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How fast does 16kW destination charger charge?

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by 787steve, Sep 14, 2016.

  1. 787steve

    787steve Member

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    Picking up our new Model S 60 tomorrow! Planning first road trip to the Carolina coast next week. About 160 miles to destination. Could go by SuperCharger. But if we press through there are two destination chargers which look usable. One is 8kW, the other is 16kW. How long to recharge using those? I have so much to learn.
    As always, thanks in advance for the help.
     
  2. Benjamin Brooks

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    Do you have a 48A or upgraded 72A charger? Original Model S had 40A or 80A dual chargers.
    16kW is 80A max @ 208V (3-phase AC).
    16kW is about 48mph. But that assumes you can pull all 80A. If your onboard charger is slower, scale it down by (amps)/80*48mph (i.e. 29 mph for 48A)
     
  3. boonedocks

    boonedocks Member

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    240V X 80 Amps = 19kWh or 60 miles per hour charging.

    I routinely get 23ish-V X 79 Amps = 18 kW or 58 miles per hour of charging

    HOWEVER that is with dual chargers installed. If you have the upgraded 72amp single charger you will get the 16kWh 240 X 72 Amps = 17kW or about ~55 miles per hour....

    If you only have a 40Amp charger you will get about ~25 miles per hour
     
  4. Benjamin Brooks

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    Nope, that is wrong. 16kW destination chargers run on 208V, not the residential 240V. The 16kW is the max output, assuming 80A draw.
    So at 72A*208V = 15kW or ~45mph
     
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  5. 787steve

    787steve Member

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    Basic 48Amp charger. And if I use an 8kW charger, would it be half the 16kW rate, or is that too easy?
     
  6. TexasEV

    TexasEV Active Member

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    No, that is not necessarily wrong. It can run on either 208A or 240V, depending on what power is at the site.
     
  7. GSP

    GSP Member

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    Assuming a 208 V supply (most likely for a "16 kW" installation as Benjamin Brooks pointed out) you can charge at 208 V * 48 A = 10 kW, or about 30 miles per hour of charging.

    And yes, 8 kW would be half as fast, about 15 mph.

    GSP
     
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  8. Benjamin Brooks

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    If it was a 240V source they would advertise the 80A HPWC destination charger as 20kW, not 16kW.
     
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  9. gavine

    gavine Petrol Head turned EV Enthusiast

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    Right...AMPs and Volts matter for the math, but the answer is solved in kW. So, if they advertise 16kW, then that's the output, plain and simple. The easiest way to figure-out charge rate is to assume 10kW is about 30MPH (+/-). So 5kW is 15MPH, 20kW is 60MPH, etc. Quiz: If a Supercharger is putting-out 120kW, (and the car is accepting it) then what's the charge speed?

    Problem is, your car may not be able to charge at 16kW because of your on-board charger limitation.

    On my S60, my 240V/40A (9.6kW) UMC set-up at home gave me 29MPH. The first time I charged publicly at at HPWC, I figured I would also get 29MPH, but I was only getting 24MPH. I learned that it was because it was a 208V building and 208V x 40A is around 8kW so volts matters on HPWCs as they typcially don't advertise the kW....just Amps. That's a little confusing.

    The first couple of times you charge, you'll learn very quickly. The car will tell you how many volts and amps you're pulling as well as how many miles per hour rate of charge you're getting and how much time to finish charging to your set charge limit.
     
  10. mikeash

    mikeash Active Member

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    Unless it was running at 64A (for an 80A circuit, for example) and they rounded up. Far more likely that it's 208V at 80A, though, for sure.
     
  11. David_Cary

    David_Cary Member

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    The twice speed isn't actually that simple. 16 kw HPWC will be limited by your on board charger so won't be full speed. 8 kw will not be limited.

    Using Volts and Amps gets pretty confusing for the uninitiated.

    I like to keep it simple. You can charge at roughly 12 kw with your on board charger. So you will get 12 at the 16 and 8 at the 8. So not twice the speed. You should be getting 30+ at the 16 and 20 ish at the 8.

    Is this near Wrightsville? I wasn't aware that one was 8 and one was 16. Do note that there are 2 chargers at opposite ends of the parking lot but plugshare still makes it look like there are 3 chargers total.

    J1772 generally will charge at 16 mph. Because most in our area are 30A.

    Warsaw SC for 15 minutes to get something to drink and go to the bathroom is a nice option. I have a 70D, a house with 40A charging at Topsail and I still have stopped there twice in the 6 months it has been open. Once I went on a whim with very little charge to Wrightsville. The other time, I stayed in Durham the night before and parking was too crazy at DPAC to get to the plugs and I had forgot to set my charge point higher at work the day I left. I planned on getting a Chademo top off the morning I left but had technical issues.

    So Warsaw has been really helpful for me. I've used the Landfall destination charger - Memorial Day weekend. And I've overnighted in Wilmington garage with a J1772 - staying at the Riverfront.

    FWIW - The Nissan dealer has had a more reliable Chademo than downtown Apex. No dirty looks or comments when I used the dealer. Given the number of Chademo's in our area, I'd get the adapter. There are about 5 sheetz with them if you get desperate but options are nice to have
     
  12. mikeash

    mikeash Active Member

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    Saying that you'll get 12kW at the 16kW station is oversimplifying. The chargers are current limited, not (just?) power limited. It's likely the 16kW station is 80A at 208V or so. With the default charger on a new car, you'll max out at 48A at 208V, which is about 10kW. If you get the high amperage charger option, then you'll hit 72A at 208V or 15kW.
     
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  13. 787steve

    787steve Member

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    Is this near Wrightsville? I wasn't aware that one was 8 and one was 16. Do note that there are 2 chargers at opposite ends of the parking lot but plugshare still makes it look like there are 3 chargers total.

    J1772 generally will charge at 16 mph. Because most in our area are 30A.

    Warsaw SC for 15 minutes to get something to drink and go to the bathroom is a nice option. I have a 70D, a house with 40A charging at Topsail and I still have stopped there twice in the 6 months it has been open. Once I went on a whim with very little charge to Wrightsville. The other time, I stayed in Durham the night before and parking was too crazy at DPAC to get to the plugs and I had forgot to set my charge point higher at work the day I left. I planned on getting a Chademo top off the morning I left but had technical issues.

    So Warsaw has been really helpful for me. I've used the Landfall destination charger - Memorial Day weekend. And I've overnighted in Wilmington garage with a J1772 - staying at the Riverfront.

    FWIW - The Nissan dealer has had a more reliable Chademo than downtown Apex. No dirty looks or comments when I used the dealer. Given the number of Chademo's in our area, I'd get the adapter. There are about 5 sheetz with them if you get desperate but options are nice to have[/QUOTE]

    Thanks for the info, David. I am Cary, also. We were looking at heading to the beach. I saw a B&B in New Bern with an 8 and a 16, and a few others around the area as well. Might make a run that way in the next week or two. Still learning the systems. My wife is a bit intimidated by all the features. I keep telling her to forget about all that and just drive it like any other car till she is ready to grow her knowledge base. In fact, she hasn't driven it yet! Gotta get her going.

    Drive Safe,
    Steve
     

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