Octopus Energy, including Intelligent and go

[Pink Duck]

I set a genuine departure time and SoC and lo and behold IO went and charged right through peak 17:05–19:30, then the following early hours for the following day. While 100% renewable credits in use, not that environmental a thing to do in peak of course, when energy generation is dirtiest. Though given they shaft new customers by changing rates during switch, could argue for setting 23:30 as a daily departure (like overnight workers might do).

 

[spon88]

No issue at all using the dumb charger. The tariff is doing all the smart stuff.


Now I'm confused. So you just want the six fixed hours of off peak charging by disabling smart charging in the app? Well OK. I'll say it again: this is against the spirit of the tariff and the ToU but I doubt you'll get kicked off it, although they'd be able to.

Yes, you would need the Zappi for Eco/Eco+ style trickle charging. I have a similar set up my Hypervolt and IO. The IO tariff isn't smart enough to allow trickle charging for solar, you'd need to disable smart charging manually or enable "bump charging" in the IO app.

No, no intention of disabling the app - if it works properly. Given I will be charging the car but probably less frequently than others, I don't see why that contravenens the ToU? If I then get the benefit of charging the batteries along with that, then all good and I suspect it's what many are doing. I'm just trying to establish if there are any hard and fast rules before I jump in. That said, the solar install is several months away so things could have changed by then.

I think I'm along the right lines with the PV/battery/Zappi install and IO as the tariff but obviously still a lot to learn. No doubt there will be a few headaches along the way but I'm quite looking forward to it.

 

[Mrklaw]

I set a genuine departure time and SoC and lo and behold IO went and charged right through peak 17:05–19:30, then the following early hours for the following day. While 100% renewable credits in use, not that environmental a thing to do in peak of course, when energy generation is dirtiest. Though given they shaft new customers by changing rates during switch, could argue for setting 23:30 as a daily departure (like overnight workers might do).

did you check energy mix at that time? its been sunny so maybe those are low carbon windows? Woudl be unusual to get such an extended window if it wasn't cheaper for Octopus then. unless you were 0-100% and couldn't avoid it

 

[browellm]

Though given they shaft new customers by changing rates during switch, could argue for setting 23:30 as a daily departure (like overnight workers might do).

Hard to comment on the veracity of the rest of the post when anyone on IO knows the latest departure you can physically set is 11:00 am.

 

[Pink Duck]

In the Android app it is possible to set a departure of 19:30 after 17:00, as that’s what I (an Intelligent Octopus customer) did just yesterday.

Checking now I find I can set any 24-hour departure time through the Octopus Energy app.

 

[browellm]

In the Android app it is possible to set a departure of 19:30 after 17:00, as that’s what I (an Intelligent Octopus customer) did just yesterday.

Checking now I find I can set any 24-hour departure time through the Octopus Energy app.

Very interesting! Completely different from the iOS version.

 

[browellm]

They haven’t changed the terms either so I wonder if they even know the Android version has that option

 

[Pink Duck]

The terms only appear in the app it seems.

Interestingly under Fair Use they reserve the right to charge peak rates above 6-hours managed charging per day.

 

[browellm]

Is it up-to-date?

As of 16:01 ;-)

Maybe it's terms for iOS users. Would be odd though.

 

[kitenski]

• If car is not plugged in, do nothing, let it sleep
• If car is at home and plugged in, read car SoC from API
  • Set charging windows based on SoC
  • Let car sleep
  • Wake up at next charging window
• Monitor API for updates
• If car wakes up for any reason & updates API, take SoC reading
  • Recalculate windows if necessary
  • Let car sleep
  • Wake up at next charging window
• Repeat as necessary

How do Octopus know that the car has been plugged in by the user in the above scenario and wants charging? I suspect that is why they wake it up so often. I just toggle on/off in app.

 

[Tony Hoyle]

If you use the right APIs you can see a lot of things without waking the car.. I think plugged in state is one of them, as it's one that won't change whilst the car is asleep.

 

[Pink Duck]

I found the Intelligent Octopus terms and conditions as linked from the app on their website, for those interested.

 

[Mrklaw]

If you use the right APIs you can see a lot of things without waking the car.. I think plugged in state is one of them, as it's one that won't change whilst the car is asleep.

yes. Teslafi is a good example here. A lot of the status is passively available - don't know if that is cached at Tesla's side and thats where Telsafi reads it from. If you plug in, that'll definitely be done with the car awake (you have to wake it to open the charge port) so that'll update the 'connected' status and then when it goes to sleep it should still have that data available to services.

 

[Kansalis]

How do Octopus know that the car has been plugged in by the user in the above scenario and wants charging? I suspect that is why they wake it up so often. I just toggle on/off in app.

It's in the API data. Other apps like TeslaFi & TelsaMate etc are able to detect when a car is plugged in. If you plug in the car & it then goes to sleep, the API still knows it's plugged in because that was its last state. You have to wake the car to unlock the port & unplug it, so the API would then be updated that the car is no longer plugged in. ie, you can't unplug the car without the apps knowing.

 

[milesr3]

its really stupid - once they've set the schedule, there is no need to keep waking the car. drains a huge amount - 3-4kwh a day looking at teslafi.

Good to know. I’d noticed mine had started losing charge and range (calculated capacity) since joining IO. I’ll have to disable IO when I don’t want to charge, which seems unnecessary but not the end of the world.

 

[Mrklaw]

How do you turn it off? Can’t see anything obvious in the app?

 

[milesr3]

How do you turn it off? Can’t see anything obvious in the app?

There's an on/off switch for Smart Charging at the bottom of the Accounts & Settings (tap on your avatar in the top-left on the home tab).

Then you'll see this on the devices tab.

I had noticed that my car seemed to be awake most of the time when parked up at home since joining IO, so hopefully this will put a stop to it.

 

[Drew57]

I’ll have to disable IO when I don’t want to charge, which seems unnecessary but not the end of the world.

Intelligent Octopus needs to operate by communicating with the car to see if a charge is required & users might plug in at any time during a 24 hour period so it seems reasonable to assume it will periodically wake the car to check when disconnected (whereas scheduling after 5pm is linked to confirmation of forthcoming wholesale pricing). Temporarily suspending seems a small price to pay for the flexibility IO provides.

 

[milesr3]

Temporarily suspending seems a small price to pay for the flexibility IO provides.

Agreed. It’s not difficult to suspend smart charging. Maybe I won’t do it after every charge but it’s not ideal if it never lets the car sleep when parked up at home.

 

[browellm]

but it’s not ideal if it never lets the car sleep when parked up at home.

The car is only perma-awake if it's unplugged from the charger.
The current behaviour when plugged in is awake for ~15 minutes, asleep for ~45 minutes in the hour.

It used to be much better behaved when plugged in - it would stay asleep permanently. But then Tesla made an API change and the developers either haven't got around to, or haven't figured out how to return to the old behaviour.