I don’t understand the obsession with FSD.

[run-the-joules]

You are one shy of the full deal... As humans we like to own stuff, like a car. But in reality robotaxis will eventually be a public utility like your ISP. And it will be cheaper than owning. And much more reliable and efficient.

As long as I have any say in the matter, I'll give up private vehicle ownership around the same time I give up breathing, personally. Living in an apartment or renting out spare rooms in the house to roommates in a single family home but I'm not doing that, either I very much value the instant accessibility, ability to leave crap I need frequently in the car, etc. Not to mention never having to worry about having to smell some stinking smoker or someone who doesn't so much apply perfume as bathe in it who just used that car before me.

That said, a LOT of people do not feel the same way as me and just want something that fits their transport needs at the cheapest price.

 

[clydeiii]

I'm obssesed with the concept because I hate driving. Seriously, it's the worst. And I hate other human drivers. Bring on the bots to drive for us, that future can't come soon enough, and Tesla will speed us towards it quicker than any other company.

 

[run-the-joules]

Tesla will speed us towards it quicker than any other company.

I think we can all agree on that. I'm more hoping that they'll stop for emergency vehicles on the way

 

[lafrisbee]

I'm obssesed with the concept because I hate driving. Seriously, it's the worst. And I hate other human drivers. Bring on the bots to drive for us, that future can't come soon enough, and Tesla will speed us towards it quicker than any other company.

You and I agree. i am willing to go 5 miles under the speed limit for the entire trip if I don't have to deal with the idiots. And I think that might be how "slow" the FSD will be. I don't care. Just let me quit having to interact with ephing morons.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

Just let me quit having to interact with ephing morons.

Isn't that a bit contradictory because you live in Florida?

 

[eye.surgeon]

I do understand the primary reason Tesla has broken a door down into the auto industry is due to EV advancement (styling/battery tech) with a secondary benefit of self driving. What I’m having difficulty understanding is the fixation on FULL self driving.

Today, the car can handle 90% of the driving that I do, including long trips. The other 10% (city/extreme weather) I would probably never use FSD for. In my mind, the 80/20 rule applies, and it would be easier for me to drive that 10% to negate a majority of the possible issues with using a FSD system.

So my question is, do people feel they really need FULL SD for a quality of life improvement? Or is this more of an academic discussions with a fascination to break a barrier?

It seems like there are so many discussions on what the cars can’t do that many are not enjoying/taking advantage of the many things it can do today.

Completely agree. Driving assist provides 90% of the benefit of FSD. The last 10% will be unsolveable.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

Completely agree. Driving assist provides 90% of the benefit of FSD. The last 10% will be unsolveable.

The problem with this is really about human psychology, and our inability to oversee things. Numerous studies have shown that we become disengaged from the experience, and it takes us awhile to regain situational awareness.

In its current state of development the Freeway NoA sucks badly enough that the majority of the people who use it are still paying attention. They're looking out for things like false braking, auto lane changes, etc. It doesn't really give us much chance to become complacent. Sure some people do, but the majority don't seem to be.

But, what happens when it gets better? More, and more people are going to become trusting of it.

This will inevitable lead to more fatality accidents as the result of more, and more drivers becoming complacent in how they use it.

So there has to be a point where the car itself takes responsibility.

This is really the goal of FSD. It's the fact that driver assistance has its limitations, and the responsibility must be turned over to the vehicle.

As to unsolvable? I think that's in the realm of L5 driving. But, L4 is certainly achievable. Like rest stop to rest stop self driving without getting into more accidents than the top 20% of North American drivers.

 

[hoeschjp]

I'm guessing the FSD obsession isn't just over making individual owner's commutes more relaxing/productive, but focused more on the whole robotaxi thing. Cars spend the vast majority of their life just sitting there, parked. It's inefficient in a lot of ways. If Telsa can figure that all out first (first to real scale at least), it could be a great way to move a whole lot more miles traveled to EV miles. And well, greatly expand Tesla's market share.

 

[CrayZ1]

While I don't personally want a FSD car, I wish everybody else would have one. Driver's skill is not improving in the foreseeable future.
So until then, Advanced Driver's Aids can be my extra set of eyes looking out for the clueless drivers.

 

[clydeiii]

Completely agree. Driving assist provides 90% of the benefit of FSD. The last 10% will be unsolveable.

While I agree that the last 10% is really hard, I think it's too pessimistic to say it's completely unsolvable.

 

[clydeiii]

While I don't personally want a FSD car, I wish everybody else would have one. Driver's skill is not improving in the foreseeable future.
So until then, Advanced Driver's Aids can be my extra set of eyes looking out for the clueless drivers.

I passed a guy in the leftmost lane today (on the right) who was sitting there, not passing anyone else and on his phone. Since the advent of smartphones, driver skill has gone down. That guy really, REALLY needs FSD.

 

[CrayZ1]

There is this one stoplight near our house where people routinely blow through the red at 60mph or higher. Many of them just aren't watching the road enough. ie - They are not speeding up to catch the yellow, they are cruising through the red.

 

[lafrisbee]

Humans. First let me tell you. I don't want more than 5% of all humans to suffer. But driving (and most everything else) would be much better if ..oh no. for get it...
Back to FS...(Here we are the upper segment of society and we can't agree if it is FS or FSD. I am in the "FS" camp. Full Self-driving. Not Full Self Driving.Then again most of you think you have a PIN Number).
My Wife just started driving last year. She calls herself a nerd. She got her Doctorate in Stochastics. Yeah, Stochastics. I didn't know it had a name till i met her. She is a super nerd. I would not trust her to drive. And yet she's gone 40,000 miles without an accident. A Miracle! She has to Commute to Orlando. I purchased a corolla for her for several reasons. But whatever car I was going to purchase had to have collision avoidance and lane change alert and yada yada yada.
She will actually stay on her phone trying to find some poisant what ya ma diggie while watching a TV show she wanted to watch. And she would be on her computer but I won't let her on her computer on week-end evenings. She'd be dead if it wasn't for all the assistance the corolla gives her. And one of you might be dead because of her too.
It isn't me that "needs" the FS. It is the entire driving public.
I have one accident associated with my name in the 50+ years, 500,000 miles I have driven. Granted I should have been in a few by my own making but the only one I had to ever file a report with was when a kid backed out of a parking space on a public road and went across the double yellow line backwards and barely put a stripe down the side of my car... Now I was travelling down that road on his side of the road. When he pulled out into my lane I knew that the brakes wouldn't stop me in time so I crossed the double yellow line.. I underestimated his stupidity. He backed out all the way across the double yellow line and clipped me. Ok enough of that. Just understand I've been able to help people avoid accidents a lot more often than anyone has helped me. Sometimes amazingly avoided such accidents. But my point is, even I want to give the wheel to a machine. Though for my own self-interest. I want to quit having to deal with the retards (like my wife) on the road. And I want to eliminate the kind of driving my wife would be doing if it were not for all the technology she has in that "Cheap-ass Corrola."

 

[lafrisbee]

Isn't that a bit contradictory because you live in Florida?

And if I had offended you enough you'd do the reverse-stalking thing where you read someone's post history and see I am in the process of getting a small place on the river back in Alabama.

 

[GalacticHero]

FWIW I do not think we will see FSD (level 5) any time soon at all. For 2020 I think we will see something more like NoA extended to well-sign posted rural-type roads, letting the car handle stop signs and traffic signals on these easier to handle roads. But we won't see a car that can negotiate the nightmare of crowded city streets anytime soon.

And actually, I would regard that addition to NoA as a decent and very welcome new feature for the car, and another sensible stepping-stone for FSD.

Right now I'd be pretty please if they just fixed what they broke in the last flurry of changes (Doesn't leave passing lane, Resumes at posted speed limit rather than last set speed.)

 

[Badcrc32]

I live in a large city in a suburb I use fsd every day for long time. With a neck injury like mine you appreciate it. It’s a game changer for people that drive a lot. I drive around all day and love it.

 

[DanCar]

I live in a large city in a suburb I use fsd every day for long time. With a neck injury like mine you appreciate it. It’s a game changer for people that drive a lot. I drive around all day and love it.

Details? What is it that you love about it?

 

[linux-works]

Completely agree. Driving assist provides 90% of the benefit of FSD. The last 10% will be unsolveable.

we don't need 100%. we first need to agree what the definition of 'done' (DoD) means. the jury is still out on that one. but I don't know of any *reasonable* person who thinks that level 5 on roads we have today, in mixed human/automated driver environ is going to happen.

remove some percentage of roads that won't be marked as 'autonomous friendly' and agree to that. try to reduce that, over time, as a long range goal and don't expect it to be done overnight.

augment things to make things as machine friendly as you can. I'm already seeing repainting of lines in my area (bay area) and I suspect its because we are trying to meet the machines halfway (so to speak) and since they are not as good as humans yet, anything we can do will help. brighter and more consistent road paintings will help.

I'm a big fan of active roads with wiring and RF giving beacons and exchanging important safety and road info. its called v2x and the sooner everyone adopts it, the better.

I am in the minority who does think that special markings of cars is needed. we have stop lights (tail lights and new 3rd brake light). we've had turn signals for a long time now. I understand that there are now 'Im about to turn' signals to warn other drivers that you are using an assist feature. what I'm asking for is that we take that to a standard level and allow for a safety cushion around the 'unpredictable' cars. they'll get better over time, but while they learn, they are a bit of a wild card. people need to know that and be ok with it. it won't be a switch we turn on over night where its beta-quality one day and production quality the next.

lots of things need to happen. we're getting there, but some things are taking WAY longer than others. I have doubts if we'll see widespread level 5 for consumers on regular roads. but level 2 will get better and we'll climb the levels as we get more experience.

 

[Battpower]

What do you do while the car is driving?

Well, I opted for the MS over M3 purely so I could put a double mattress in the back and have the car drive me over night. Same reason I went for FSD right away.

I'm off to the south of France tonight (from UK) and just hoping FSD can handle the car ferry OK.

 

[Battpower]

Well, I opted for the MS over M3 purely so I could put a double mattress in the back and have the car drive me over night. Same reason I went for FSD right away.

I'm off to the south of France tonight (from UK) and just hoping FSD can handle the car ferry OK.

What do you mean "it doesn't do ferries yet!"?