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Consumer Reports rates the Model S as average reliability. Some people here have had a lot of service problems, though others seem to have very few. Some of it might be perfectionism, though some people have had real problems virtually everyone would agree are a problem like a failed battery pack, or something else major going out.
dgpcolorado
high altitude member
Truedelta Model S Overall Reliability is one source.
Anecdotal reports in a forum like TMC are hard to judge. One curious thing I've noticed is that some Model S owners, when asked whether their cars have had any problems, tend to say something like "nothing major" and then list small things that have had to be fixed. Then there are the owners who have had multiple DU replacements. Even the 70D with the new motors is starting to have DU replacements. Tesla still can't build a motor and reduction gear system that just works, without bearing issues?
This may not be a concern for current Model S owners but it is a concern for me, especially given the distance to a Service Center. My hope is that Tesla will get their QC and design problems straightened out by the Model 3 launch, although that may be too optimistic.
It is a bit of a concern for me too. I'm not as far from a service center, but the nearest one is on the opposite corner of the Portland metro area, about 40 miles and an hour's drive time except on weekends. However, for the Model 3, Tesla is going to have to expand it's service network to support the car as well as the rest of the infrastructure like SCs. Eventually Tesla service centers will probably be as common as most other mainstream ICE dealerships. Right now expanding the service center network is taking a back seat to developing the Model 3, building the Gigafactory, and expanding the SC network.
purplewalt
Active Member
You have just entered the longest two years+ of your entire life.
Waiting (long enough) teaches you patience.
It does pay to have a sense of humor while waiting.
Get you funds in order so you can put your reservation and deposit down for a 3 or Y pre-order in March of 2016 after they are unveiled -- in a mere 5 Plus Months.
Probably a whole three Christmases away...
Just be glad you didn't get your car two years ago: there were no Superchargers in Texas.
You would be going out of your mind by now.
physicsfita
Member
I have to say, that's something that weighs on me, as well. The nearest service center is in Cleveland, which is 180 miles from home. Tesla has had a Detroit service center "coming soon" for nearly two years, which I find interesting because it has been illegal for decades for any auto manufacturer to have a service center in the state (with an exception for a manufacturer servicing their own fleet vehicles). Even a service center in Toledo (about an hour away) would be a major improvement, but Tesla has no plans to put one there. I would happily take my car to the local Belle Tire if Tesla would make their service manuals available, but they seem to have no plans to do anything like that, either. If the service issue doesn't get resolved, I'll probably end up getting a Volt (or possibly a Bolt), instead.
The wait is getting unbearable, I've started looking into used model s's. Is that how you write that? I saw a cpo on the Tesla website last night for 50k, then it disappeared about 10 minutes later. Good thing I don't have 50k sitting around.
Mad Hungarian
Member
Apologies if this has been covered in another thread, but I'm kind of amazed that no one here has referenced Randy Carlson's excellent speculative design study on the M3 that was posted on Seeking Alpha a few months ago.
Link is here, but note that you'll need to register to get past page 2 (it's free though and they don't hassle you with spam or anything):
http://seekingalpha.com/article/3258855-will-teslas-model-3-compete
This is by far the best analysis I've seen so far what the car could potentially be, with some pretty good science and math to back it up. I also think his assertion that they'll offer a something like a 44, 66D and P66D is pretty solid. Now to decide if I'll go with a 66D or sell my soul to get the P added!
Link is here, but note that you'll need to register to get past page 2 (it's free though and they don't hassle you with spam or anything):
http://seekingalpha.com/article/3258855-will-teslas-model-3-compete
This is by far the best analysis I've seen so far what the car could potentially be, with some pretty good science and math to back it up. I also think his assertion that they'll offer a something like a 44, 66D and P66D is pretty solid. Now to decide if I'll go with a 66D or sell my soul to get the P added!
Skotty
2014 S P85 | 2023 F-150L
We get more information on the 3 when Elon can no longer contain his itchy Twitter finger. :-D
I'm in huge agreement with what mknox and some others have said about being eager to start focusing on the 3 to put an end (or at least a damper) to the rich people only arguments.
I'm in huge agreement with what mknox and some others have said about being eager to start focusing on the 3 to put an end (or at least a damper) to the rich people only arguments.
ProphetM
Member
I posted a thread about it back at the end of June, which was before you needed to register to read it. And I agree that it's a really good extensive design exercise. I hope that Tesla has the ability to do what the author thinks it can. But, Seeking Alpha has an apparently well-deserved reputation around here as a crap site. And coupled with the fact that now you have to register just to read an article, the lack of reference is not surprising to me.
Candleflame
Active Member
he can already not control it as evident by his frequent spoiler posts which get quickly deleted.
Mad Hungarian
Member
Ahhh... this makes more sense, as I was pretty surprised when I couldn't find any mention here of what I thought was a pretty significant article. However I only used the author's name and the article title in the search. I agree there's a lot of sketchy if not outright inflammatory articles on that site, all in the name of boosting or killing the stock price. But I thought Carlson's piece was pretty sound.
Great discussion though on your thread as to the accuracy of the weight and range predictions as well as battery layout. After 4 decades of wrenching/modding ICE's I have a lot of catching up to do in the EV world...
jgs
Active Member
It's been a while since I read it carefully, but my recollection is that HB 5606 of 2014 is what introduced the proscription on service centers. I really doubt this would stand up to a commerce clause test, but I'm not surprised Tesla has chosen not to pick a fight in court, although I am surprised they haven't chosen to make a bigger PR deal about this aspect since it's even more transparently anti-consumer than the "no showrooms" rule.
For what it's worth, I was completely satisfied with the Ranger service dispatched from Cleveland for the one minor issue I've had so far.
I think it's obvious Tesla will have to work this out by the time they start shipping the Model 3. The Ranger approach is great customer service and lets them expand their footprint, but it doesn't scale.
Candleflame
Active Member
oh man a 44kwh battery will mean rediculously slow supercharging speed. That will be even more apparent as the 3 may get much more range per kwh than the S. Even the S70 supercharges much slower than the S85...
Assuming you roll up to a charger with 0% battery, 200 mile range, and a 40-minutes-to-80% charge
40 minute to get 160 miles of range added on.
Definitely will add time onto the LONNNNG road trips, but the 300-500 miles/day treks will only be marginally affected.
Candleflame
Active Member
The Model S85kwh gets about 200 miles on a motorway and has almost twice the batterysize of the vehicle you are suggesting. And it's more like 50min for an 80% charge. Elon promised real world range and not "turn AC off and drive at 55mph" range.
And once you have depleted your range charge you did at home its all about replenishing kilometers/kilowatts in your "tank" and not necessarly 0-80% as they are all fairly similar. The Model S60 takes almost twice as much time to charge 100km of (typical) range than the S85. How do you think a 3.44 will take to charge that range?
And once you have depleted your range charge you did at home its all about replenishing kilometers/kilowatts in your "tank" and not necessarly 0-80% as they are all fairly similar. The Model S60 takes almost twice as much time to charge 100km of (typical) range than the S85. How do you think a 3.44 will take to charge that range?
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Given that the new Leaf has a 30kWh and gets 107 miles, I suspect the Model 3 will have a 55-60 kWh, not a 44kWh battery. Still smaller, but not quite as bad.
Candleflame
Active Member
Tesla may be able to get abit of extra range by optimizing the drag of the car, although the Model S is already highly efficient. I don't think the reduced weight will increase (motorway) range that much. My personal guess will be a 65kw battery and maybe an 85 one as upgrade.
Nissan uses a different battery chemistry which has lower energy density. In the same volume as the 30KWh battery, Tesla can probably get a 45KWh battery. Tesla also has excellent energy management firmware on their cars, which will expand the range even more.
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