ICE'ING Solution?

[PRSIST]

Let’s take our minds off whether or not we will be the next person to receive an email to configure their Model 3.

Wanted to get some feedback and at the same time maybe let off a little steam. Consider this one a little on the side of the glass half empty.

I read a Tweet recently that really set me off. They showed a picture of what looked like about 12 ICE vehicles parked in Tesla marked EV charging locations. Maybe it’s my background but this kind of disrespect or disregard for any kind of rule, etc., just sets me off something fierce. Like the damn people who are not handicapped, yet park in handicap parking.

As the months progress and there are more and more Tesla’s needing to charge at these superchargers, what should be done about ICE vehicles parking in our charging spots? Many of us that are taking road trip NEED to charge our cars! When ICE vehicles are occupying the charger locations, we can’t continue our trip, or our trip is delayed.

So what do we do? If Tesla doesn’t own the land the chargers are on then it’s up to the Mall, hotel, etc. to take action. What if the Mall, hotel, or etc., won’t take action?

Possible solution is: Valve Stem Removers. Covertly remove two valve stems from the ICE vehicle tires and throw them into the grass or snow or whatever is close. Don’t steal them or damage them, just relocate them. Make sure to remove the stems out of two tires so the inconsiderate ICE vehicle owner can’t simply change their tire. And be sure to leave a 'love note' on the windshield reminding the owner “We don’t park in your gas station, please don’t park in ours”.

Now this is tongue in cheek to some respect and the ICE'ING problem may not be all that bad, but how would you handle being ICE’d when you have the wife and kids in your car and you NEED that charge to get to your destination or next hotel?

Look forward to hearing from all saints, devils, and those in between.

 

[Unpilot]

Escalating a bad situation rarely ends well.

 

[Saghost]

If you're willing to touch their car, just get a set of four gliders, lift the car up and roll it somewhere more appropriate. But that's still an escalation, likely to lead to a confrontation.

 

[bonnie]

Let’s take our minds off whether or not we will be the next person to receive an email to configure their Model 3.

Wanted to get some feedback and at the same time maybe let off a little steam. Consider this one a little on the side of the glass half empty.

I read a Tweet recently that really set me off. They showed a picture of what looked like about 12 ICE vehicles parked in Tesla marked EV charging locations. Maybe it’s my background but this kind of disrespect or disregard for any kind of rule, etc., just sets me off something fierce. Like the damn people who are not handicapped, yet park in handicap parking.

As the months progress and there are more and more Tesla’s needing to charge at these superchargers, what should be done about ICE vehicles parking in our charging spots? Many of us that are taking road trip NEED to charge our cars! When ICE vehicles are occupying the charger locations, we can’t continue our trip, or our trip is delayed.

So what do we do? If Tesla doesn’t own the land the chargers are on then it’s up to the Mall, hotel, etc. to take action. What if the Mall, hotel, or etc., won’t take action?

Possible solution is: Valve Stem Removers. Covertly remove two valve stems from the ICE vehicle tires and throw them into the grass or snow or whatever is close. Don’t steal them or damage them, just relocate them. Make sure to remove the stems out of two tires so the inconsiderate ICE vehicle owner can’t simply change their tire. And be sure to leave a 'love note' on the windshield reminding the owner “We don’t park in your gas station, please don’t park in ours”.

Now this is tongue in cheek to some respect and the ICE'ING problem may not be all that bad, but how would you handle being ICE’d when you have the wife and kids in your car and you NEED that charge to get to your destination or next hotel?

Look forward to hearing from all saints, devils, and those in between.

This is not a new issue, unfortunately. And you're not the first to want to respond in anger - but that will just make those car owners hate EV owners & it rolls downhill from there. Rapidly.

Education really is the only answer. The great news is that as more EVs hit the market, more and more people become aware of the need not to block spots to charge. Many vendors offer some good cards that you can leave on windshields, so that they're unlikely to do it again. I always carry a few in the glovebox.

Here's one from EVannex:

 

[cpa]

The way things are today, I dunno. Tesla's signage at Superchargers is small and at a comparatively low height. Tesla's signs can say (more or less)

--Tesla Vehicle Charging Only
--Tesla Vehicle Charging - General Parking 30/60 minutes
--Tesla Vehicle Charging - General Parking 8PM - 8AM

Many Supercharging locations have a combination of signs. Given that Supercharging is free for some of us and cheap for the rest of us, Tesla hammered out their best deal to save as much money on rent while complying with the various zoning/parking rules around the country.

Then, factor in the fact that some states have no statutes against parking in any EV charging spot. Others, like California, have so many requirement for signage like size, font size, and wording, that for all intents and purposes there is no law.

Just like when the handicapped parking rules came about (late '70s maybe?) there will come a time when a few lobbyists, legislators or their families will experience ICEing and they will act with legislation that has teeth and will cheerfully be enforced by the police or the parking authorities. The fines need to be enough ($250) to get the attention of the scofflaws, not $35. Towing preferred, but probably not in the cards in the early going.

But, yeah, for now we face uncertainty.

 

[N5329K]

Tesla could keep a towing service on contract at charge sites with ICE problems and pay a bounty for each scofflaw removed. The ICE car would be picked up by its owner and bailed out. Proper signage and an expensive experience could curtail this problem.
Robin

 

[dgpcolorado]

The OP might not be aware that many Tesla Supercharging locations have about half the stalls posted as being for general parking, usually with a 30 or 60 minute limit. While it still strikes me as rude to park in a charging stall, if the parking lot is full it can be justified.

After ICEing became a problem at Moab the hotel repainted the parking spaces:

^ ICEV parking is permitted in the left two spaces, although it is supposedly limited to 2 hours and people actually park overnight because it is a hotel lot with limited space. Nevertheless, this might limit the ICEing somewhat. Several other Supercharger Stations at hotels use traffic cones to block off several stalls for Tesla use, notably Glenwood Springs CO and The Dalles OR.

^ Glenwood Springs CO.

There are workable solutions to the ICEing problem.

 

[Shygar]

Looks like the cables on the superchargers aren't that long. It would be nice if you could pull perpendicular in front of an ICE car parked there and just run the cable over to still get a charge (since that's really what we're talking about here, the ability to charge the car).

 

[Pluto]

I've always wanted to ICE an ICE by double parking in its only path out of the spot in order to charge my car. But I haven't done it yet because:
1. I haven't absolutely needed to charge in any scenario like this.
2. It's illegal.
3. It would still reflect badly on EV drivers

 

[eSpiritIV]

If they are taking up all the spots, you double park till you are filled up. Its like another person said, its like if a EV blocked both entrances to a gas station and it was the only one for miles!

 

[Chaserr]

Several states have enacted anti-ICEing laws already, I happen to be in one of them. A call to local police can result in the ICEr being towed and fined - not something I'd bother for a single jerk but definitely useful when the entire supercharger station is blocked.

Keep in mind that Tesla owners are less affected than other EV drivers - we might be inconvenienced but can usually make it to the next station; many smaller battery EV owners may actually rely on those EV stations simply to make it home. This legislation ***needs*** to go nationwide.

 

[daniel]

...
Possible solution is: Valve Stem Removers. Covertly remove two valve stems from the ICE vehicle tires and throw them into the grass or snow or whatever is close. Don’t steal them or damage them, just relocate them...

It's vandalism (and therefore a crime) even if you do not damage or keep the valve stems. That said, in Mexico, where I lived for several years, nobody puts "No parking" signs in front of their driveway. Instead they put up a sign which (translated into English) says "Tires punctured for free."

I imagine two kinds of people park gas cars in charger spots. People who can't find another spot in a full parking lot and feel they should be allowed to park if there's no place else, and people with a chip on their shoulder against electric cars and their drivers. The former don't really deserve to have their car vandalized, and the latter are likely to react violently.

Getting the cops to ticket and tow them would be wiser than exposing yourself to the anger of irrational and possibly violent jerks.

In 2004/5 when the Prius was a new thing, there were people on PriusChat who felt that since their car was gas-electric hybrid, that it should be allowed to park in EV-only parking spaces, even though the car could not be charged from a plug. I and others argued against this, but there were people who felt entitled because they were "pioneers" in a new technology that included "electric" in its name.

 

[Merrill]

This subject has been discussed many times, I’m not for any kind of retaliation, this will stop when people are educated and more of them have electric cars. Also until these charging spots have warnings like tow away zone and fines like disabled parking it will not deter people from Icing. Some Tesla superchargers have signs saying General Parking, this will not work.

 

[BerTX]

Any kind of vandalism of vehicles is a bad idea. Especially if it results in the OPPOSITE of what you want. Making the car immovable is a silly solution.

As to towing, realize that most of the property owners WILL NOT tow away a customer's car for parking in an EV charging spot. They are not in the business of upsetting customers. Tesla can request action, we can request action, but in the vast majority of cases the property owner is the person who has to request that a vehicle be towed. They will not.

In the states where violation of EV charging parking by ICEs is illegal, there is specific signage required to let the driver know they can't park there. Never once have I seen this in place at a Tesla Supercharger. The property owner won't allow it.

The compromise in place is to allow "limited" general parking. This is ridiculous to expect one identical spot (in the eyes of the ICE driver) to have different rules from another. If it is OK in that spot, it must be OK in the other -- they just put up the wrong sign. And nobody is going to enforce it, anyway.

The problems are built into the system. I think we just have to tolerate it. The cones seem to work sometimes. and maybe that is the best we can hope for right now.

 

[strykeroz]

scofflaw

Thankyou for my new word for today

 

[sduck]

I usually carry a bunch of educational printouts like the EVannex one listed above - you can find printable versions fairly easily with google. There are several varieties - politely educational, politely humorous, not so politely educational, and downright mean ones (for repeat offenders I guess). I would never do any actual physical damage to someone else's vehicle, although it certainly is tempting sometimes.

 

[Unpilot]

Was just downtown and the only spot with 4 EV plug in stalls had two spots taken by ICE cars....grrr.

 

[PRSIST]

In Arizona, it is now against the law to park an ICE vehicle in an electric vehicle parking space. Arizona Revised Statutes (A.R.S.) 28-876 carries a $350 fine. The statute doesn't mention towing the vehicle, but a $350 fine is a good start.

28-876. Parking spaces for electric vehicles; civil penalty

A. A person shall not stop, stand or park a motor vehicle within any parking space specially designated for parking and fueling motor vehicles fueled exclusively by electricity unless the motor vehicle is powered by electricity and has been issued an alternative fuel vehicle special plate or sticker pursuant to section 28-2416.

B. If a law enforcement officer finds a motor vehicle in violation of this section, the law enforcement officer shall issue a complaint to the operator or other person in charge of the motor vehicle or, if an operator or other person is not present, to the registered owner of the motor vehicle for a civil traffic violation.

C. A person who is found responsible for a violation of this section is subject to a civil penalty of at least three hundred fifty dollars. Notwithstanding section 28-1554, the civil penalties collected pursuant to this subsection shall be deposited in the state general fund.

 

[David99]

The problem will solve itself as more and more EVs are on the road. The more EVs are using the charging stations, the less chance for an ICE to park there. Busy Superchargers never get a chance to get ICEd because they are always occupied by a Tesla.

Laws and good signs help immensely. For example the city of Santa Monica is very EV friendly. Lots of free chargers, free parking for EVs. At charging stations they have large red signs 'No Parking'. Underneath is a small sign 'except EV'. No ICEing problems ever.

 

[arnis]

I call the police. They can contact vehicle owner by phone.
Emotionally that should shake poor ICEr brains up for a while
And most importantly, there is a chance that owner will show up soon after.