Have you tried calling the main line and get ahold of someone live? I had the same problem and was fortunate to get someone who was able to help me get the info PGE needed right away.
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How long between inspection and PTO? [various areas]
- Thread starter niner93
- Start date
I pretty much called PG&E and Tesla every 3 days or so until it was approved. I received conflicting information from both, so can be very frustrating. PG&E had excuses, Tesla had excuses, eventually was approved after a couple months. In my case, Tesla sent all the docs, PG&E claimed things were missing... Spoke with a manager at PG&E, who eventually did find all the documents they needed... Ultimately though, even after that conversation PG&E & Tesla still lagged. It took about 3 months total from installation to approval.
Lol I think Qlin says the 3 line diagram is already in there. I think PG&E just found a new way to screw with a homeowner by asking for both.
I wonder what will happen if the 1 line diagram isn’t printed on 11x17” paper…
I interpreted what he said is that the three line diagram is in the design package Tesla left with him after the install. No indication of what if anything Tesla sent to PG&E.
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
People need to insist on not making the final payment until AFTER PTO. That's how we do business. Seems crazy to me to pay in full for a system that's not technically complete yet.
I wonder what will happen after NEM3.0 is finalized and now PG&E has all these PTOs to review/approve looking at the calendar.
This was posted in the tax thread, but Tesla's standard practice is to request payment after the system passes inspection.
Some owners seemed to have paid a down payment after inspection, with full payment after PTO.
But I agree, the Solar industry in general asks for payment after a successful PTO. Tesla is kind of taking a shortcut compared to others by asking for money before PTO.
Not sure if this is a Tesla thing, but almost all of the independent installers I think I compared expect final payment after inspection, but before PTO. Maybe it's because of delays like this. I suppose you can just try to find another installer that won't, but if every installer is like this and they are already massively backed up with jobs, that means you aren't getting your solar done at all.
Supply/demand I guess.
I wonder what will happen after NEM3.0 is finalized and now PG&E has all these PTOs to review/approve looking at the calendar.
Well if you review some of the NEM 3.0 proposals, it is possible that after NEM 3.0 rooftop solar will cost a homeowner more money than if they didn't have solar. So PG&E delaying PTO is just saving the homeowner money!
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
It would be interesting to see the response if a customer insisted on amending the contract to the final payment being after PTO. It's generally only a month later unless the installer screws up.
Oh happy day! Got PTO yesterday evening!
Timeline:
5/25 Panels + Powerwall ordered
6/25 Permitted
8/25 Installed
8/30 Inspected
9/02 Paid for
9/13 PTO application started
11/2 PTO granted
I guess a little more than 5 months from "its time to go solar" to generating power isn't too bad? 6 weeks for PTO, mostly because I didn't call Tesla and PG&E every week until week 4, asking where things were stuck.
Timeline:
5/25 Panels + Powerwall ordered
6/25 Permitted
8/25 Installed
8/30 Inspected
9/02 Paid for
9/13 PTO application started
11/2 PTO granted
I guess a little more than 5 months from "its time to go solar" to generating power isn't too bad? 6 weeks for PTO, mostly because I didn't call Tesla and PG&E every week until week 4, asking where things were stuck.
We paid our nominal system deposit (1/2020) and signed our contract (2/2020) and had our install (8/2020-9/2020) and received PTO/PGE (10/30/2020). Our contract back in early 2020 was 1/2 contract price paid on first day of install and balance after PTO.
Some of the following may be out of order but this all happened prior to day of install for us. There was an initial design; revised design; contract and various paperwork prepared; several hours with our advisor by phone answering our questions on contract, our needs and procedure going forward; a 3-line drawing along with entire plan done (multi-pages if you never saw a copy); they submitted permit to city along with plan and fees paid on our behalf and got approved; we added another PW before install so revised drawings had to be done; city said they needed them to submit an additional permit just for the 3rd PW and wouldn’t revise our original permit so more fees required to be paid on our behalf. Scheduling department called with install date; their warehouse team pulled together necessary equipment required for the job and solar and PW teams (5-6; 3) were dispatched. Somewhere along the line staff was working with PG&E with paperwork and fees.
Install date we paid 1st payment. Teams arrived for install in several vehicles; were there over several days; a change was made to the solar panel layout which had to be approved in ofc and a revision to plans done for final submission to city; they set up inspection and Tesla guy arrived to meet and go over system with inspector. Passed. They submitted paperwork including single-line drawing to PG&E and paid any remaining fee due. Took PG&E almost 30 days to send us email we had PTO approved.
Up until this point based on our contract Tesla had laid out a lot money on our behalf to cover various employees time, plans, various permits, our solar panels, PWs and related system equipment. We also had one guy come out to repair a severed outdoor light fixture wire that happened during solar install and bring out breakers still needed (during covid several breakers needed were sold out everywhere and we needed to wait til inventory came in), and there was the drywall guy who spent several hours repairing drywall as some of our existing equipment on our interior garage wall needed to be moved for our install. All done before inspection could happen.
After getting PTO we called Tesla and made our final payment. I’m under the impression Tesla changed up scheduled payment requirements sometime after we signed. Instead requiring a larger deposit but no payment until install was done and before PTO would be submitted. If so that’s quite a lot of work and materials and fees laid out in advance. I can see why they would require payment before PTO so they were assured of getting paid. We thought our contract was fair at 50/50, but “a single payment prior to PTO” requires Tesla to layout a considerable amount of money for a longer period of time whereas you hold on to your money longer. We’ve had several construction projects done at our house and all had a partial upfront payment and then scheduled progress payments required. No idea how other solar/PW companies set up their payments but I don’t think prior to PTO sounds unfair given you’ve had inspection and know you’ve passed at that point.
Some of the following may be out of order but this all happened prior to day of install for us. There was an initial design; revised design; contract and various paperwork prepared; several hours with our advisor by phone answering our questions on contract, our needs and procedure going forward; a 3-line drawing along with entire plan done (multi-pages if you never saw a copy); they submitted permit to city along with plan and fees paid on our behalf and got approved; we added another PW before install so revised drawings had to be done; city said they needed them to submit an additional permit just for the 3rd PW and wouldn’t revise our original permit so more fees required to be paid on our behalf. Scheduling department called with install date; their warehouse team pulled together necessary equipment required for the job and solar and PW teams (5-6; 3) were dispatched. Somewhere along the line staff was working with PG&E with paperwork and fees.
Install date we paid 1st payment. Teams arrived for install in several vehicles; were there over several days; a change was made to the solar panel layout which had to be approved in ofc and a revision to plans done for final submission to city; they set up inspection and Tesla guy arrived to meet and go over system with inspector. Passed. They submitted paperwork including single-line drawing to PG&E and paid any remaining fee due. Took PG&E almost 30 days to send us email we had PTO approved.
Up until this point based on our contract Tesla had laid out a lot money on our behalf to cover various employees time, plans, various permits, our solar panels, PWs and related system equipment. We also had one guy come out to repair a severed outdoor light fixture wire that happened during solar install and bring out breakers still needed (during covid several breakers needed were sold out everywhere and we needed to wait til inventory came in), and there was the drywall guy who spent several hours repairing drywall as some of our existing equipment on our interior garage wall needed to be moved for our install. All done before inspection could happen.
After getting PTO we called Tesla and made our final payment. I’m under the impression Tesla changed up scheduled payment requirements sometime after we signed. Instead requiring a larger deposit but no payment until install was done and before PTO would be submitted. If so that’s quite a lot of work and materials and fees laid out in advance. I can see why they would require payment before PTO so they were assured of getting paid. We thought our contract was fair at 50/50, but “a single payment prior to PTO” requires Tesla to layout a considerable amount of money for a longer period of time whereas you hold on to your money longer. We’ve had several construction projects done at our house and all had a partial upfront payment and then scheduled progress payments required. No idea how other solar/PW companies set up their payments but I don’t think prior to PTO sounds unfair given you’ve had inspection and know you’ve passed at that point.
At the time we ordered our system, Tesla installs had seen a surge in installs in the SF Bay area due to the Paradise fire and the occurring PSPSs that made us decide to sign up. Tesla installs were booked out months in advance and PWs were in short supply. Couldn’t make them fast enough for existing orders.
Then covid hit in 3/2020 and threw city’s building depts. into uncertainty. Work crews were impacted and office jobs went from centralized offices to WFH in many areas. PWs are in even more demand after the Texas ice storm and other areas impacted by bad weather and power outages. And still people are working from home.
Tesla Energy has expanded into other states and it seems there’s a worker shortage everywhere along with supply line disruption. I was talking to a small business owner last week and he had a big job at this guys large property and had a large crew out there with him. The homeowner tested positive the next day and subsequently so did a number of his crew, some in not great shape. Put his whole team out of work basically. Some people here have had really long waits on their installs and PTO and do feel for you. I would not be happy either. It seemed like ours took a long time as well. Stuff sucks right now getting anything done and I think people’s patience in general is wearing thin.
Then covid hit in 3/2020 and threw city’s building depts. into uncertainty. Work crews were impacted and office jobs went from centralized offices to WFH in many areas. PWs are in even more demand after the Texas ice storm and other areas impacted by bad weather and power outages. And still people are working from home.
Tesla Energy has expanded into other states and it seems there’s a worker shortage everywhere along with supply line disruption. I was talking to a small business owner last week and he had a big job at this guys large property and had a large crew out there with him. The homeowner tested positive the next day and subsequently so did a number of his crew, some in not great shape. Put his whole team out of work basically. Some people here have had really long waits on their installs and PTO and do feel for you. I would not be happy either. It seemed like ours took a long time as well. Stuff sucks right now getting anything done and I think people’s patience in general is wearing thin.
I think the payment schedule you had makes a lot more sense -- basically installments after certain milestones, with final payment only after PTO. From my experience, that's how payments to contractors generally work for home construction projects -- final payment is made at the time the project is 100% complete, not 95% complete. Imagine if you were building a home and had to make full payment to the builder before the windows and doors are installed but everything else is done, and the builder specifically says he won't install windows and doors if you don't make full payment now. This is essentially what Tesla is doing and is shady biz practice at best and likely violates consumer protections laws/regulations. It's all about incentives and there is simply zero incentive for Tesla to finish a project once full payment is made, especially since there appears to be zero repercussions to not finishing a project. A large class action lawsuit or a large fine from the FTC is probably needed to fix Tesla's shady practices.
My installation, inspection and payment were completed on 7/16 and I still don't have PTO.
ahkahn
Active Member
That's where I'm sitting right now. Installed 2 weeks ago, but have not yet paid. Oddly enough, I cannot even pay it when I log in - still has me on a couple steps back. They text me every so often to pay, and I've texted them back with no response. Oh well... I'm in no rush if they're in no rush!
Yes, I would agree with paying 50% after passing installation inspection and the remaining 50% after getting PTO. But now in their purchase contract, they want full 100% within 5 days after inspection. This is terrible for customer who has no leverage against Tesla if the PTO is being dragged for months. That's why some people have suggested to get loan instead even they can afford to pay cash....
My Solar Roof has passed inspection in early Sept, but is still waiting for PG&E to approve the Backup Switch install. I refused to pay Tesla and pointed out to them that their "5-day after final inspection" clause is illegal in California. CA Law prohibits contractors from collecting full payment until the work on the project in complete. I went back & forth with a few people in their billing department, but finally their billing supervisor agreed to allow me to delay payment until the back up switch has been installed.
Tesla completely screwed up the paperwork submission to PG&E (multiple times) causing 6 weeks of delays. It seems to be correct now and I'll likely have the Back Up Switch install and PTO at the same time.
So if you live in California, I'd push back on their payment terms.
