~20% SoC with a very warm battery.