I can no longer, in good conscience, recommend Tesla vehicles.

[Unclepaul]

I can totally understand the OP's point. His 8 year old Model S has been far from trouble free, and once out of warranty the repairs can be especially painful. Buyers were hopeful that their cars would be essentially repair free, because there are so many less moving parts in the EV drivetrain.

Looks like that has been the case for this owner as well. But what has caused most of the issues is from parts having little to do with the Tesla EV goodness. Most of the failures have been in accessories like 12v battery, door handles, air conditioner and some latches. The fact that he bought this car used, and inherited the problems of the previous owner as will as his own. While buying used saves money, it also carries the burden of more risk of repairs. No way to know for sure the history and maintenance of that used purchase. Perhaps the cost of out of warranty repairs is still less than would have been the cost of buying it new.

For the most part the Tesla part of the car has been relatively reliable, but the parts that Tesla outsourced to build the body have not held up well in the challenging British Columbia climate.

Many owners have shown much better reliability, but of course someone has to draw the short straw and have more than normal issues with their cars. See the same thing with people claiming they bought lemons from all the other manufacturers as will. Look at forums for most any manufacturer, from Mercedes, Ferrari, Ford, GM, etc. They all have owners pulling their hair out dealing with issues with their vehicles as well.

Only normal that people experiencing the best car they have ever owned in their life would be defensive is seeing such a negative post.

 

[rjpjnk]

I agree. I love my Model Y and think it is easily the best car I’ve ever owned, but it’s only 4 months old. Only time will tell how it holds up.

My last car (Prius) was nearly trouble free for 250k miles. I’ve had similar experiences with Honda and Subaru. Would it be unreasonable to expect a Tesla to be as reliable as these Japanese makes?

 

[motownflip]

I have a new plaid and I would not recommend holding on to this car for a long period of time. It hasn’t fully worked since day 2.

 

[Takumi]

I agree. I love my Model Y and think it is easily the best car I’ve ever owned, but it’s only 4 months old. Only time will tell how it holds up.

My last car (Prius) was nearly trouble free for 250k miles. I’ve had similar experiences with Honda and Subaru. Would it be unreasonable to expect a Tesla to be as reliable as these Japanese makes?

This topic has been discussed a lot (competition is coming).

Speed, Cost, Reliability. Pick 2

Please tell me which make & model to pick over the Tesla used or new.

 

[Takumi]

I have a new plaid and I would not recommend holding on to this car for a long period of time. It hasn’t fully worked since day 2.

What would you recommend instead?

 

[IronCoffee_Max]

I’ve owned 2 BMWs. My mom one. My first Beemer was in the shop at least 4-5 times the first year. Sold it after warranty ended. Every year I owned it it was in the shop for major parts. The suspension had to be replaced twice. Many parts were replaced 2 or 3 times. Don’t forget the special BMW battery. Second BMW was fantastic until it was 5 years old. $10k worth of stuff to fix. Sold it and bought a Tesla M3.

My mom‘s BMW lasted 10 years with no issues at all. She now has a Tesla MS. My sister has had 2 Mercedes and Ive never seen so many repairs.

I have owned an Audi that normal rain water would leak into the footwell after just 2 months. Ive also owned vehicles that have never had a single issue like my Toyota Highlander for 7 years.

OP had a bad experience. It happens. Let’s not crap on a whole brand because of that.

 

[InternetDude]

I feel for ya. I owned a 2015 for 5 years (one out of warranty), and a 2018 P100D. Would not recommend a Tesla to anyone anymore after my experiences. Seeing the Plaid forum shows me they still have poor quality today with the S anyway.

 

[miked112]

This is a painful thread to write. I've been a huge booster of Tesla. I've been an investor at times. I've only ever really had one possession goal: a Tesla EV. I believe in the company's mission, and the impact they have had on the industry has been very positive. Several friends have bought EVs on my recommendation.

But after owning a 2014 MS for the past three years, I can no longer recommend this company.

The issue is reliability. I've had to replace the following components. Many of these just in the last couple months:

- The AC compressor
- The AC compressor again, plus two other AC-related components (I declined this repair as I suspect it was misdiagnosed)
- Two door handles
- The trunk latch
- The entire MCU
- All four calipers plus the parking brake (and they nearly rusted over again after just over a year. Thankfully got them cleaned in time)
- The parking brake again (which had been replaced just one year earlier) (bricked the car. $300 to tow)
- The 4-way valve for battery coolant
- The windshield washer fluid pump
(edit: forgot this one) - Replacement 12 V battery
- And today, the PTC heater (bricked the car. $300 to tow)

It's one thing to replace components. All cars have that. But to replace *the same component just over a year later* is ridiculous. I don't even want to sum up the cost of all the repairs above. And every time, it's a drawn out, complicated process to get answers from the service centre via the app. With no ability to just call them, it drastically complicates the process.

I can't do it anymore. I want to stay electric, and will have to look at more reliable options from other manufacturers.

I'm posting this thread because I do not want to see Tesla fail as a company. They are too important. I understand build quality has gotten better over time, but they need to do a better job taking care of early adopters who are stuck with cars that are now racking up annual repair bills in the five figures.

If replacing the same part in a car multiple times seems unusual to you have obviously never driven a BMW.

 

[AMPd]

I wouldn't say that they completely burnt early adapters. Free Supercharging, free connectivity and if you would have bought your car directly from Tesla you could have gotten a 4 year 50K mile warranty from the date you bought it. This was on my order page in 2019 when I bought my 2016:

View attachment 737034

Do you know of any company that freely supports a 7 year old item, especially a vehicle?

Edit: I've always wondered about swapping out everything but the cup holder on my car, do I still keep free supercharging?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1403960366703337476

Freely supports? I’d hardly call performing warranty work as freely supports.

 

[pabla]

I’ve owned 2 BMWs. My mom one. My first Beemer was in the shop at least 4-5 times the first year. Sold it after warranty ended. Every year I owned it it was in the shop for major parts. The suspension had to be replaced twice. Many parts were replaced 2 or 3 times. Don’t forget the special BMW battery. Second BMW was fantastic until it was 5 years old. $10k worth of stuff to fix. Sold it and bought a Tesla M3.

My mom‘s BMW lasted 10 years with no issues at all. She now has a Tesla MS. My sister has had 2 Mercedes and Ive never seen so many repairs.

I have owned an Audi that normal rain water would leak into the footwell after just 2 months. Ive also owned vehicles that have never had a single issue like my Toyota Highlander for 7 years.

OP had a bad experience. It happens. Let’s not crap on a whole brand because of that.

but you've owned 2 teslas for a little over a year ish while owners here are chiming in (including myself) who have owned multiple over a longer period of time.

FYI the 5 Audis I have owned have never had nearly as many issues as both my Model S'

 

[ucmndd]

IMO, they are burning early adopters. There needs to be much better support for people who took the leap of faith early on.

Meh, I find this entitlement that “early adopters” think they’re owed to be pretty indignant.

Let’s cut right to the chase, you bought an early production car from a brand new car company - used - at a significant discount. That car is now 7+ years old. Do you really think you’d be much better off having bought a used 2014 BMW or Mercedes? I have my doubts.

Some of what you describe above is just bad luck. Some of it, I agree, is probably misdiagnosis. Some of it is the well-known trouble spots in the early production cars. The blow would be softened for a lot of it if there were more third party repair options available - and please don’t interpret anything I’m saying as a defense of Tesla’s dismal service organization. But I think the “early adopter” entitlement, frankly, is a bunch of BS. I mean, you’re not even an early adopter. You bought a 4 year old early production used car from a niche company and now you’re confused that it’s not exactly achieving Toyota levels of reliability? And that Tesla seemingly owes you something to compensate for that? Come on.

 

[JPInnovative]

This is a painful thread to write. I've been a huge booster of Tesla. I've been an investor at times. I've only ever really had one possession goal: a Tesla EV. I believe in the company's mission, and the impact they have had on the industry has been very positive. Several friends have bought EVs on my recommendation.

But after owning a 2014 MS for the past three years, I can no longer recommend this company.

The issue is reliability. I've had to replace the following components. Many of these just in the last couple months:

- The AC compressor
- The AC compressor again, plus two other AC-related components (I declined this repair as I suspect it was misdiagnosed)
- Two door handles
- The trunk latch
- The entire MCU
- All four calipers plus the parking brake (and they nearly rusted over again after just over a year. Thankfully got them cleaned in time)
- The parking brake again (which had been replaced just one year earlier) (bricked the car. $300 to tow)
- The 4-way valve for battery coolant
- The windshield washer fluid pump
(edit: forgot this one) - Replacement 12 V battery
- And today, the PTC heater (bricked the car. $300 to tow)

It's one thing to replace components. All cars have that. But to replace *the same component just over a year later* is ridiculous. I don't even want to sum up the cost of all the repairs above. And every time, it's a drawn out, complicated process to get answers from the service centre via the app. With no ability to just call them, it drastically complicates the process.

I can't do it anymore. I want to stay electric, and will have to look at more reliable options from other manufacturers.

I'm posting this thread because I do not want to see Tesla fail as a company. They are too important. I understand build quality has gotten better over time, but they need to do a better job taking care of early adopters who are stuck with cars that are now racking up annual repair bills in the five figures.

Reminds me of my 2017 Nissan Altima when the wheel bearings had to be replaced like several times, transmission blew out on me, junked the car and ordered a model s long range.
I will tell you something thats teslas fault and ANY car manufacturer should learn from their mistakes. Tesla is not all there with their reliability BUT i will bite the bullet on it

 

[JPInnovative]

I can totally understand the OP's point. His 8 year old Model S has been far from trouble free, and once out of warranty the repairs can be especially painful. Buyers were hopeful that their cars would be essentially repair free, because there are so many less moving parts in the EV drivetrain.

Looks like that has been the case for this owner as well. But what has caused most of the issues is from parts having little to do with the Tesla EV goodness. Most of the failures have been in accessories like 12v battery, door handles, air conditioner and some latches. The fact that he bought this car used, and inherited the problems of the previous owner as will as his own. While buying used saves money, it also carries the burden of more risk of repairs. No way to know for sure the history and maintenance of that used purchase. Perhaps the cost of out of warranty repairs is still less than would have been the cost of buying it new.

For the most part the Tesla part of the car has been relatively reliable, but the parts that Tesla outsourced to build the body have not held up well in the challenging British Columbia climate.

Many owners have shown much better reliability, but of course someone has to draw the short straw and have more than normal issues with their cars. See the same thing with people claiming they bought lemons from all the other manufacturers as will. Look at forums for most any manufacturer, from Mercedes, Ferrari, Ford, GM, etc. They all have owners pulling their hair out dealing with issues with their vehicles as well.

Only normal that people experiencing the best car they have ever owned in their life would be defensive is seeing such a negative post.

This is why I didn’t listen to people around me “oh you’re young just get a used model s and save money.” Yeah no. I’m glad I didn’t listen to those people and decided to go new. OP definitely got screwed from Tesla with their out of warranty repairs.

 

[Draketurner]

Yeah I’m with you, Tesla isn’t exactly winning any reliability awards. People can definitely debate exactly what metrics CR uses (and some stuff like fit and finish, rattles etc is silly to include in reliability) but that stuff alone didn’t land them in 27th place. My MY LR died (completely) the night I got it home and I returned it (when you still could) and got a MYP which had its own slew of issues over the 8 months I owned it.

 

[SO16]

I wouldn’t buy anything older than a 2016 refresh at this point. Anything older seems like early adopter status to me. Especially with the battery changes. I have a Jan 2017 that has been practically flawless after 71k miles other than a 12v battery replacement fairly early on. We shall see how it goes.

 

[SO16]

I have a new plaid and I would not recommend holding on to this car for a long period of time. It hasn’t fully worked since day 2.

If people are super concerned about reliability over being an early adopter, I would think it is best to wait at least for a year of full production before buying to get the kinks out. The new S/X is significantly different.

 

[livingthedream]

The OP's feelings are understandable, and on some days I have felt the same way! Dumping unexpected $$ into a car sucks.

After having a brand new 2016 MS 90D for 2 years, we realized that owning a MS past warranty probably would not be the best decision. So, we ordered a M3LR in 2018 because of the mechanical door handles, technology updates, and overall impression the car would be more reliable for less money while being just as fun to drive.

Our early M3LR (serial < 10k) went through several charge doors, a 12v battery, and both front control arms under warranty. Then, after warranty expired, the car wouldn't charge at all. Beyond frustrating was the $1200 tow (nearest SC 200 miles away) and $1700 PSC replacement. I wanted to dump the car that day and buy something else! But, I cooled off and regained my perspective... there is nothing else like it.

Then our heater stopped working, nearly $1000 to replace that. The service scheduling system was a nightmare. Had to drive to local SC and hope a real person could help. They did! Yes, Tesla service scheduling and execution SUCKS in a lot of ways, but their model is sound... focus on making cars better so they don't need service, rather than making them last just past warranty to make more money from their inadequacies.

No other car drives and performs like a Tesla, but if we wanted to get close it would be a German brand, mid-line or better. Interestingly, the leads at my last SC visit mentioned they came from each of the top 2 German brands. They suggested a comparable repair would have been at least double if not quadruple the cost. And, although they had seen some unfortunate repair bills for earlier '13-15 MS, there has not been the same kind of constant repairs required after 100K miles, a common trend with those other brands. In most cases a Tesla repair improved the original part. On average, they saw no indication that people should dump their Tesla after 100K due to excessive repair bills, but suggested the other brands you better sell before 100K or budget a few thousand $$ per year for inevitable repairs. This makes me feel thankful for owning a Tesla more than frustrated with the issues.

Even with their issues, most people SHOULD DEFINITELY BUY A TESLA. Anything can break. Early runs of a new model are more likely to have problems. Use this knowledge when deciding what year/model to purchase. Driving the best cars based on cutting edge technology requires patience. Bleeding edge will bite you once in a while. Those than cannot tolerate this should NOT buy [especially older] Tesla. Remember, Tesla is not a car company, it's a technology company that makes cars. Focus on the big picture. Jump on the bandwagon if/when it makes sense for you. Different people have different KPI for their satisfaction. If reliability is the main thing that matters to you, enjoy your Japanese/Korean ICE car for now. I will keep driving Tesla until something better comes along, if that happens.

I will not avoid Tesla because of the negatives, but I will wait until at least serial 50K before my Cybertruck order, and any other new models that come out. I will not buy serial < 20K again. In the meantime, I just ordered a new M3P, and hope it has fewer issues than the '18. I plan to keep this car "forever" because I know in the long run the pleasure to cost ratio will be better than anything else I can buy. And with CT delayed, hopefully I can get it paid off before pulling the trigger on that. We can sell the M3LR for almost what we paid, and I will have a clear conscience knowing the new owners won't have to worry about the heater or PCS because they have already been updated with better versions.

Good luck OP with your endeavor finding a non-Tesla replacement that you enjoy as much as your MS. Sad to hear it didn't work out for you. I would probably dump that car too. Thank goodness we all have freedom of choice -- mine would be to get a newer M3 that incorporates many lessons-learned since 2014, not encourage people to give up on a brand because you got a lemon. But, that's you're choice too.

 

[montanaco]

If replacing the same part in a car multiple times seems unusual to you have obviously never driven a BMW.

I bought a 2018 BMW 430i GC a year ago, haven’t had a single issue and we’re at 42k miles. My friend has bought two teslas brand new and has had multiple issues and poor build quality. German cars will last as long as you take care of them properly. Teslas often come with issues, which is unacceptable.

I don’t really have skin in the game, but we’ve seen multiple threads on this forum of brand new plaid model S being bricked within a few days of ownership. That’s just insane for a flagship car. Tesla has come a long way in quality but still has a very long road ahead to catch up to legacy automakers.

 

[Dukeybootie]

2015 85D owned since new, currently at 139,000 miles. I am more meticulous about car maintenance than most, but thought I would add another data point to consider.

Service/repair items:
-scheduled service x4 including suspension torque, total $2809.33
-scroll wheel + driver door handle repair $315.05
-MCU eMMC upgrade fully reimbursed
-headlight bulb replacement x2 $518.17
-Ohmmu 12V install $550.47
-bumper louver repair $269.90
-rear hatch cinch actuator replace $201.43

Total $4664.25 which I find reasonable for a 6 year old car from a new automaker with this kind of mileage. My guess is most other cars with an MSRP > $75k from 2015 and over 100k miles would have required a lot more than $4700 worth of service and repairs by now.

As far as Tesla service, I have had one lousy experience at the service center but the rest were very good to excellent, including all the mobile service visits.

Do I look at what else is available out there? All the time. But nothing else will take me from 0-60 in around 4 seconds, get 250 miles of (rated) range, and allow me to roll in and out of any Supercharger for free.

Not speaking for anyone besides myself, but consider me a satisfied customer who plans to keep this car as long as it will perform the way it does. $800 average maintenance cost per year is reasonable in my book.

PS for all the ICE comparisons, that would add $4000-5000 per year in gas with my mileage, compared to the $0 I have paid thanks to solar/PW/supercharging this whole time.

 

[rjpjnk]

This topic has been discussed a lot (competition is coming).

Speed, Cost, Reliability. Pick 2

Please tell me which make & model to pick over the Tesla used or new.

I think this is the problem. No competition yet. Yes, we are early adopters and paying more to try stuff that is not mainstream yet.

I enjoy the speed of my Tesla but I don't need it. I would choose low price and high reliability from this list. But still, there is really no other EV to consider, even if we don't require the awesome acceleration.

So to answer your question, if you want an EV there currently is no make and model to pick over Tesla.

If, however, EV is not essential and you primarily want reliability and reasonable cost your choices are limited to an ICE car or a hybrid such as Prius Prime.

I do love my Model Y, but I kind of expect that by 150K miles it will be probably be costing a lot in repairs. I accept this because the only other option is not to buy into the EV market yet.