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Discussion in 'Model 3' started by ToolMan, May 20, 2016.
So far everyone agrees with you.
You would have to ask the automakers like Mercedes and BMW and the like why they believe it would work best as they have deployed it.
I'm totally against AR anyway. Outside of some instruments being regulated by government....I don't see the real need. I've never needed to know what my RPM's were, however tons of cars have this feature now. I can hear if the RPM's are high or low.
HUD? I currently have HUD as an option and I never turn it on because it's pretty much useless for me. Its a huge distraction.
BTW - I'm not a mainstream person - which means I'm not swayed by the opinions of "everyone". There are tons of folks here commenting on HUD primarily because they haven't tried to use it day-in and day-out. A new toy is attractive until it gets old. HUD is old for me. I've used it and its not worth the extra funding and research that automakers are putting into it.
If HUD cost more than $300 to manufacture into a car...please reduce my car by $300 and keep your HUD. Its not worth it to me.
Thanks for the suggestion!
Ahh, I think I see the problem. You're thinking that AR is displaying the information that is normally found on the dash in the HUD. That's not it at all, that's just a normal HUD. A normal HUD would be something relatively simple like speed, direction, maybe remaining range and if cruise control/autopilot is active.
Augmented reality would add more information to the HUD, a map overlaying the road showing you your route and the next turn. Maybe it would highlight traffic signs as you pass by them like speed limit signs, at night it could identify things that are out range of your headlights, maybe a deer approaching the road.
That's why I said it wouldn't make any sense to have it anywhere but integrated into the HUD. It would be pointless to tell me I just passed a reduced speed limit sign by flashing a message somewhere that I'm not looking. It would counterintuitive to have me have to look away from the road to watch what that deer is going to do.
Now you're just being silly, just because millions of people didn't die in a fiery accident on their way to work doesn't mean it can't still be safer.
"Hey, it works, and that's the way we've always done it" is not a valid design consideration. No, most of us didn't complain about having to change the volume using the knob, but only because they have no choice. On the other hand, my wife's car has the volume controls on the steering wheel so she can make adjustments without having to look away - which is much safer. The same with any of your other examples. And the same as it would be with a HUD, whether it has AR or not.
Is a HUD a M3 feature?
Nothing is a M3 feature yet. The M3 hasn't been revealed.
Please don't pull out single sentenced from what I say. My response that you posted is from another conversation.
It's all speculation so we don't know for sure. But there is plenty of evidence that suggests there will be.
Its not silly at all.
There is a notion in this thread that looking down is risky. I disagree.
You have my explanation totally backwards.
I said earlier and I'll say it again. HUD is a display. That's all it is. heads-up- DISPLAY. Its simple.
AR is an application. Its an application that acquires data from an input and processes it to either display its processed data on a screen or a windshield or a cellphone or tablet or whatever.
Again, here is a 2018 BMW with AR and NO HUD.
BMW Augmented Reality - Bing video
AR is an application that controls a program that does stuff.
NOW here is an AR system with HUD. That HUD system is distracting to me. I have hit pothole after pothole in my car because HUD gets in the way of seeing the actual street. The HUD included in this video is totally distracting and in the way.
Augmented Reality Mercedes - Bing video
If a person is distracted by something in their car (phone), then an HUD isn't going to help. Most people aren't looking at their phones while driving in order to find out how fast they are going. If a person that is veering off the road while driving is obviously not looking through the windshield in the first place. HUD isn't going to help with that because HUD is displayed where the person should be looking.
I think there is a very common misconception about HUD and AR. As Garlan Garner says, they are two completely separate technologies. Both have been around for a while (HUD much more so than AR). What would be revolutionary is that if Tesla were to combine the two into one seamless system in the M3...or the S or X for that matter. That has not been done on a large scale, that I am aware of, in a mass production car to this point. The Continental system seems to be the speculative favorite among many M3 enthusiasts although the Panasonic system is also intriguing. Both have videos on YouTube you can search.
As with anything, people will have very different opinions on any new technology. Personally, I look forward to using the system. No doubt it will take some getting used to. What bothers me about having to look down to operate controls or monitor systems in the car is the constant change of focal distance. Having it all in the lign of sight is appealing to me...at least in theory. The other thing I like about this type of system is that it would be completely personally configurable to the drivers taste with as little or as much information displayed as would be desired. Sort of a best of all worlds type thing.
Of course until we see the final product all of this is just speculation anyway. We'll see what Tesla has in store for us soon enough...after all, we've waited this long. What's another couple of months?
Here is what Panasonic is doing.
Remember too, this is Tesla's partner in battery technology and the Gigafactory.
The BMW video is not an example of augmented reality... Bing is really bad at searching so it totally ignored the word "reality"
Augmented reality (AR) is a live direct or indirect view of a physical, real-world environment whose elements are augmented (or supplemented) by computer-generated sensory input such as sound, video, graphics or GPS data.
Everything looked well thought out. Steering wheel controls seem to match second reveal. Night vision AR could be called assisted night vision, which people need to varying degrees. I know people whose performance drops really fast when it gets a little dark.
I hope the model 3 has an option for assisted night vision.
This video also may add another reason why the model 3 positions the driver forward in the car. The subtended angle or whatever. The AR value of the HUD improves as field of view widens. The cost and weight of the HUD is smaller the closer the last piece of glass gets to your eyes (think google glass if that helps).
Sorry, I assumed you didn't know what an AR system did because you mentioned it displaying information normally found on the dash like RPMs and other instrument readouts.
No, no it isn't. Read the definition that JeffK posted above. AR takes the existing reality and augments (adds) to it. It's that simple.
In most cases the goal of an AR system is to add information that the person viewing it can use, that's why it only makes sense to incorporate it with a HUD since the driver would already be looking at it anyway and then you can just keep your eyes forward all the time and see the real road, the HUD info, and the AR information. Without a HUD you have to watch the road, check the dashboard periodically, and then look at whatever the AR is being displayed on. How could that possibly be safer?
If you don't like the HUD, with or without AR, then hopefully there is way to turn it off for you. Otherwise, if you find it too distracting, maybe this won't be the car for you.
I don't care about a definition. I know what AR is and does. I program AR applications for a living. I'm fully aware of the differences between AR and a display. I work on a system identical to the Amazon Echo for another application. That is AR using voice only....NO Display. I'm programing a camera to recognize pictures of 2D objects placed at different angles to derive the what the 3D object is. That's AR. No Hud or display necessary.
HUD is actually 2 different things mixed together. Kinda like a laptop. You have a CPU and an OS that do the work and display it on a screen. The whole contraption is called a laptop.
HUD is specifically a display. That's it. The problem is that some folks ( companies ) have added a CPU and an OS and an application and still call it HUD.
Then AR comes along and folks want to smash AR into the Definition of HUD where it does not belong.
Your posts indicated otherwise. I'll stop trying to explain it to you.
Quote my entire post.. I explained it below.
If you are ever in Chicago....look me up...I'll show real AR to you. Walking Robots that can define 3D objects based on pictures alone.
Robots that can recognize gestures in real time. Such as the common hello wave or a fist bump hello and either wave back or ball up their fists for a return fist bump. That's AR.
We should not start mixing technology such as that into a common definition of HUD. Someone needs to inform Webster if that's where you guys got the definition from.