I want my Tesla now! How about a New Model S45/S60?

[RogerHScott]

as we get closer to the M3 launch the MS60 option is going away

Why? As long as 3 demand grossly outstrips supply, why wouldn't Tesla want to continue selling higher-priced 60s to impatient 3 customers?

I took that deal and am blown away by the car at that price

Glad to hear you are loving it. You (and several other recent new 60/75 purchasers that have posted) confirm my theory that, far
from cannibalizing S sales, the backlog of 3 customers will boost S sales as they decide they just can't wait to become Tesla owners.

 

[jcaspar]

Just wait till the first M3s start rolling out and the 60's will be worth nothing. Or get a used S85 for cheap now and skip autopilot. The previous autopilot hardware will quickly become obsolete and will not have the same software upgrades possible with the 2.0 hardware

 

[RogerHScott]

Just wait till the first M3s start rolling out and the 60's will be worth nothing.

How do you figure?

 

[sandpiper]

I think the temporary trip upgrade for the battery is a great idea. Allow those charges to accrue as credit over time, and it's like a layaway plan for the 60 to 75 upgrade -- one that you get to sample as you go. Nifty.

It's a great idea for the owner, but why the heck would Tesla do it? Most people only need the full range fairly rarely. But they pay $$$ for having it available when they need it. Why would anybody ever buy a 75 for $10K more, when for $50 you could use it when you need it? It will never happen.

 

[John5396]

Agree with Sandpiper,

If you got the car with $0 margin, and then leased features like full battery capacity, how would Tesla make money.

They already offer the 60/75 with a software limited battery. So they are selling the 60 at a reduced margin expecting that many customers will purchase the software feature to access all of the hardware capacity.

Note that the cost to tesla of the 75, 60 and the OP's proposed 40 are the same.

 

[sandpiper]

I hope that it will never happen. It's like saying please Porsche, make a panamera with 90 horse power for 40k... Having a car that cost me 120k and looks exactly the same as a car that cost 50k, nah please just higher the prices and people who can't afford it will take the m3. It's supposed to be a "luxury car", where is the luxury when everyone can afford it ?

That's exactly what I was saying earlier but in other words. if you introduce dramatically cheaper versions then you diminish the perceived value of the "Model S" brand. That will push down the price of the higher end cars. And you'll have some cannibalizing. It wouldn't make any sense.

Right now Tesla keeps the cheaper Ss on the market to bring in some incremental revenue and to minimize the perception that Tesla is only there for the rich. When the 3 is on the market, there will be an option for folks looking for a less expensive car. And so I expect that the 60 (and maybe 75) will go away.

 

[RogerHScott]

It's a great idea for the owner, but why the heck would Tesla do it? Most people only need the full range fairly rarely. But they pay $$$ for having it available when they need it. Why would anybody ever buy a 75 for $10K, when for $50 you could use it when you need it? It will never happen.

So now we're just haggling over price
Seriously, though, if you agree there's a demand then isn't the issue just what Tesla needs to charge to meet that demand that would
make business sense for them?

 

[sandpiper]

Agree with Sandpiper,

If you got the car with $0 margin, and then leased features like full battery capacity, how would Tesla make money.

They already offer the 60/75 with a software limited battery. So they are selling the 60 at a reduced margin expecting that many customers will purchase the software feature to access all of the hardware capacity.

Note that the cost to tesla of the 75, 60 and the OP's proposed 40 are the same.

Yep... and the added cost of a few extra battery modules in the 90 are at most $200 * 15kw = $3,000. The model S is an odd car. There is very very little difference in manufacturing cost from entry level to top end - but a HUGE difference in selling price.

Again, when the 3 comes online, I expect that the S will drop the cheaper variants and become strictly a luxury model.

 

[sandpiper]

So now we're just haggling over price
Seriously, though, if you agree there's a demand then isn't the issue just what Tesla needs to charge to meet that demand that would
make business sense for them?

Yup. And the price is $10,000. The bonus is that you get to use it at any time in the future for no added cost. I can assure you that this is not an idea that Tesla hadn't considered.

 

[RogerHScott]

Yup. And the price is $10,000. The bonus is that you get to use it at any time in the future for no added cost.

You're talking about permanent enablement, which is already available. The OP was proposing one-time enablement. Just to counter
your suggestion, are you seriously saying Tesla wouldn't make money charging $8k for one-time enablement? Clearly the real answer
is somewhere between $50 and $10k -- there's a lot of daylight in there.

 

[sandpiper]

You're talking about permanent enablement, which is already available. The OP was proposing one-time enablement. Just to counter
your suggestion, are you seriously saying Tesla wouldn't make money charging $8k for one-time enablement? Clearly the real answer
is somewhere between $50 and $10k -- there's a lot of daylight in there.

Tesla will have considered that and seemingly rejected it. My best guess is that they saw very little net financial gain but a lot of reputational risk.

Imagine for the moment, that they decided that $2,500 was a good number. Can you imagine the uproar when somebody gets themselves into a pickle, really want/need the extra 15K and Tesla is saying.. okay $2,500. Tesla would get accused of all sorts of carnal improprieties in forums and in the media.

On the financial side... people buy range mostly to alleviate range anxiety in those rare situations where they are pushing the edge. If you know that you could buy the extra range with a button push, for a reasonable price, when you need it, there is no range anxiety. And so what's the motivation to buy longer range?

 

[RogerHScott]

Imagine for the moment, that they decided that $2,500 was a good number. Can you imagine the uproar when somebody gets themselves into a pickle, really want/need the extra 15K and Tesla is saying.. okay $2,500. Tesla would get accused of all sorts of carnal improprieties in forums and in the media.

Oh, c'mon -- for way less than $2500 you could hire a high-end tow truck to come get you and drive you to the nearest SpC today, so
in a sense Tesla is already putting people in that position (and there's no attendant uproar).

people buy range mostly to alleviate range anxiety in those rare situations where they are pushing the edge. If you know that you could buy the extra range with a button push, when you need it, there is no range anxiety. And so what's the motivation to buy longer range?

People don't "need" health insurance, either, since in a real emergency they can go to an emergency room and they'll be treated.
Yet, through some miracle, people of means still seem to prefer the peace of mind that comes with buying insurance they'll likely
never really need. The cost of pushing that button just needs to be high enough that it isn't the obvious choice for everyone, always.

 

[sandpiper]

Oh, c'mon -- for way less than $2500 you could hire a high-end tow truck to come get you and drive you to the nearest SpC today, so
in a sense Tesla is already putting people in that position (and there's no attendant uproar).


People don't "need" health insurance, either, since in a real emergency they can go to an emergency room and they'll be treated.
Yet, through some miracle, people of means still seem to prefer the peace of mind that comes with buying insurance they'll likely
never really need. The cost of pushing that button just needs to be high enough that it isn't the obvious choice for everyone, always.

We'll have to agree to disagree. The idea is, of course, utterly obvious. Tesla will have considered it and come to the conclusion that it doesn't make sense, at least at this point. I tend to agree. I see few positives, but lots of negatives.

 

[RogerHScott]

We'll have to agree to disagree. The idea is, of course, utterly obvious. Tesla will have considered it and come to the conclusion that it doesn't make sense, at least at this point. I tend to agree. I see few positives, but lots of negatives.

Yes, I will agree that every product idea and product option idea not currently on the market has been carefully considered by potential
suppliers and rejected for sound reasons. I mean, really, they're all just so obvious.

 

[sandpiper]

Yes, I will agree that every product idea and product option idea not currently on the market has been carefully considered by potential
suppliers and rejected for sound reasons. I mean, really, they're all just so obvious.

No... but this specific idea is utterly obvious. It certainly crossed my mind when I heard (back in the days of the 40/60) that they were software limiting some cars. I'm quite convinced that, iIf it's crossed both of our minds, there are plenty of bright people at Tesla who had thought of it as well.

 

[Aieukl378]

Why? As long as 3 demand grossly outstrips supply, why wouldn't Tesla want to continue selling higher-priced 60s to impatient 3 customers?

I have no idea as I am simply some guy on the Tesla forum...but I thought my MS60 was a ridiculous deal and once M3s are rolling off the line Tesla may not need to offer such enticements.

Glad to hear you are loving it. You (and several other recent new 60/75 purchasers that have posted) confirm my theory that, far
from cannibalizing S sales, the backlog of 3 customers will boost S sales as they decide they just can't wait to become Tesla owners.

1. Thanks...it's been 4 months and I'm still pinching myself! 2. Agreed!

 

[ciparis]

Heres the gist of it: some S60 owners will not upgrade, because they can't afford or can't justify 10k given their typical needs. Those same people might pay some amount for a temporary upgrade. It's a bonus for Tesla (who are brilliant but not necessarily omniscient and/or haven't had the time to fully maximize profits in every area, especially edge cases) if they get additional revenue from this otherwise sunk cost (the extra unrealized capacity). Exactly where you move the sliders to ensure that you aren't canibalizing upgrades to the degree that the endeavor is counterproductive is a marketing exercise I leave for the creative reader.

 

[brkaus]

Heres the gist of it: some S60 owners will not upgrade, because they can't afford or can't justify 10k given their typical needs. Those same people might pay some amount for a temporary upgrade. It's a bonus for Tesla (who are brilliant but not necessarily omniscient and/or haven't had the time to fully maximize profits in every area, especially edge cases) if they get additional revenue from this otherwise sunk cost (the extra unrealized capacity). Exactly where you move the sliders to ensure that you aren't canibalizing upgrades to the degree that the endeavor is counterproductive is a marketing exercise I leave for the creative reader.

They may get additional incremental revenue from temporary upgrades, but it may dissuade folks that were planning on upgrading their new purchase so they can make it to Grandma's house (or some other long trip) 1-2 times per year. That would be lost revenue.

Price the temporary upgrade too low. People would stop buying the full-time upgrade. Price it too high, people would never buy the temporary upgrade.

I'm not convinced there's a price point that would be revenue enhancing.

 

[RogerHScott]

Price the temporary upgrade too low. People would stop buying the full-time upgrade. Price it too high, people would never buy the temporary upgrade.

I'm not convinced there's a price point that would be revenue enhancing.

It seems like that could only be true if the price of the upgrade were already extortionate -- which it may very well be. You're basically
saying that no alternative to the upgrade could be both attractive to buyers and as profitable for Tesla.

 

[rainman50]

Tesla has heard you and has responded to your request!

Tesla is increasing the base price of the Model S by $2,000.

And then also going to take away free charging next year. (pricing not known at this time, see what happens then).