The best answer is Tesla should build more stalls where there is likely to be congestion. That is part of Tesla's promise and the reason we paid excessive amounts of money for the car, to subsidize the charging. Not to make charging stressful or painful or expensive. It's easy for Tesla to blame the consumer and put Tesla owners against each other by artificially limiting the resource. It's classy to build more stalls where there is high traffic.
Improving Supercharger Availability $0.40 idle fee
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Just wodnering if you have ever been to a congested SC anywhere in NJ. I have not, but then again I rarely use SCs
Don't knock it until you've tried it. You don't know what you're missing.
MorrisonHiker
S 100D 2021.4.12
You could probably get by with a prepaid data plan or even NO plan and just use wifi. I have a prepaid data plan where I pay $13 per GB. No monthly charge and the data never expires. I've only bought 1 GB since March since I use wifi everywhere I go. There's also FreedomPop and a few others where you can get a phone for free or really cheap and a small amount of data free per month. You might also consider a cheap Kindle tablet from Woot for $30. Again, no ongoing fees and it would work for you wherever there's wifi.
I will merely respond to the new response to the idea of Tesla guaranteeing the earliest start of idle charges, as it seems to not have been discussed before.
1) I do admit my suggestion is based on the notion that Tesla would do an increasingly best-effort estimate of the Supercharging time. Your suggestion that Tesla would make underhanded changes did not occur to me. It is possible given recent events it should have occurred to me. It is possible Tesla could be dishonest about it.
2) I still maintain having a guaranteed earliest possible time you must return to the car would be helpful in planning the break. You would still have access to the phone app to improve that knowledge, but at least you could plan beforehand how far you can venture. Avoiding the charges is, also, arguably more important for satisfaction than the occasional event of returning too early.
Thanks. WiF only is a pain. It's been mostly useful for me at destination chargers, where I can get up move the car at night. (Yes, I do that.) There's also cheapo tablets and T-Mobile's free data for life, which I may go for since my existing WiFi tablet is about dead. I might go that route just as a fun gadget. The only SC I ever over-stay on is Lake Charles, where we walk 20 minutes over to the casinos, so the whole issue isn't a biggie for me. (I've only ever seen 1 Tesla at that location out of 6 stops.)
Yes Tesla should build more where there is likely to be congestion, and it's been doing that. You don't hear of congestion at Hawthorne or Harris Ranch or Tejon any more. But no, we did not pay excessive amounts of money for the car to subsidize the charging.
You were smarter than me and went with the 60 kWh so I think you got a good value for your money. I wanted a little more performance and paid $150k for a slightly better car (but very similar overall experience). If I had to do it again I'd consider the 60 kWh for a better value more on-par with the actual drive-train (wheels, brakes, suspension - which are not to the level of most $150k cars, and I have owned several).
patyoungsc
Member
So, when taking a road trip just stand by your car for 30-45 minutes for every few hours you drive. That makes perfect sense, hard to believe that everyone hasn't given up on their ICE and gone electric to get all this quality time standing in a parking lot.
Garlan Garner
Banned
You could....sit..inside ...the car...if you don't....like standing.
No second thought...I would suggest that you go to the restaurant for a few hours, then a little sight seeing tour.....your car will be fine when you get back.
There is middle ground between sitting in the car and going on a sightseeing tour.
It is certainly a very compelling argument that EV adoption benefits from a reasonable activity possibility during charging (and is hampered by lack thereof). Otherwise why not just take the ICE. Charging is an unpleasant stop anyway, forcing people not to use that time constructively makes it even more unpleasant.
Now, it is certainly an OK argument to discuss and disagree on what is a reasonable time away from a charging EV. (To me the long and unpredictable nature of the event suggests a reasonable time would be something to the tune of charge + 30-60 minutes, unless a charge prediction can be given beforehand that people can rely on and be expected to follow...)
Totally agree. Stopping to supercharge is a waste of time. Anxiously watching the clock will not add to the experience. I'd rather take my other cars. They also need to feel loved. Keep the Tesla for local commute.
I bought the car because it is novel and mostly for fun and because I can. I don't want to be stressed out supercharging on road trips.
I bought the car because it is novel and mostly for fun and because I can. I don't want to be stressed out supercharging on road trips.
Ulmo
Active Member
Grr. Information owners and drivers do not have.
Today, coming from almost the swamps up by Hwy 4, I became the person they are waiting for at the SuperCharger for my second time. It's not a very interesting story, and yet I still seem to have found a way to ramble on about it. Not much to see here unless you need to pass time.
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Tried to go to DMV. Turns out, it was one of the DMV's that the people don't demand better service, so I left in a jiffy. Went to a Nissan and paid to use their EVGO Chademo. It was slow, at around 30kW (4900Wh/(10minutes/60minutes/1hour) to get 19% - 26%), but it gave me breathing room to make it to Dublin, a congested SuperCharger. As soon as I arrived, the SC kW made the Chademo seem good; to go from 12% to 55% averaged around 52kW (27900wH/(32minutes/60minutes/1hour)). I should have stayed at the Chademo longer. I knew it would be a bit of time before I had enough charge (the Tesla map navigation planner told me as much), so I took off on foot and asked the store staff where food was, got free coffee, expressed how that's a free perk in its august (since Model 3 is coming), and set out to the gun store snack counter and then Safeway for what turned out to be some of the best premade sandwiches at any Safeway ever (from my point of view).
I noticed how walking during charge events is a new way to get exercise, and walked back to my car. There was a line (of Teslas waiting to SuperCharge, two deep).
I decided to get to the point at which I could make it home at around 10%, so sat in my car SuperCharging for another 5 minutes with a growing line of people waiting to charge behind me. When I thought I had enough buffer to reach home at 10%, I unplugged at a state of charge of 55% at Dublin, backed out immediately (didn't even adjust my sitting position in my car or anything) so as to give room to the next person in line, and left. As I drove by, I noticed the line had grown to four. My planning is getting much better: I arrived home with 12%.
I think I balanced my buffer space with the waiting needs of the people behind me quite well. Too bad there wasn't a Chademo in my one stop halfway between Dublin and home, otherwise, I would have been able to leave 5 minutes earlier from the SuperCharger and just fill whatever buffer I needed at the Chademo. Even better: I could have eaten less, and left the SuperCharger after only 15 or so minutes, rather than the full 32 minutes I ended up staying. I could have added the buffer space to the halfway point from the SC to the second homebound leg once I got to the midway charging point, and saved time charging. Instead, I had to build a bigger buffer for a longer throw all the way from the SC to home AND the actual energy needed to make it all the way there.
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Did you notice something there? The behavior modification going on right now in my mind in California is one of desiring, preferring, and wanting to use Chademo over SuperChargers. I have wondered more than once if this was part of Tesla's plan, now that there's a huge EVGO network of Fast DC chargers sitting all over the state relatively underutilized.
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I appreciate the informative story @Ulmo. That is certainly the kind of detailed analysis and enthusiasm some of us early adopters and tech-heads love.
Unfortunately it is also a major hassle and a turn-off for a lot of people. They can not be expected to be able to plan as well as you do, realistically. Add idle charges to the mix and it gets even more of a hassle for many of these kinds of regular folks...
This is a complex question with no simple answers...
Unfortunately it is also a major hassle and a turn-off for a lot of people. They can not be expected to be able to plan as well as you do, realistically. Add idle charges to the mix and it gets even more of a hassle for many of these kinds of regular folks...
This is a complex question with no simple answers...
Garlan Garner
Banned
Garlan Garner
Banned
I see English words.....but.....
Anyhoo. Please take your ICE car. Charging has never been unpleasant for me. Receiving something for free is never unpleasant for me. Anyway, I think you should take your ICE car. You are never forced to not use that time constructively. There's reading....texting....anyway...as you suggest, you should take your ICE. Less SC congestion that way.
Have you tried it? I find that long distance travel in a Tesla is more enjoyable than in an ICE. I arrive more relaxed. But I see you don't get the whole EV thing.
I agree with you but the POV being expressed by @oktane is more prevalent in the 99% of people that don't own EV's yet.
The problem is not me. Trust me.
I will take the EV and suffer whatever shenanigans and hoops to jump through Tesla invents. I am of the early adopter class.
The problem is the mainstream we all are trying to convince into EVs. There the obstacle removal is a perfectly valid debate IMO.
Ulmo's story is the type of anecdote that will dissuade the mainstream from considering an EV.
So Tesla absolutely needs to solve the problem of supercharger congestion. Thus the idle fee and no more free unlimited for cars ordered in 2017. But they need to fix the slow charging problem at intensively used chargers before it gets aggravated by another summer.
So Tesla absolutely needs to solve the problem of supercharger congestion. Thus the idle fee and no more free unlimited for cars ordered in 2017. But they need to fix the slow charging problem at intensively used chargers before it gets aggravated by another summer.
InsaneDriver
Member
Basically, Tesla is recognizing the problem that is happening today. At busy SC'a there are individuals leaving their cars in stalls way beyond what is necessary without any consideration for others. People aren't policing themselves, so Tesla is stepping in and making an attempt.
At least they are trying to do something about it, raise a little awareness. Time will tell how effective it is
However, as these pages and pages of posts show, there are folks who don't care about anyone but themselves. I would expect that to continue.
Don't be surprised when people act like people.
At least they are trying to do something about it, raise a little awareness. Time will tell how effective it is
However, as these pages and pages of posts show, there are folks who don't care about anyone but themselves. I would expect that to continue.
Don't be surprised when people act like people.
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