SageBrush
REJECT Fascism
You asked earlier for quants
'cond' is the condensor;
'evap' is the evaporator
The efficiency change is exponential
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Installation advice for heat pump water heater
- Thread starter arnolddeleon
- Start date
'cond' is the condensor;
'evap' is the evaporator
The efficiency change is exponential
Thanks for the tip about the weight. I remember empty water heaters as being relatively light, but those are the old school kind.
The base of the existing platform is 24" square. So to get something larger 50 gallons will require a platform modification. Removing the platform completely is an option but probably not ideal. The better solution is build a new platform that accommodates the concrete curb just like the existing platform. Basically what @Dave EV said.
I know I'm late to this and I haven't read all of the posts but here goes. I will be putting an 80 galling Rheem in. I just wish I could find it on sale. $2200 is a lot and then there is installation. My current water heater is a 50 gallon gas unit. However, the first hour rating is 80 gallons. The first hour rating for the Rheem is 87 gallons. Hence the reason for going with the larger unit. My big reason for doing this is that after Thursday (heat pump install), it will be my only gas appliance. That means I can tell the gas company to discontinue service. That alone is worth just under $50/month. Then there is the environmental joy of not using gas and running mostly off of solar.
You might want to try the Richmond 80 gallon hybrid heat pump water heater. It’s just a rebranded Rheem unit. It’s currently selling for $1779.99 after mail-in rebate on Menards.com
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
There seems to be a bit of weirdness with the Home Depot website. The Rheem HPWH appears to go on sale in some zip codes but not others. I'm showing the 80gal version for $1899 and the new ProTerra for $1999. IIRC I've seen the 80gal for as little as $1500 but that's only the older version.
We installed an AO Smith heat pump water heater three years ago and it has performed flawlessly. However, many find the compressor sound when operating (a high pitch whine) to be annoying. Not a problem for us, because the unit is in our basement which is generally unoccupied. It would be an issue for us if it were located in an occupied area. You don't want your renter switching to resistance heating only because of intrusive noise.
darhall993
Member
Kind of late to this conversation, but I have a rental property with 65 gallon Rheem HPWH, it been amazing. I also have a 50 gallon Rheem unit with a tempering valve, we had a size constraint as well. If we set the unit for 135 it can provide 4-5 showers in a short period. We have a 3 bedroom and 3 bath at the beach and it works well during the evening rush when folks are getting ready for dinner. Let me know if u have specific questions
Thanks for sharing your experience. It's reassuring. I'm just waiting for the delivery of 65 gallon Rheem from Home Depot. I think I can skip the tempering valve at that size. I also ended up choosing the model without the automatic leak detection. I already have a "Flo by Moen" installed on the house so I have catastrophic water failure protection already. My plumber looked into sourcing the units themselves through their supply houses but they were more expensive than retail model. I also discovered that the Rheem models that can be installed on a smaller circuit (basically the ones with smaller resistance heaters) can only be purchased through plumbing supply places. I believe for other water heaters there usually was difference between the "pro" line and consumer line. I'm expecting there isn't the same gap with the heat pump models.
I can find last years model but it isn’t available online and isn’t available within 100 miles. Oh well...I may break down soon. I am eager to tell the gas company to disconnect the house.
Quick update. Water heater is installed and running. I'm limiting it to heat pump mode only for now (using a 20A circuit since that all I had easily available) Still waiting to get the electrician scheduled for the panel upgrade.
I was successful in securing a reservation for the Silicon Valley Clean Energy water heat pump rebates. They'll kicking $2K for the water heater/installation and another $1K for a panel upgrade.
Home Depot delivery communication/status wasn't great. They ended up delivering it at the rental without notifying me. It sat on the driveway for a couple of days before I learned it was there (there was also a communication snafu between the tenants and my property manager).
It looks like they automatic shutoff valve is an external add on. The connectors are there and the configuration can be set tell it if it has it or not.
Devices that are configured initially via WiFi can be a pain to setup if your phone is a Pixel. The smart WiFi switching on the Pixel gets in the way.
I was successful in securing a reservation for the Silicon Valley Clean Energy water heat pump rebates. They'll kicking $2K for the water heater/installation and another $1K for a panel upgrade.
Home Depot delivery communication/status wasn't great. They ended up delivering it at the rental without notifying me. It sat on the driveway for a couple of days before I learned it was there (there was also a communication snafu between the tenants and my property manager).
It looks like they automatic shutoff valve is an external add on. The connectors are there and the configuration can be set tell it if it has it or not.
Devices that are configured initially via WiFi can be a pain to setup if your phone is a Pixel. The smart WiFi switching on the Pixel gets in the way.
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
It's crazy here in NM. Gas is ~$0.023/therm which is equivalent to $0.008/kWh. So it's all or nothing. The only benefit to electrification is to electrify everything to save the $15/mo connection fee. It's essentially an all-you-can-burn CH4 buffet. I'm waiting for someone to realize it's cheaper to buy a generator than buy electricity from the grid....
Wow, that is basically free! What does electricity cost? Natural gas here is around $1.10/therm. And yeah, a generator could generate electricity for about 3c/kWh with gas prices at that level.
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
Oops... misplaced a decimal. The therm price is ~$0.23 but the kWh rate is correct. There's ~29kWh in a therm. Electricity is ~$0.10/kWh. I expect the price to rebound eventually because they're really selling it at a loss. The low price is an artifact of wall street speculation and the fact that gas is a 'waste product' of oil extraction from fracking.
SageBrush
REJECT Fascism
Here is my latest Bill detail from the NM gas company in Albuquerque, NM
I paid 21.1 cents a therm for the fuel, but in addition I paid 16.6 cents a therm for 'distribution' and 6.3 cents a therm for 'transmission.'
That adds up to 43 cents a therm. Cheap, but I easily lose 1/4 of the heat in the furnace and whole house ducting so I estimate 43/0.75 = 57.3 cents a therm or ~ 2 cents a kWh.
Much cheaper than heating by resistance heating but not a big difference by heat pump if I figure on a COP of 4 since my local electricity is ~ 11 cents a kWh. The way to make this all pencil out nicely is to start with electricity from PV, and run it through a heat pump.
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
Ah... so ~2x more expensive than I thought after the add-ons. Even a heat pump with a COP of ~4 would be slightly more expensive if you're buying from the grid. The biggest savings is the $11.57/mo access fee. As you say, the best way to make it pencil is heat pumps + PV
. What sucks is the savings are marginal unless you can go 100% electric, just reducing gas use doesn't really save much.
SageBrush
REJECT Fascism
Yep, but just going electric is not going to make accounting wives happy. It has to be PV electric.Ah... so ~2x more expensive than I thought after the add-ons. Even a heat pump with a COP of ~4 would be slightly more expensive if you're buying from the grid. The biggest savings is the $11.57/mo access fee. As you say, the best way to make it pencil is heat pumps + PV
Depending where you live, the same can be said for EV. However, EV or heat pump with PV is a great deal.
SageBrush
REJECT Fascism
We have only discussed heat pump water heaters in this thread but the right house layout and some plumbing skills makes a heat recovery pipe an attractive alternative, or it can be used in conjunction with a heat pump water heater that has space constraints.
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