How Does Autopilot Sense "Hands on Wheel"?

[ohmman]

I just grip the wheel comfortably at the bottom, next to the spoke and let the wheel move my hand. I never get a nag.

However, there have been several occasions when the car has done something crazed, e.g. steering towards a truck in the lane to the right, when the movement of the wheel instantly alerted me and I pretty much instinctively twisted the wheel, both correcting the car and disabling autopilot.

IMHO, it is dangerous and irresponsible to not have a hand on the wheel. I also don't see what the point is.

I've thought before that there's probably some variance in the torque sensitivity, but your post really makes me think that's the case. I get the nag constantly, and I hold the wheel pretty tight and nearly always provide a little resistance. My wife does the same and we both get frequent nags. Maybe I'll call the SC, who has the car right now, and see if they can take a peek.

 

[Skione65]

I've thought before that there's probably some variance in the torque sensitivity, but your post really makes me think that's the case. I get the nag constantly, and I hold the wheel pretty tight and nearly always provide a little resistance. My wife does the same and we both get frequent nags. Maybe I'll call the SC, who has the car right now, and see if they can take a peek.

@ohmman,

I wonder if the torque sensitivity is adjustable by tesla or it's a fixed value. I'm sure it might be software adjustable but they won't do it to have different 'resistance' values on different vehicles. I can see them wanting the same 'values' on all cars for the data logging and history.

Ski

 

[mikeash]

Applied torque is going to depend on the roads you're on, too. I normally have no trouble with this, but a couple of weeks ago I drove to Ohio, and once I got out of the mountains the alarm kept going off. The road was straight as an arrow, and just holding the wheel wasn't providing any resistance since the wheel never turned. Moving to the side so I applied a little force with gravity solved it.

 

[RDoc]

I've thought before that there's probably some variance in the torque sensitivity, but your post really makes me think that's the case. I get the nag constantly, and I hold the wheel pretty tight and nearly always provide a little resistance. My wife does the same and we both get frequent nags. Maybe I'll call the SC, who has the car right now, and see if they can take a peek.

That's very interesting. When I grip the wheel, it's really just enough to feel comfortable, the way I'd hold onto a grab handle in a car. I don't think about it at all, nor do I consciously resist the wheel motion and I literally get no nags, ever. I do hold the wheel right next to the bottom spoke, so that may be what's causing enough torque for the sensor, but I never resist the wheel at all. I have a seat position setting that raises the seat back and moves a bit forward so my elbow is comfortably on my knee for long trips. That may also increase the resistance, but it's very comfortable, and my normal position which is quite far back works fine as well.

If you are getting nags, I think you're on to something with the torque sensing not being correct.

WRT Ohio, straight roads aren't a factor in New England.

 

[CHG-ON]

Torque. Plain and simple.

 

[Shinteetah]

I just arrived home after a 1300-mile run back, and I am pleased to report this thread greatly helped reduce my Autopilot nagging.

I just had to move my grip about a half-inch up on the wheel, to add more weight to my hand (elbow resting on my leg). This was enough for the torque sensor. Unfortunately, it's also slightly less comfortable than my natural position, but I guess we all have sacrifices to make ;-) and I can choose whether I want the nag or the slight fatigue.

Autopilot is great for long trips, saves a lot of fatigue, and it does improve overall alertness and reaction. (Behavior is my day job, and so when Autopilot was introduced to me I just thought, Yeah, decision fatigue, makes perfect sense!) But it's not a replacement for an active driver, definitely. But I do love it.

I've thought before that there's probably some variance in the torque sensitivity, but your post really makes me think that's the case. I get the nag constantly, and I hold the wheel pretty tight and nearly always provide a little resistance.

I wonder if this has anything to do with the steering "looseness" settings -- comfort, standard, sport? I'm using sport.

Thanks for all the aid here!

 

[RDoc]

Hmm. I also wear a fairly heavy watch.

 

[mikeash]

Put a heavy watch on the side of the steering wheel, never get nagged again. (Really, though, don't do this.)

 

[EVie'sDad]

If the car is alerting when you have a hand on the wheel, try adjusting your position a bit so that the weight of your hand pulls the wheel a bit. Rather than holding the bottom, hold the side, for example. This will apply some constant torque and make sure the car knows you're there.

I agree, positioning hands at ten and two o'clock seem to provide sufficient weight to keep the nag from occurring. This and it allows me to respond in the quickest fashion if need be in uncertain scenarios.

 

[PaymonVafa]

When I grab the wheel at "twelve o'clock" the sensor almost alway recognizes kme placing my hand I'm the wheel.

Even when I do this one handed.

 

[dcswinehart]

It detects your weight on the steering wheel, i.e. torque sensor.

1. When it gives you a warning "Hold steering wheel" just try and put a little pressure with your hands, not enough to disengage autopilot, but enough to get rid of the warning.
2. Also, if you hold the steering very lightly (i.e. full contact, but not putting any weight), it still gives you the "Hold steering wheel" message.

Autopilot when used properly is BETTER and SAFER than no autopilot. But it is also too easy to not use it properly and not understand it's limitations. So, I feel there is a true danger of Autopilot giving a false sense of security, and the driver may rely on autopilot without understanding it's limitations. Sadly there are plenty of idiots abusing autopilot, and I fear that they will ruin it for all of us.

Personally speaking, unless it's a more or less straight freeway, I don't let go of the steering wheel. And when when I do, I always keep my eyes on the road. But given that I am not doing the mundane task of watching the lines ahead of me, I feel my brain has more free cycles so I have more situational awareness of the idiots around me, which keeps me safer.

As far as I can tell, the software looks for a change in torque rather than the presence of it. I can go for a long time with an adequate (just short of the annoying unintended disengagement) torque that is constant, but still get the nag until I apply torque in the other direction, or at least release it and re-apply. We also have a Toyota RAV-4 with a wheel requirement, which actually appears to use some sort of squeeze sensing. This is overall a much more pleasant form of enforcement.

Has anyone noticed that the torque required to disengage seems smaller when the car slows or stops? Either that, or the FSD tends to move the wheel in odd ways at stops, leading to an over-ride. As many have noticed, this stuff is all much worse since the NHTSA-inspired recall that upped the nanniness.

 

[airborne spoon]

I had this same problem with a model 3 loaner. The only way to stop the AP nag warning is to put enough pressure on the wheel that it disabled AP because it thought I was trying to take over. Basically I couldn't use AP at all because it wasn't registering my hand torque on the wheel.

In my car I simply have the weight of my hand on it and it's good to go. I can also use my knee to apply torque to the wheel as well.