In 6-seat config, middle-row seats need to be moved toward center

[gfb107]

Got to test drive a Model X in Raleigh, NC yesterday. The driving experience was phenomenal! The front row is very comfortable and spacious. I'm a big guy at 6'4" and 280+, with a long back (only 34" inseam). I had plenty of headroom and legroom, and loved the unobstructed view through the expansive windshield.

We've ordered the 6-seat config, knowing that the 3rd row seats would be tight, and used infrequently. Even so the room in the 3rd row was a bit disappointing, but tolerable.

The 2nd row seats are quite comfortable, and when pushed all the way back the leg room is good. Head room is also pretty good, thanks to the windows above. Would like the ability to tilt back a bit more. The arm rests molded into the doors are nice, but we missed not having any on the opposite side of the seat.

The big problem is that the seats are positioned too far to the outside, so when the Falcon Wing Doors are closed it is quite cramped on one side. For me it is very uncomfortable. My 5'10" son felt cramped. My 5'7" daughter did not feel cramped.

Moving the seats 1 or 2 inches toward the middle would make a huge difference. I really hope there's eventually a way to do that. I can imagine 2 ways to accomplish it:

1. An off-center connection in the mounting bracket on the bottom of the seat to the monopost.
2. Am offset bend in the monopost. Something like this:
   

Have to be careful not to move them too much as then the middle edge of the skylight might interfere with head room.

 

[loganintx]

Why would someone's height matter for this. Wouldn't it be more their width that caused the FWD to touch them? Is there a place to rest your arm on the FWD?

 

[goneskiian]

Yes, there's an armrest on the FWD. There definitely needs to be one on the inboard side of the seat too though. I also agree that those 2nd row seats could be moved in a bit and I'm 6'1" and 200 lbs.

 

[gfb107]

Yes, width is the primary concern. Generally speaking, and assuming similar body type, a taller person also has wider shoulders. My son and I have similar height to shoulder width ratios, so comparing heights is meaningful. If I'm 10% taller than my son, my shoulders are also 10% wider than my son's shoulders.

Why would someone's height matter for this. Wouldn't it be more their width that caused the FWD to touch them? Is there a place to rest your arm on the FWD?

Yes, there is an armrest on the Falcon Wing Door.

 

[Refie]

Yes, there's an armrest on the FWD. There definitely needs to be one on the inboard side of the seat too though. I also agree that those 2nd row seats could be moved in a bit and I'm 6'1" and 200 lbs.

I fully agree on this. I'm 1,92M and 115 Kg (do the math). The FWD will push me to the middle of the car...

 

[vandacca]

I find that looking at the design evolution helps to explain how we got here and what can and can't be done.

I'm fairly confident that the 6-seat option was a "band-aid" design solution to address cargo capacity, and it wasn't in the original plans. Removing a seat is a simple enough work-around to lack of cargo space (due to rigid seats), but I can't imagine Tesla right now eliminating the 3-seat option in the 2nd row. Therefore, whatever they do, they would want a simple solution that allows for both 2 and 3 seats in the 2nd row, otherwise it complicates production and causes more headaches for this tiny company.

IMO, the best short-term solution is to provide a center console for the 2nd row with built in arm rests. It will balance out the space in the seats so that it doesn't feel like you're being pressed up against the fwd. Also, having the arm rest will make it much more comfortable.

A long-term solution could be to re-introduce the 3-seat 2nd row with a folding design. That way you could only fold down the middle seat and have a 6-seat option or keep it up for a 7-seat option. People wouldn't have to order one or the other, they could have both. And it would have the advantage of folding down the complete 2nd row, just like they promised 4+ years ago.

 

[grommet]

Previous similar thread: Why 2nd row seats seam tight on the outside hip and shoulder

 

[swesson]

I like this suggestion and hope Tesla is listening. I also like the 2nd row center console idea. The only thing that isn't feasible is making more room for the 3rd row. The only way anyone will ever be truly happy with the 3rd row is to increase the overall length of the car to well over 204" (6 more inches) which would prevent it from fitting in most home garages. This is my 7th vehicle that's had a 3rd row and I think Tesla got it as right as you can and still fit it in the garage.

 

[gfb107]

I know how the 6-seat configuration came about.

For me, it is far more important to create more space between the closed FWDs and the 2nd row seats than to add center-side arm rests. A modified monopole or mounting bracket seem rather simple ways to create that space.

A 2nd row with 3 seats would never work for us, folding or otherwise. We need more space on the outside, so the middle seat would have to be even more narrow than it already is, to the point it won't even be a seat.

A center console might be a good way to add arm rests without entirely replacing the seats, but thats secondary.

 

[gfb107]

I don't mean to suggest that the 2nd row seats should be shifted to the middle in every 6-seat Model X. I don't see any reason it couldn't be an option or a post-delivery modification.

 

[vandacca]

I don't mean to suggest that the 2nd row seats should be shifted to the middle in every 6-seat Model X. I don't see any reason it couldn't be an option or a post-delivery modification.

I don't believe that the 2nd row outer seats will ever get shifted towards the center (in a 6-seat configuration), because that would require a pretty extensive design change that wouldn't be compatible with a 7-seat layout. But if Tesla won't offer a post-delivery adjustment, it's possible that some third party company may offer some kind of adapter to shift the seats closer towards the center.

 

[ohmman]

Just to chime in with the alternate opinion - I like them where they are because they maximize my flex space between the seats. If they were closer together, I couldn't fit my cooler and other road-trip worthy items between the kids. And that last word is the reason it's not an issue for us - our kids sit in the back, not adults. So obviously for us, the delivered config works best.. but I see the OP's point.

 

[Colby Boles]

I like the idea of moving these seats in medially too, but as I have mentioned in a couple of other threads, aside from any technical / safety issue, I don't think it will work out well if your second row passengers are very tall as their heads will already be up in the FWD "sunroof" cavities but will start to bump up against the medial side of the upper FWD frame. I seems that this head space was designed to be centered around the current seat location.

 

[goneskiian]

I like the idea of moving these seats in medially too, but as I have mentioned in a couple of other threads, aside from any technical / safety issue, I don't think it will work out well if your second row passengers are very tall as their heads will already be up in the FWD "sunroof" cavities but will start to bump up against the medial side of the upper FWD frame. I seems that this head space was designed to be centered around the current seat location.

Great point.

 

[Zaphod]

I'm sure any change in the middle row seat position would require crash testing to validate it and I don't see Tesla spending time and money on something like that at this point.

 

[achen]

A few months ago I went to the "Meet Model X" event and be one of the few who got to test drive the Model X. The vehicle we drove was 6-seat configuration. I believe the positioning of the seats are perfectly fine, I think they are in the very same position as 5/7 seats configuration for the reason of so that the messengers could get on / off the car easily.

But I think a BIG bummer is that those seats are so independent and comfortable, yet lacking the arm rests. If there ere arm rests I will strongly consider it, but since there isn't, I still stick with 7-seats configuration.

 

[ohmman]

But I think a BIG bummer is that those seats are so independent and comfortable, yet lacking the arm rests. If there ere arm rests I will strongly consider it, but since there isn't, I still stick with 7-seats configuration.

The 7-seat configuration also has no arm rests. Or am I missing something?

 

[achen]

The 7-seat configuration also has no arm rests. Or am I missing something?

Of course there is no arm rest for 7-seat configuration, I meant for how far away the seats are positioned, and the available space in the 6-seat, they could have put arm rests on like Mercedes did in R-Class:


(If picture does not show, check teh following link: http://static.usnews.rankingsandrev...07111/2009_mercedes_benz_r_class_rearseat.jpg)

 

[ohmman]

Of course there is no arm rest for 7-seat configuration, I meant for how far away the seats are positioned, and the available space in the 6-seat, they could have put arm rests on like Mercedes did in R-Class:

Got it, you're not the first to have this opinion - I just never fully understood why someone would ditch the 6 seater due to arm rests and get the 7 seater, which also has no arm rests. But I think what you're saying is that if you aren't going to get arm rests, you might as well get the extra seat.

I prioritized the additional space as the benefit to the 6-seater over the 7. But as I mentioned, you're certainly not the first to take the approach you're discussing!

 

[aesculus]

The 7-seat configuration also has no arm rests. Or am I missing something?

Being a knuckle dragger you think you would understand.

I think it's the difference between having your hand/arms laying next to you or drooping down to the floor.