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Insurance Total Loss P85D

Discussion in 'Model S' started by Russell, Mar 31, 2018.

  1. Russell

    Russell Supporting Member

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    Hi Guys and Gals I need your help in getting the highest value for my totaled P85D.

    Just over 2 weeks ago I was hit by an uninsured driver and my insurance company wants to total my car.
    The repair estimate came in at $43.6k.
    They provided me with a market valuation report created by CCC Information Services. But it has a ton of flaws in it that lowers the value of my car.

    Without checking with me, they list my car as NOT having Pano Roof, Tech Package with Autopilot, Next Gen Seats and others. I got that cleared up by sending the claims adjustor my vehicle configuration sheet so now I am waiting for a new report.


    In preparation of the new report, I have been going over the old one with a fine tooth comb.

    The old report states they will first search for comparables in my zip code (San Jose CA). The 3 comps they provided are from a private owner in Columbus GA, a used car lot in Highland Park IL and an Audi dealership in Mission Viejo CA.
    Shouldn't I want them to limit their search to the high priced SF Bay Area?

    Can I insist they not use comps from private owners especially ones that don't list
    a VIN?
    There is little to no way of confirming they own a comparable car, the condition it is in or if they even have a car to sell.

    I noticed they are depreciating options at different rates.
    Next Gen seats they are subtracting 43% of its original value. Tech Package w/Autopilot 53%, Smart Air Suspension 60%.
    Shouldn't options be depreciated at the same rate?

    The report uses naming conventions from sellers ads that don't match the names from Tesla.
    I'm being dinged for not having parking sensors, leather seats, premium interior package, premium interior lighting, performance leather and extended napa leather.

    I am confident I can prove they should not ding me for the parking sensors and leather seats since my car has Autopilot and Next Gen Seats, but I'm not sure about the other items.
    Does anybody have a list of options that were originally available for P85Ds?
    I'm trying to find out those "other items" were included in the base price, bundled in some package or just poor wording on the sellers part and I should not be dinged for it.

    Thanks,

    Russell
     
  2. GatorGuy

    GatorGuy Member

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    • Informative x 2
  3. Az_Rael

    Az_Rael Supporting Member

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    I went through this. Do you still have your original purchase records from Tesla? They should be in your My Tesla page. That will show the car as originally spec’d when you bought it. If you can get a copy of your original window sticker that is even better (sometimes Tesla can retrieve those as well).

    What I did when I got my first low offer from the insurance (they weren’t even listing my car as a “P”), I went through every option and listed what my car was equipped with and provided the purchase documentation as proof. I also tallied up all of the upgrades I had done after purchase and provided documentation of those. So, I had upgraded from 19” to 21” wheels, added a center console, LTE upgrade, window tint, clear wrap, etc.

    Once I provided all that info, I requested they reevaluate my total offer. They chewed on it for a while, and came back with a price I was happy with.


    You also have the right to request your own appraisal, although you will pay the cost for that. The way it works, is you hire your own appraiser, the insurance company does theirs, and then they meet up and agree to a value if they are different. You then get that amount.
     
    • Informative x 2
  4. whitex

    whitex Well-Known Member

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    @Russell

    First, I feel for you loss of a P85D with plus suspension. Hard to replace those as people (like me) are holding onto them. If you had the L upgrade, that makes it even harder to replace.

    Second, the biggest thing to remember is that it's a negotiation between you and the insurance company. That means you don't have accept the first offer, which you seem to already know. Like any negotiation, keep in mind things like "I demand you use comparables in CA" don't work as well as "is it possible to use comparables from CA" or "if I buy from that other state, do you guys pay for shipping and insurance"? I can tell you from recent experience the answer to the latter is probable "no", but when they have to tell you "no" it count's for you indirectly, they are more likely to be amenable on other things. The worst thing you can do is threaten litigation as that would likely trigger a whole new process for the insurance company (you'll likely be talking through lawyers from then on). The second worst is piss off the other side by being a hard-ass. Either of those can result in a prolonged process and no good will from the other side. As the old proverb says - "You get more bees with honey than vinegar".

    Third, why don't you guide them to use P85D CPO prices as comparables? There are 37 P85D CPO's available as of today, You should be able to find one close to yours, or find the closest and add/subtract the options.
     
    • Informative x 1
  5. Russell

    Russell Supporting Member

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    Thank you for all of your suggestions.

    I did send the adjuster a list of CPOs from Tesla. I hope they use it.

    Odd thing, the past 2 days I have received calls from Insurance Auto Auction asking me to release the car to them so they can sell it.
    The problem is GEICO still hasn't sent me the updated valuation report.
     
  6. P85Dave

    P85Dave Member

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    Sorry about your loss and hope no one was hurt. Tell them P85Ds go for $101,000 :p

    Inventory Search | Tesla

    What value have they quoted you for your car?
     
  7. Russell

    Russell Supporting Member

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    $53,868.
     
  8. whitex

    whitex Well-Known Member

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    Where did they find a comparable at this price?
     
  9. Az_Rael

    Az_Rael Supporting Member

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    Based on my experience, the "comps" weren't P85D's I would bet. Tesla's don't fall neatly into the insurance tools to do car valuations.
     
    • Like x 1
  10. RogerHScott

    RogerHScott Active Member

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    Fwiw, I can tell you from my recent experience that that repair estimate is probably very low, so if it was enough to trigger totaling than totaling was certainly your destiny.
     
  11. mattack4000

    mattack4000 Active Member

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    This is what happen when you use a company like Geico.
     
    • Like x 1
  12. Russell

    Russell Supporting Member

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    #12 Russell, Apr 6, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2018
    They got them from listings on the web. A private seller in Columbus GA, a used car lot in Highland Park IL and an Audi dealership in Mission Viejo CA.
    They got the asking price from those cars then subtracted for the options my car didn't have. They listed my car as having NO options so their numbers were way off.

    That is my experience as well.

    The comps from the used car lot and Audi dealer had included VINs so I was able to at least view the listings and do a cursory check that the cars were indeed P85Ds. The comp from the private seller did not have a VIN, but there was a phone# (706) 681-6453.
    I googled that and the search result showed an ad from autotrader. It lists the car as a 2014 Model S Signature Performance with 53500 miles. The comp listed the same mileage so I knew that was the ad they used. I did not get to see the actual ad only the google search result.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't the Signature Model S only sold in 2012 so there's no possible way it could be confused with a D?
     
  13. Russell

    Russell Supporting Member

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    I wonder if Warren knows how his company operates.
     
  14. D.E.

    D.E. Uncorked

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    EV-CPO.com - Tesla New, Used, and CPO Inventory Listings
    39 P85D listed

    Price Range: $71,800 to $97,300 Average Price: $83,138 Standard Deviation: $5306

    That should give you something to go on. You might see if you can get closer by specifying the equipment, mileage, and condition as closely to yours as you can.

    I don't think I'd sign anything until you are satisfied with the settlement offer. It's not going to make any difference whether they auction it this weekend or next.

    I'd use an attorney. It'll cost you $500-1000 or so, look for one that knows cars, preferably P model Teslas. The attorney will keep you from making a costly mistake. I'd never buy a house without an attorney, and I think you'd be wise to use one here.

    Best,
    David
     
  15. GatorGuy

    GatorGuy Member

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    From my previous experiences, there aren't too many attorneys who handle these cases because they generally deal with low values.

    However, with that ridiculously low offer the first thing I would have done was paid the $250 for an official appraisal report so the insurance company knows you aren't playing around. It would be pretty much impossible to not recoup that back.
     
    • Like x 1
  16. D.E.

    D.E. Uncorked

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    An attorney isn't going to take it on a percentage of the recovery, contingency, basis.

    For things like this you hire an attorney and pay for his time. I'd think $500 to $1000 would be what someone should expect to spend. I wouldn't look at the attorneys that advertise on TV. If you are paying for his/her time then the value has little to do with it. He/she is a legal advisor and helps with communications, we are not talking lawsuits here.
     
  17. GatorGuy

    GatorGuy Member

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    I'm saying that when I had to deal with the insurance company there were not many attorneys who handle these cases. Because there just isn't money in it for them. Like you said, they don't go to court. All you are doing is arguing is over the value of your car which doesn't require an attorney but someone familiar with insurance practices.

    The number one thing they have you do is hire a qualified appraiser so now all you are doing is adding on attorney costs.
     
  18. HankLloydRight

    HankLloydRight No Roads

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    Right now there are 12 P85Ds with the + suspension listed for sale directly from Tesla.

    upload_2018-4-7_11-56-49.png

    You're also in a good spot because over the last two months, Tesla has significantly raised the prices of their CPO fleet for sale.

    If @Russell would like access to all P85Ds sold on EV-CPO.com (archived/sold cars), please PM me for access.

    Correct! There were no D cars in 2012.
     
    • Like x 1
  19. D.E.

    D.E. Uncorked

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    OK, Gator Guy, you might make the same argument when you buy or sell a house, set up a trust, a will, a company, a patent, etc. It isn't that you cannot do these things without an attorney, you certainly can, but should you?

    He's looking at a $30,000 or so difference between what has been offered and the true value of the car. If he hires an attorney for $750, that is 2.5% of the $30K. I think it is worthwhile to get an attorney to look over all paperwork before anything is signed. You can bet Geico used attorneys when that paperwork was written. One thing signed at the wrong time or one bit of missed tiny print can make a big difference. Even the wording can make a difference. I'm no fan of attorneys, but there are times when one is useful. And here in the face of a $30K negotiation it seems wise to spend the money.

    Russell can do whatever he wants, but he asked for an opinion and this is mine.
     
  20. BigNick

    BigNick Disaffected Member

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    Through EV-CPO.com (awesome site, BTW!) I have noticed the pre-AP 2014 60s are listed for more than I paid for my pre-AP 2014 85. I locked in on mine in late October of 2017.

    Compared to current prices, I think I got a decent deal.

    I would definitely use EV-CPO.com to provide comps to the insurance company.
     
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