How much would you pay for Supercharging on Model 3?

[MP3Mike]

Extra for a DC pass through? haha that's funny

It isn't just a straight pass-through especially on a Tesla where the DC shares the same pins/wiring as the AC charging input.

On the Model S 60 Tesla charges $1,900 to enabled the DC fast charging hardware, if you haven't paid for Supercharging, so you can use CHAdeMO. Obviously Nissan and GM charge extra for it too.

 

[JeffK]

It isn't just a straight pass-through especially on a Tesla where the DC shares the same pins/wiring as the AC charging input.

On the Model S 60 Tesla charges $1,900 to enabled the DC fast charging hardware, if you haven't paid for Supercharging, so you can use CHAdeMO. Obviously Nissan and GM charge extra for it too.

You mean of course $1900 to enable hardware already present in the vehicle. The money goes toward the supercharging network or whatever else Tesla wants.

You can take it to the bank that the car did not leave the Tesla Factory at a loss simply hoping you'd purchase the upgrade so they could break even. You had already paid for the hardware in the base cost of the vehicle.

 

[MP3Mike]

You can take it to the bank that the car did not leave the Tesla Factory at a loss simply hoping you'd purchase the upgrade so they could break even. You had already paid for the hardware in the base cost of the vehicle.

No they determined that it was easier, and cheaper, to put it in every car by default than to put it in some and not others when most cars were paying for it to be activated.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Extra for a DC pass through? haha that's funny

This gives me so much deja vu, I just wanted to link back to the similar discussion in the other thread about how much DC charging costs to support:
Solution to charge your Model 3 if you don't have any garage?

 

[JeffK]

Fun quote from the Tesla charge rate optimization patent:

In some scenarios, it is possible that user 120 could be charged based upon some tiered pricing structure for use of high-performance charging (e.g., fee based upon charging measured in miles/minute or kWh/minute or the like). For charging scenarios where user 120 does not require the highest-priced charging rate, automatic use of a lower priced, slower charge rate advantages user 120, particularly for an economical mode secondary consideration. Implementations of the present invention may be adapted for different sets of secondary considerations.

 

[CmdrThor]

Extra for a DC pass through? haha that's funny

Why is that funny? I have a 2015 Nissan LEAF that has no DC charging capability. I chose that LEAF though because it saved me ~$1500 because with Model X as our primary road trip vehicle I'd have zero need for DC charging the LEAF. If we replace the LEAF with Model 3 (pretty good chance of that), I will still have zero need for DC charging our 2nd vehicle. I'd like to stay as close to the $35k base price as possible as Model 3 would just be a commuter car for us.

 

[JeffK]

Why is that funny? I have a 2015 Nissan LEAF that has no DC charging capability. I chose that LEAF though because it saved me ~$1500 because with Model X as our primary road trip vehicle I'd have zero need for DC charging the LEAF. If we replace the LEAF with Model 3 (pretty good chance of that), I will still have zero need for DC charging our 2nd vehicle. I'd like to stay as close to the $35k base price as possible as Model 3 would just be a commuter car for us.

If I'm not mistaken for DC charging on the leaf, it's an entirely separate port they'd have to install hence the cost. Internally every leaf already supports DC charging (as batteries are DC and the inverter converts AC to DC, this is true of all EVs). The Tesla models as far as I know have one port and it's already installed so it's included in the base price. Providing a DC pass through was a very smart move on Tesla's part and voltage can be regulated with inexpensive electronics.

 

[Topher]

Or for your computer example, think of it as a statement like, "32GB RAM capacity", but only comes with 4GB.

Which would be a valid analogy IF it said supercharging capable. It doesn't (and Elon didn't) it says "supercharging (standard)"

Thank you kindly.

 

[DarylLafferty]

My biggest concern is not the cost of charging, but the availability of a charger in Quartzsite, Arizona when I'm on my way from Phoenix to LA. If the deal is lifetime charging, then nothing will prevent people from connecting their car, and going to eat a leisurely lunch, waiting till their battery tops off. I'll arrive and find 10 cars ahead of me waiting for a hookup.

Even if the deal is charge per kWh, the charging rate get much slower as the battery fills, so sitting in the restaurant for an extra half hour won't cost much extra, and again there is little incentive to hurry back.

I think the rate has to include a time penalty; either charge strictly by time, or charge by the kWh but have a growing penalty for staying longer than 1/2 hour (or whatever is appropriate).

 

[4SUPER9]

There will never, ever, be a charge per kWh. Too complicated to manage, and a violation of the law in enough states to make it too inconvenient.

My guess is either one, or all, the following:

1. Lifetime option
2. Yearly option
3. Per use option (controlled by the app and paid for through iTunes, or something)

 

[EVNow]

Extra for a DC pass through? haha that's funny

In software - the same codebase may be distributed and premium features cost extra. Why is that any different ?

 

[JeffK]

In software - the same codebase may be distributed and premium features cost extra. Why is that any different ?

That's apples and oranges we're speaking of the cost to manufacture not the price it's sold for. Some posters believe the hardware cost to enable fast DC charging is expensive for manufacturers, whereas I disagree wholeheartedly and believe it's super cheap compared to the prices it's being offered to customers. People are justifying the price of supercharging based on the car's hardware but I believe the money goes toward the supercharging network and other costs not to pay for hardware in the vehicle itself.
The hardware in the vehicle itself will always be included in the price of the vehicle.

Other companies like Nissan are practically price gouging for their fast DC CHAdeMO charging ports and last time I checked they don't have a supercharging network.

 

[stopcrazypp]

That's apples and oranges we're speaking of the cost to manufacture not the price it's sold for. Some posters believe the hardware cost to enable fast DC charging is expensive for manufacturers, whereas I disagree wholeheartedly and believe it's super cheap compared to the prices it's being offered to customers. People are justifying the price of supercharging based on the car's hardware but I believe the money goes toward the supercharging network and other costs not to pay for hardware in the vehicle itself.
The hardware in the vehicle itself will always be included in the price of the vehicle.

Other companies like Nissan are practically price gouging for their fast DC CHAdeMO charging ports and last time I checked they don't have a supercharging network.

No one is saying the prices they charge is directly the cost. That would be naive (automakers have to make a margin on options). However, the push back is on your ridiculous assumption that it costs only $50 to implement DC charging. Specifically, my point was that an allocation of $750 to the hardware activation (margins included) out of a $2000 supercharger option price is a reasonable assumption given that is how much other automakers charge for their hardware only option. Whether or not they included the hardware already is irrelevant to this.

 

[EV-lutioin]

How about free Model 3 supercharging for Model S and Model X owners? Since MS and MX owners helped finance the Model 3... it's only fair

 

[trm2]

Supercharging needs to be free if you are more than 50 miles from home (where you charge most/ where your car spends most of its time) or if your last charge was at a SC within a few hours, indicating you were indeed on a road trip. That should take care of overcrowding from local use.

 

[timk225]

The only local supercharger is 20 miles away. I doubt I'd go there very often. I'm hoping they build more superchargers closer to me. Is there any map or build schedule showing where new planned ones will be?

I'd prefer to not pay anything up front and pay a SMALL fee, like $3 to $5, each time I actually use a supercharger.

 

[nexsuperne101]

£25 per use, as it would be here in the UK works out at about 12p per mile. That's the equivalent of driving a petrol car with 42MPG. For how small the UK is, I might use that option once a year, and TBH, an Ecotricity Chademo Rapid charger, when they start charging for the service, will possibly be the cheaper option.

 

[4SUPER9]

Supercharging needs to be free if you are more than 50 miles from home (where you charge most/ where your car spends most of its time) or if your last charge was at a SC within a few hours, indicating you were indeed on a road trip. That should take care of overcrowding from local use.

The only local supercharger is 20 miles away. I doubt I'd go there very often. I'm hoping they build more superchargers closer to me. Is there any map or build schedule showing where new planned ones will be?

I'd prefer to not pay anything up front and pay a SMALL fee, like $3 to $5, each time I actually use a supercharger.

I still do not understand any of these suggestions. Why would any company give their services away for free, or for a drastically subsidized price? This reeks of the millennial mentality. This second suggestion would particularly prove to be problematic, as almost everyone would choose this option. $3 to $5, what a joke. Who wouldn't want that? No more home charging needed! No, it would have to be closer to $50, like filling a tank of gas. Maybe a little less. For the 20 times I use a SC a year, $50 a charge would be $1,000/year.. Maybe that would be too much, and I would opt for lifetime. If it was as low as $25, it would be a no-brainer for me, but probably not for someone who travels a lot and uses the SC network regularly. $5?? No way will we ever see that!

 

[timk225]

I still do not understand any of these suggestions. Why would any company give their services away for free, or for a drastically subsidized price?

Because....... 'Merica ?


Let's math it out.

What is the up front fee for supercharging? $2000? Now, if I were able to pay $5 each time I used a supercharger on my base Model 3, I think it'd be safe to assume that on average, of the 215 mile rated range, I'd be around 150 miles, sometimes more, sometimes less, between charges.

So $5 per charge, times 400 charges = the $2000, and 400 charges at an average of 150 miles per = 60,000 miles, or in my case, about 3 years of driving.

The cost of fueling an electric car HAS to be far far less than any gas car, even a 50 mpg one, otherwise, what's the point and benefit of getting an electric car? I don't care about the environment.

So you see, after 3 years, Tesla still gets their $2000 and then MORE, from the remaining years of the car's life. Win for Tesla to charge me $5 per supercharge than a 1 time fee of $2000.

 

[xav-]

I think tesla will have to figure out a different type of supercharging network for the 3. People with the model 3 will be far more likely to abuse super chargers than the model S. Many people will depend on it.

I think they are going to have to come up with a profit based system involving themselves (providing super chargers) and third parties such as shopping malls and private and public parkings and. Pay per use. Electricity will be sold a significant premium to utility rates. Third parties will have to make real money on this. So I think something like $20 for half an hour of supercharging or something like that.

For the end user that will still be cheaper than paying for gas. For third parties that will be a great way to make money. Such places would explode in popularity and appear all over the place very quickly.