I wish Tesla had not said how many cameras were in use...

[Dstrohl]

According to the (very limited) information available, all new cars are coming with 8 cameras. if you don't purchase EAP, the system only uses 1 of those cameras, if you do, it uses 4, and if you purchase the full self driving, it uses all 8.

Now, this has been hashed back and forth a lot recently with people saying that they must be using all 8 for safety, or they are wrong to not use more for whatever... but I wish that Tesla had simply stuck to saying "there are 8 cameras", (in their marketing materials at least) and talking about the FEATURES you get in the base model, or EAP or FSDC.

By mentioning them though, it means that if next year it comes out that they are using all 8 for the base safety features, there are going to be people who feel like they are being cheated by not getting all 8 used for EAP. or if it turns out that they really only need 3 cameras for EAP, we might get annoyed that we are not getting all 4 of them used. it also opens them up to people saying that "if they had only used 6 cameras instead of 4 for EAP, this accident (or whatever) would never have happened.

To me, If I purchase EAP, and expect the car to automatically exit the highway, I expect it to do so in the safest manner it can with what it has, if they only need 1 camera to do that, fine, but if it needs 5 cameras, they should be using them. (and I HOPE they actually are). I don't get to see the feed of those cameras, so it really shouldn't matter to me if it uses 1 camera, 4 cameras, 5 cameras, or NO cameras... as long as it works reliably and achieves the stated goals.

I know that there are physical things in the car that I ordered that will not be used because of the options packages I chose, from harnesses that are unconnected, to sensors, fuses, mounting plates, and even the extra 15KWH of the battery (I ordered a 60). This doesn't bother me at all, but those extra un-used cameras do kind of bother me, though I will admit they shouldn't, I think because they made a big thing about them.

Note: It would be good to see this kind of thing covered in the manual so we knew that if camera X was broken, we would lose features Y and Z, but from a marketing POV, all this seems like it does is create confusion and potential future ill will.

 

[ArtInCT]

When I purchased my P90DL in March 2016 I did not buy AutoPilot features.... however, the instrument panel display did show lanes, traffic, etc. So event though I was not on autopilot, and the feature was not turned on, the display and camera were operational. Later on, I did the trial of Autopilot features and eventually purchased Autopilot. The only thing that was different were the TACC and lane holding and auto high beams and parking and summoning. .... they now were invokable once the software was enabled.

But the camera, and radar and sensors all were alive and working prior to the purchase.

I suspect that all 8 cameras will be alive and working on all new cars, it is the functionality that will not be invokable.

 

[Dstrohl]

I suspect that all 8 cameras will be alive and working on all new cars, it is the functionality that will not be invokable.

That is my supposition as well, my grumbling is more at the way they are marketing it, which is causing lots more churn than I think was needed.

 

[ArtInCT]

Dstrohl... how soon we forget... when AutoPilot Features 1.0 were first sold, Lane Keeping functionality took about 9 months (I may be wrong on that time line) to actually become an operational feature. There was much grumbling and hand wringing going on here as to when, if ever, that feature would become a reality. The second phase of AP 2.0 is much similar. However even some of the TACC and features will be postponed as I understand it with 2.0.

Tesla is not so swell at marketing reality.... no white papers, no guidance, little if any field knowledge in helping owners come to grips with simple stuff like Torque Sleep, Range Mode, Smart Preconditioning, no release notes in point releases, etc.

Tesla is quite an Opaque organization as far as how the advanced features of the car can and should be best utilized. Always been this way since I have been following the car.

So... this is their Standard Operating Procedure....

 

[Dstrohl]

Dstrohl... how soon we forget... when AutoPilot Features 1.0 were first sold, Lane Keeping functionality took about 9 months (I may be wrong on that time line) to actually become an operational feature.

Ahhh, but I have an excuse! I just ordered my model S and was not really "following" them that closely way back during those prehistoric times... last year was it? (drooling, yes, following... not really )

Tesla is not so swell at marketing reality.... no white papers, no guidance, little if any field knowledge in helping owners come to grips with simple stuff like Torque Sleep, Range Mode, Smart Preconditioning, no release notes in point releases, etc. Tesla is quite an Opaque organization as far as how the advanced features of the car can and should be best utilized. Always been this way since I have been following the car.

I've noticed that, mostly when I have made a comment along the lines of "of course they have release notes that tell you how this works,, how could they not?" or "I'm sure that they were not really THAT vague in their announcement... I mean, no one would really announce (or even worse, sell) a SKU for something that is just a dream at this point? would they???" and everyone just kind of looks at me like I was a kid in pre-school and I just said something really dumb.. you know, its that patronizing look of "someday you will grow up and realize how the real world works"... really! I can feel the look even through the computer!

So... this is their Standard Operating Procedure....

Yup, it seems like it... bit that doesn't stop me from wishing they would do better! (and in fact this time, I am wishing that they had released LESS information )

Oh well, I guess I am going to have to grow up and get used to this.

 

[ArtInCT]

Oh, we all wish that Tesla Motors would communicate much better to owners and prospective owners.
That is for sure.

I am sure, that every person here on TMC feels quite similar.

If Tesla wanted to really delight its customer base, I would think it would be engaging owners and inviting them to participate in feedback loops of a formal manner? I mean, instead we have a grass roots effort in TeslaTap.... really?

Tesla reaching out to its installed base is not so much really taking place..... if at all, from what I have seen, both personally and amongst my group of about 22 other S and X owners & friends.

Just take a look at the TMC CONNECT annual gathering..... virtually ZERO Tesla Motors participation.... I mean "wow" that says quite a lot.

 

[robby]

There's no way that Tesla's going to ignore input from any sensor, for software-lock reasons, in a way that is suboptimal for safety. I think in that language they are just explaining what cameras are useful for which features. That mapping may change as they explore how best to utilize the hardware suite, but generally, they are going to differentiate AP2 from self-driving by feature set, not by sensor input.

 

[Dstrohl]

There's no way that Tesla's going to ignore input from any sensor, for software-lock reasons, in a way that is suboptimal for safety. I think in that language they are just explaining what cameras are useful for which features. That mapping may change as they explore how best to utilize the hardware suite, but generally, they are going to differentiate AP2 from self-driving by feature set, not by sensor input.

I would like to believe that, in fact I suspect it is correct... which is why I started this thread with the title I did. I mainly wish they just said exactly your point, instead of making the very first point on the feature how many cameras are used.