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Info on the Blink DC chargers.

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by dwhite, Jan 29, 2013.

  1. dwhite

    dwhite Member

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    Can't get an answer from Blink or Tesla. Can the Tesla use the Blink Fast Charge DC chargers? These seem to have the same rating (80A) as the Tesla Superchargers, but I can't find the details.

    Do Charjit or Chargepoint have level 3 (DC) chargers? They don't advertise any>
     
  2. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    No these are CHAdeMO chargers. Right now the only High powered DC chargers (Level 3) that will work with the Model S are the Tesla Superchargers.
     
  3. gaswalla

    gaswalla P4201/85/airsusp/pano/19i

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    That is correct. The L3 Blinks at this point are really only for LEAFs (and according to Nissan, using them can cause battery damage to the LEAF due to it's primitive battery technology).

    --former LEAF owner
     
  4. ChadS

    ChadS Petroleum is for sissies

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    #4 ChadS, Jan 29, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2013
    Elsupreme and gaswalla are correct; the Blink DC chargers are only for Leafs and i-MiEVs (and in Japan, Toyota's EVs; but in the US Toyota does not allow fast charging of any kind).

    Nissan did initially suggest only doing one DC fast charge per day in their owner's manual. But Plug In America's survey showed no battery differences between owners that did frequent DC charges and those that did not. Even before that survey, Nissan took out the line in their manual that said you should only DC charge once per day. I think they had just been being ultra-careful when they put that in. They probably hadn't tested as much as Mitsubishi had.

    Tesla can't use the CHAdeMO chargers (I haven't seen any from Chargepoint; but there are several manufacturers and installers) until they release the CHAdeMO adapter that they are working on. The CHAdeMO chargers are 48kW (well, most of them; some are 25kW to avoid demand charges) by the way; that is no 90kW Supercharger, but it is much faster than the 19kW max for a Level 2 240V 80A EVSE. There are also a lot more CHAdeMO stations than Superchargers, and Nissan has promised to greatly increase their numbers this year.

    The other type of DC Fast Charger is the SAE's combined J1772 plug. But the only one of those I know of that's been installed is at VW's research center in Belmont CA. If they do get installed, the protocol is reportedly very similar to what Tesla uses, so theoretically a "dumb" adapter will be able to allow the Model S to use them. But no word on when those will be installed or when an adapter will be available.

    So it all boils down to what Elsupreme said...the only DC chargers to worry about for now are the Superchargers.
     
  5. Puyallup Bill

    Puyallup Bill Member

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    Where did that "primitive battery technology" phrase come from?

    If your post is correct, seems strange that Nissan is actively promoting CHAdeMO chargers.
     
  6. gaswalla

    gaswalla P4201/85/airsusp/pano/19i

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    Lack of battery temperature management system: in fact, using CHAdeMO chargers themselves heats up the LEAF battery (consistently get 1-2 bars of temperature increase on the LEAF battery temp guage) which then destroys the battery itself (decreased capacity). It is quite strange that Nissan is promoting CHAdeMO, but that is consistent with Nissan's misdirected approach to marketing the car. Simply using the car in Arizona/Texas/New Mexico/So Cal has resulted in significant battery degradation over the course of months due to the ambient temperature. I call that primitive battery technology, but that is my opinion.
     
  7. jomo25

    jomo25 P4398

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    Perhaps primitive battery management technology is a more apt description.
     
  8. StellarRat

    StellarRat New Member

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    True, but if the Leaf's battery temperature stays at or below six bars you're fine. I've fast charged three times in a single day and never had the temperature rise above five bars (out of 12, if I remember right.) You'd probably only have a problem if you charged multiple times in very hot weather. The Leaf does have simple air cooled battery heat management technology, but remember it's very affordable.
     
  9. tpoltron

    tpoltron Member

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    Beyond and CHAdeMO adapter availability, there the question of Blink's bankruptcy and whether their purchaser will keep those chargers active. I hope they do for more fast options, for more EVs.
     
  10. drees

    drees Active Member

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    That's only possible if it's either winter time or you live in the Pacific Northwest.

    For me in southern California I've never seen less than 5 temp bars and through the OBD II reader it's only about 10F away from 6 temp bars during the day here in the middle of "winter".

    Each QC pushes up the battery temp 10-15F - so I'm really just a single QC away from 6 temp bars. From 6-7 temp bars it's about a 25F range, so I might only get away with 2 QCs in a day before I'm up to 7 temp bars depending on what temperature the battery starts at unless I can really space the QCs out so the battery has time to cool off (and then it will only cool off if the battery is significantly hotter than ambient!).
     
  11. liuping

    liuping Active Member

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    CarCharging has been making progress repairing all the broken Blink chargers left by ECOtality.

    They sent someone to my house last week for our house charger (for the Volt), and recently a local public Blink station that had a broken touch screen for ages was repaired.
     
  12. StellarRat

    StellarRat New Member

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    That still wouldn't put you close to the "red zone". There doesn't seem to be a lot of info out there about what the battery temperature gauge is actually telling you. An average reading of six bars or less is what I read is the best for long battery life. I'm not sure if the battery is damaged if you go above that once in a while. Anyway, my driving habits are usually one QC then the car sits for a long time because I've arrived at my destination, so the battery has a chance to cool down. I probably wouldn't attempt a trip that took two or more QC's consecutively because we're talking over 180 miles one way at that point. Something the Leaf simply wasn't made for. That's one of the beauties of the Tesla S (range). I'm saving up for a G3 or an S.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Ecotality was taken over by another company. They've got all the chargers where I live back and running reliabilty. What I'm not happy about is 5 bucks for a quick charge. That makes driving my Leaf nearly as expenisve as a high mileage ICE when I need them.
     
  13. drees

    drees Active Member

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    The hotter the battery is, the faster it degrades. Of course, if the battery is cold, it doesn't hold as much energy and regenerative braking is limited. Arrhenious' Equation can be used to estimate how temperature affects rate of capacity loss - for every 10C increase in temperature rate of capacity loss will double.

    Yep, anything more than 2 QCs away in a single day, and you are not driving the right vehicle. I really wish I could justify a Model S - the practical side of me won't do it.

    Lucky you that they are all working reliably. Around here there are still stations that have been broken for months - since before CarChargingGroup bought Ecotality/Blink.
     

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