Improvements badly needed for M3, App, HPWC--esp in cold climates

[j5555]

It seems that Tesla really needs to improve the charging functions that can be controlled in the app (and the car) when using the HPWC (240v 60 amp circuit) especially in cold climates. Live north of Chicago, car kept in unheated garage and driven varied mileage each day. I am also signed up for Com Ed demand pricing--which of course is not as critical in the winter but is time of day based. My general plan is to set charge time each day based on expected departure time in the morning. However, with 42.4 on the car 3.6.2 on the phone there are numerous improvements that are needed.

-If I go out of town, car has vampire drain (currently about 6-8 miles per day) but will not start charging on day 2, or day 3, etc..Car screen and phone app show "Charging Complete" from the day 1 charge. No way from the app to start charging again. On earlier software version I remember being able to start charging from the app as well as addt. info on the app showing for example that charging would start at a current time.

--It would be really handy to be able to have some kind of trickle mode in conjunction with the HPWC. This would also allow "preheating the interior" as well as keeping battery regen at higher level. I'm not certain as to current electricity pricing and if it makes difference in winter but certainly in warmer months lowest rates are in overnight hours. Depending on battery drain I'm now sometimes setting start time at 7am or so if only needing <50 miles range added so as limit drain and keep battery as warm as possible at start of drive time

--Right now I have to manually figure charge start time each day and set in car. Would be nice to have the ability to set from phone and even better if you could enter a desired "charge complete time."

My warm weather charging process was much simpler, set it to go at 1am each day--and many days did not hook up to charger if battery not all that depleted. Winter has changed all that. Am I missing something here in terms of being able to control the charge time and process from the phone when hooked to HPWC and was some functionality removed in recent software?

 

[MXWing]

Are you charging to 100% and be unable to charge more?

If you are charging to say 80-90%, you can open up the app, and slide the charging threshold to higher than present. The car will start to charge.

You can also turn on climate control anytime from the app to preheat the interior?

 

[Rsdavis9]

44.2 on car software.
I get about 4 mi/day vampire.
I have start charging in my app but not adjustment to time of day charging.
I also would like a separate battery preheat button.
Not that hard to figure out when to start charging to finish when I leave.

 

[gecko10x]

Would be nice to have the ability to set from phone and even better if you could enter a desired "charge complete time."

This seems to be the logical way to do it; I'm quite surprised it wasn't designed that way from the start.

 

[j5555]

Are you charging to 100% and be unable to charge more?

If you are charging to say 80-90%, you can open up the app, and slide the charging threshold to higher than present. The car will start to charge.

Generally leave charge rate at 80%. Thanks for tip--if i move charge rate from say 80 to 82% using slider--car starts charging again though with slight delay on phone notification--perhaps the reason i missed this before. Should be easier way to do this--like button saying "start charging". Really shouldn't be necessary to charge preset threshold each day to restart charge.

 

[strider]

Even more comical is that the Toyota RAV4 that used a Tesla drivetrain had this exact feature (set a time to complete charging) but Tesla can't figure out how to do it on their own cars.

I don't understand why this is only a problem in the winter? If the car is connected to the grid it will take care of itself. If the battery temp drops it'll automatically use grid power to heat itself. Cell damage (ie electrolyte freezing) does not occur until -40C. That will not happen in the Continental US.

Start pre-heating the cabin as you're hopping into the shower, it'll be nice and toasty when you get in. Sure, you will have reduced regen for a while but there's this pedal on the left side that will substitute. Honestly it wastes a crap-ton of electricity to use resistive heating to warm your battery when driving the car will do the same thing with waste heat.

All that being said, they should figure out a way to set a time to complete charging but they haven't done it yet. The good news is that when it does happen it'll be a software update available to everyone.

 

[MXWing]

Generally leave charge rate at 80%. Thanks for tip--if i move charge rate from say 80 to 82% using slider--car starts charging again though with slight delay on phone notification--perhaps the reason i missed this before. Should be easier way to do this--like button saying "start charging". Really shouldn't be necessary to charge preset threshold each day to restart charge.

Agreed. I am pretty sure the engineers, focus groups, and ui/ux all throw down when it comes to balance what the app can do versus confusing users.

What you can do is set a higher threshold at any time, then tell the car to stop charging with a button. You can then tell the car to 'start charging' without adjusting the threshold.

Also, from my understanding of batteries, there is no harm if you immediately utilize the higher SOC. Before you leave, you can charge up to 85-90%, etc and burn it down to 80% or less when you get to your destination.

I don't understand why this is only a problem in the winter? If the car is connected to the grid it will take care of itself. If the battery temp drops it'll automatically use grid power to heat itself. Cell damage (ie electrolyte freezing) does not occur until -40C. That will not happen in the Continental US.

There is a big difference between the different battery heating states:
1 - Warm enough to protect itself.
2 - At ideal temp for normal operation (and also saving the energy needed to heat to this point as it has access to replenish the power used)
3 - Heated above normal for Ludicrous performance.

At 80% range and stage 2 is where you want to be when leaving the garage.

 

[strider]

Let me start by again saying that Tesla should code the ability to schedule when the car finishes charging. That would solve these problems.

However, we don't have that today so we resort to all of this hoop-jumping. I believe that there are really 4 states. There is a "cold" state where regen is reduced but the car does not engage in active battery heating upon driving. IMO that is where you want to be to minimize wasting electricity.

Yes, I am being pedantic. See my first sentence on how I agree w/ the OP on the solution

 

[chronopc]

-If I go out of town, car has vampire drain (currently about 6-8 miles per day) but will not start charging on day 2, or day 3, etc..Car screen and phone app show "Charging Complete" from the day 1 charge. No way from the app to start charging again. On earlier software version I remember being able to start charging from the app as well as addt. info on the app showing for example that charging would start at a current time.

You can definitely start charging from the app. When the car is plugged it, there is a button to start charging under the charging section.

The app used to say when the schedule charge time was, now for some reason it says charging stopped. Not sure why.

 

[HostileHarry]

I am also signed up for Com Ed demand pricing--which of course is not as critical in the winter but is time of day based. My general plan is to set charge time each day based on expected departure time in the morning. However, with 42.4 on the car 3.6.2 on the phone there are numerous improvements that are needed.

I'm in the Northern burbs as well and I wanted to know how your experience with the Comed Hourly rate program is working? I've considered switching to it as the rates at night are very low, but I want to know how the summer afternoons treat you when you still want to cool down the house.

 

[MorrisonHiker]

I don't understand why this is only a problem in the winter? If the car is connected to the grid it will take care of itself. If the battery temp drops it'll automatically use grid power to heat itself. Cell damage (ie electrolyte freezing) does not occur until -40C. That will not happen in the Continental US.

It may not get that cold in Oklahoma but it definitely gets that cold in the continental US. Also, this car is sold in Canada and it's very common to get that cold in Quebec and other parts of Canada. I know, having to walk to university in -40 temperatures and -60 or lower with the windchill.


Coldest temperature ever recorded in each state: F (C)

 

[miimura]

Even more comical is that the Toyota RAV4 that used a Tesla drivetrain had this exact feature (set a time to complete charging) but Tesla can't figure out how to do it on their own cars.

You really shouldn't cite the RAV4 EV as an example of good departure based charge scheduling. It's really quite terrible. The Volt and e-Golf have departure based scheduling that actually works as expected.

 

[MXWing]

@MorrisonHiker

Realistically, we shouldn't be using the coldest part of the state ever recorded. My realistic lowest is 35F, even though your map says -43C.

 

[MorrisonHiker]

@MorrisonHiker

Realistically, we shouldn't be using the coldest part of the state ever recorded. My realistic lowest is 35F, even though your map says -43C.

I was replying to the post that said it never gets to -40 in the Continental US. It's more common in some states that others. Fortunately, the coldest I can remember recently was -25F.

 

[j5555]

You can definitely start charging from the app. When the car is plugged it, there is a button to start charging under the charging section.

The app used to say when the schedule charge time was, now for some reason it says charging stopped. Not sure why.

If I select in the car start charging at say 4am, agreed my phone use to show the scheduled charging time and an option to start charging now. This is no longer the case my phone simply shows either "charging stopped" or "charging complete." if it has run through the schedule. I no longer show any button to "start charging."

 

[StellarRat]

My 2011 Leaf could be set to start HVAC at a certain time of day to heat/cool the cabin pre-flight. It used shore power for that function so the battery wouldn't be drained. Tesla needs to add that same functionally to the M3 along with battery pre-heat on a schedule. That would stretch your range a bit in cold weather.

 

[j5555]

I'm in the Northern burbs as well and I wanted to know how your experience with the Comed Hourly rate program is working? I've considered switching to it as the rates at night are very low, but I want to know how the summer afternoons treat you when you still want to cool down the house.

Just have been on it since early Nov so hard to tell any difference yet. I'm guessing there will be little difference until next summer and that is the sticking point because they can jack up rates when you need to cool your house. The plus side is that by then I can go back to charging M3 at midnight or so and not be concerned about drain or battery temp in the morning. The down side is how much you may end up paying for a/c on a 90-degree day. They do offer the ability to opt on immediately (and then you cannot go back on to plan for one year) but I'm not sure if you have to wait out the current monthly billing period. Bottom line is I'll have to watch carefully late may and early June and then determine if it makes sense or not. My bill for past summer was not significantly higher than prior summer with no Tesla. I figured for the winter there was little risk switching to the hourly rate program.

 

[j5555]

Ironically enough... just got 44.2 update and ios app home screen for car now shows "charging scheduled, charging will start at 07:00." Actual charging tab also now has "start charging" button once again.

 

[strider]

You really shouldn't cite the RAV4 EV as an example of good departure based charge scheduling. It's really quite terrible. The Volt and e-Golf have departure based scheduling that actually works as expected.

I didn't say it was good I used it as an example of a Tesla drivetrain with that functionality.