I am posting this in every youtube Tesla topic I come across: Range loss, charge gate etc

[Matt L]

If this was because of battery fires, why wasn’t there a recall? That’s clearly a safety issue.

It is being done to run out the clock on warranties.

Maybe it was and now it’s not a safety issue.

I would bet that they haven’t taken away anything that was promised. I would also bet, these complaints are coming from people that expect Tesla to continue providing them additional software features they didn’t pay for.

 

[iRia]

I am not imagining my charge rate being slowed.

My battery was replaced in late 2018 (December) so I do not have an old battery. I was able to charge at over 115kW well into the 20s. I hardly supercharge, but occasionally I drive out of town and I have to. But most of my charging is to 80-90% on Level 2. I rarely let it dip below the 40s except when road tripping. This is exactly what Tesla said I could do.

Then lo and behold after a firmware update I am lucky if I can get 90kW in the teens SoC and in the 20s it quickly goes down to the 70s.

My car is also running the coolant pump from 72% and up.

I have never had this happen before firmware updates.

You say Tesla can do what it wants to protect the battery? What if they decided that they should limit your battery to 70% of capacity and only allow you to trickle charge? You know, because they want to prolong the life of the battery...

It's not that they did this, is that they haven't come clean about what is actually going on at all. Nobody knows why they've done this. And yes, they have done it.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

I'm amazed they're people that follow this forum rather regularly, and haven't heard the complaints of older Model S owners with capacity issues or battery charging issues.

I'm not sure if it's just selective listening, or refusal to have empathy for others.

You don't really even need to have empathy for others as it impacts all of us that supercharge. It does because it increases the time they spend at a supercharger. Some of them are complaining of double the time due to updates within the last year.

We also haven't heard anything official from Tesla on whether this really solves the fire risk or not.

It's also being investigated by the NHTSA.
Tesla's software update that resulted in battery capacity loss is under probe by NHTSA - Electrek

So it's not something we can deny.

As to a tantrum? We're well past the fact gathering phase on this. We know there is a problem, and if impacted people make noise then so be it. They're entitled to it because they're the victim.

 

[eye.surgeon]

There are two types of people regarding the chargegate / batterygate issue, those that have been affected and care a great deal (myself included) or those that don't care but will a victim at some point and will then care.

 

[Zodiacchris]

And then there is a third category of people, those who have been affected and don’t get aggravated or see themselves as victims. It’s new technology and some hicups could be expected. My 2016 70D has 58Kw left and it’s still the best car I ever had, better than the 911 or the Jaguar XKR...

 

[Spacey73]

If you bought a six cylinder engine car and Audio engineers came overnight and took one of those away you would not be happy.

You can't just move the goal post and constantly advertise super duper charging rates only to halve them (I now get between 30kw and 60kw charging rate on S85) on a 4 year old car. If it was gradual I would accept it, but 30 miles was taken overnight and charging now takes twice as long as before... this was not the car I bought.

Regen is now pointless below 10Deg C regardless of how much battery charge, again this was not the car I signed up for.

If Tesla have messed up on the batteries then fine, but at least explain your position and maybe fix it. Charging someone $k to uncork their software limited S60 to S75 only then to take it away after an update is not defendable.

I welcome the reaction to safety if something is wrong, but that is not the fault of the consumer, when your model 3's have the same thing happen after 3 to 5 years I doubt some of you will be defending the right to come and take 10 to 20% of performance away from you overnight in a forced update!

 

[glide]

Maybe it was and now it’s not a safety issue.

I would bet that they haven’t taken away anything that was promised. I would also bet, these complaints are coming from people that expect Tesla to continue providing them additional software features they didn’t pay for.

You would be wrong on both counts

 

[pettittd]

Two things:

1. Are the deniers really owners? Company spin doctors seems more plausible. They seem to use the same phrase “sell the car”, which is right up there with its “within spec”. Classic sales “broken record” technique. Suspect a millennial troll is more likely.
2. Why did 3 VP’s of corporate law resign in 2019?

Bottomline given Tesla’s perceived future growth, none of those VPs would have jumped off the rocket unless something bad was about to hit. They literally left millions of personal dollars on the table. Ask any friends in the legal profession the only time you would do this is if you thought your life was going to become a living hell of litigation.

 

[trm2]

I would also bet, these complaints are coming from people that expect Tesla to continue providing them additional software features they didn’t pay for.

What about those of us that simply want what we purchased and don’t even want games and the other crap that they are pushing? Right now, I can go sit in any car, truck, suv, sit on a motorcycle, whatever and watch Netflix, play games and surf the web, I have an iPad and can download a free fart app.

All of these games and crap are really just a diversion from them not being able to produce what they sold.


(Now I’ll see how disagrees I can get)

 

[BAven8068]

View attachment 495173 If you bought a six cylinder engine car and Audio engineers came overnight and took one of those away you would not be happy.

You can't just move the goal post and constantly advertise super duper charging rates only to halve them (I now get between 30kw and 60kw charging rate on S85) on a 4 year old car. If it was gradual I would accept it, but 30 miles was taken overnight and charging now takes twice as long as before... this was not the car I bought.

Regen is now pointless below 10Deg C regardless of how much battery charge, again this was not the car I signed up for.

If Tesla have messed up on the batteries then fine, but at least explain your position and maybe fix it. Charging someone $k to uncork their software limited S60 to S75 only then to take it away after an update is not defendable.

I welcome the reaction to safety if something is wrong, but that is not the fault of the consumer, when your model 3's have the same thing happen after 3 to 5 years I doubt some of you will be defending the right to come and take 10 to 20% of performance away from you overnight in a forced update!

2017 MX 75D 45,000 miles

Maybe posting pictures like ours of these sudden range/performance grabs from software will open the eyes of all the deniers and defenders who haven’t had it happen... yet, because trust me it’s coming.

Honestly all I want from Tesla is an explanation, it’s insulting when we report concerns and all they have for us is canned responses of “within spec”. I want to know if it’s only certain cars and if so which ones and why. Is it something that I caused by charging habits? Was it due to safety issues? Is anything being done right now with newer cars to prevent this? Because if I’m going to buy another Tesla down the road I need to know these things.

Love both of the cars I have, but this makes buying any other in the future very concerning.

Also to any Model 3 owners who might be thinking the Model 3 pack is immune to these issues with its newer design, think again because it’s happening to Mid Range pack owners also, including my Mid Range... a sudden over night 8% grab at only 15,000 miles and 1 year in.

Range on midrange reduced to 219 miles

 

[AmpedRealtor]

The Tesla apologists should probably rethink their responses here. This issue is the subject of a class action lawsuit and NHTSA review. This subject is also the topic of a multi-hundred page thread in this forum as well as these articles:

Tesla owner lawsuit claims software update fraudulently cut battery capacity

Tesla’s disappearing miles: Owners say automatic software fix has had unwanted side effects

https://ww.electrek.co/2019/08/08/tesla-owner-range-slashed-software-update-class-action-lawsuit/

Tesla faces lawsuit over software that cut range from some cars

UPDATE: Class Action Suit Cites 19 Issues With Tesla Software Update

https://www.washingtonpost.com/tech...fficials-probe-alleged-tesla-battery-defects/

To the Koolaid drinkers here, this will eventually impact you. When it does, you won't be happy and you'll be just as pissed as the OP and thousands of other owners. When you are sh*tting your pants we won't make fun of you or insult you.

 

[fbitz777]

View attachment 495220
2017 MX 75D 45,000 miles

My 2017 MX with similar mileage showed a gradual degradation to 222mi over 2 yers and then a sudden drop (after June update) to 214mi

You are doing better than me! (I did a lot of supercharging though)

 

[Matt L]

View attachment 495220
2017 MX 75D 45,000 miles

Maybe posting pictures like ours of these sudden range/performance grabs from software will open the eyes of all the deniers and defenders who haven’t had it happen... yet, because trust me it’s coming.

Honestly all I want from Tesla is an explanation, it’s insulting when we report concerns and all they have for us is canned responses of “within spec”. I want to know if it’s only certain cars and if so which ones and why. Is it something that I caused by charging habits? Was it due to safety issues? Is anything being done right now with newer cars to prevent this? Because if I’m going to buy another Tesla down the road I need to know these things.

Love both of the cars I have, but this makes buying any other in the future very concerning.

Also to any Model 3 owners who might be thinking the Model 3 pack is immune to these issues with its newer design, think again because it’s happening to Mid Range pack owners also, including my Mid Range... a sudden over night 8% grab at only 15,000 miles and 1 year in.

Range on midrange reduced to 219 miles

So you lost 15 miles of range over 46k miles? W

The Tesla apologists should probably rethink their responses here. This issue is the subject of a class action lawsuit and NHTSA review. This subject is also the topic of a multi-hundred page thread in this forum as well as these articles:

Tesla owner lawsuit claims software update fraudulently cut battery capacity

Tesla’s disappearing miles: Owners say automatic software fix has had unwanted side effects

https://ww.electrek.co/2019/08/08/tesla-owner-range-slashed-software-update-class-action-lawsuit/

Tesla faces lawsuit over software that cut range from some cars

UPDATE: Class Action Suit Cites 19 Issues With Tesla Software Update

https://www.washingtonpost.com/tech...fficials-probe-alleged-tesla-battery-defects/

To the Koolaid drinkers here, this will eventually impact you. When it does, you won't be happy and you'll be just as pissed as the OP and thousands of other owners. When you are sh*tting your pants we won't make fun of you or insult you.

are you “sh*tting your pants” over 15 miles?

 

[glide]

So you lost 15 miles of range over 46k miles? W

are you “sh*tting your pants” over 15 miles?

If you buy a car with 259 miles of range and they “take” 15 miles from you, that’s 6.6% of your battery.

When you paid $130,000 for the car, how would that make you feel? Then imagine, on top of that they cut your supercharging speeds by over 50% making it impossible to take the car on road trips. Then imagine the company just shrugs their shoulders when you ask them about what’s going on.

After being an early adopter, trusting them, and betting on them to succeed with $130K of your money, you would be an idiot to continue doing business with them.

I can’t wait for Model 3 owners with $35K cars to start shitting their pants over losing .1 second on their 0-60 times.

 

[Matt L]

If you buy a car with 259 miles of range and they “take” 15 miles from you, that’s 6.6% of your battery.

When you paid $130,000 for the car, how would that make you feel? Then imagine, on top of that they cut your supercharging speeds by over 50% making it impossible to take the car on road trips. Then imagine the company just shrugs their shoulders when you ask them about what’s going on.

After being an early adopter, trusting them, and betting on them to succeed with $130K of your money, you would be an idiot to continue doing business with them.

I can’t wait for Model 3 owners with $35K cars to start shitting their pants over losing .1 second on their 0-60 times.

At what point did you expect to lose 15 miles of range?

people crap themselves all the time for everything.

 

[Spacey73]

At what point did you expect to lose 15 miles of range?

people crap themselves all the time for everything.

Seriously, you can not understand the concern of having no control over what the over the air updates can do overnight without you saying yes or no?

Overnight 50% of charging speed taken
Overnight Regen reduced to pointless
Overnight up to 30 miles on S85 range taken

People have paid thousands for the 60 to 75kwh upgrade only to have it taken away.

If there is a safety issue then I get it and applaud it, but compensation needs to be applied as we do not have the vehicles we bought.

All of us understand gradual degradation, I build hi power 18650 packs for motocross bikes so I get it.... but if you messed up and are either trying to stop them burning or get them past the warranty by severely limiting them then that's not the deal we made when the money was handed over on the promise of super duper range and charging.....

No one said..."in a few years we will take a large percentage of your range and charging ability"

So sit smug and happy in your new Model 3's whilst the Model S and X's that cost up to 3 times more take a rather large hit for the team.

Cheers for the backup and understanding!

 

[Chopr147]

I love Tesla!
I love my Model S! 2016 75D
I love the company and even Elon is Da Man!

But my head is not so far up my rear not to notice, somethings going on when my supercharge times slow and range is lowered or less than just battery degradation. I have probably hit maybe 50 or so superchargers in 3 plus years. I noticed when the time started to extend longer. It's real.

 

[webbah]

These blog posts show some great data points on the batteries for all cars and charge rates. Worth a read:

Tesla Supercharging - Summer 2019 Update

Faster Tesla Supercharging - How does it actually perform?

Tesla should do better to communicate however they are most likely doing this to prolong battery life as they learn and gather more data themselves.

 

[Bet TSLA]

Hee hee. Another one of these threads. Sure, it's a thing for some people. I keep seeing claims it's happening or going to happen to everybody, but I don't see any numbers. So how many people have documented "capping" and "slow charging"? Is it 5? 50? 500? 5000? 50,000?

And no, so far as I know there's no NHTSA investigation. At the moment it's at the "We've had complaints of 'whompy wheels' and we're deciding if there's enough there to open an investigation." stage of things. The only difference is that this time somebody got a lawyer to stir things up.

Yes, there are clearly some problems for some people (not many, not most, but possibly more than a few), and Tesla is not communicating well. This bad communication thing is something everybody has noticed is a particular problem of Tesla's. But the level of mania and paranoia is pretty intense among some on the TMC forums.

 

[Sherlo]

My 2017 MX with similar mileage showed a gradual degradation to 222mi over 2 yers and then a sudden drop (after June update) to 214mi

You are doing better than me! (I did a lot of supercharging though)

Yeah, I found it impressive how steady it was until the drop. But understand the concern nevertheless