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Ioniser

Discussion in 'Model S: Interior & Exterior' started by Jude, Dec 1, 2016.

  1. Jude

    Jude Member

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    The day I picked up my wondrous Tesla, I noted I felt nauseous with the air conditioner on. The delivery specialist knew what it was: the ioniser. Sure enough we switched off the function in the controls and the nausea went away. In the recent heat as my city moves to summer, I noted the same feeling. I looked for the function to see if the ioniser had accidentally been turned on during a software upgrade, instead the setting had disappeared. I contacted Tesla, and it turns out that because people picked one setting and kept it there, they just took the control away and kept it at the last known setting. In my case, they're double checking the setting.

    Interestingly, I learned that the ioniser was included in the classic nose Tesla cars only. For the facelifted vehicles and with the move to the HEPA filter, Tesla removed the ioniser.
     
    • Informative x 3
  2. msnow

    msnow Active Member

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    I have an MS with a nose cone but don't remember seeing that setting. Do you or anyone recall where it was?
     
  3. NOLA_Mike

    NOLA_Mike Grouchy

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  4. Canuck

    Canuck Well-Known Member

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    Not all classic cars. It came out after I got mine in March of 2014 and I was surprised when Tesla added it, considering:

    An investigation by Consumers Union (CU) -- the products testing group that publishes Consumer Reports -- found that five of the best-selling models tested emitted relatively high levels of ozone. Ozone exposure can aggravate allergies and decrease lung function. It is a harmful gas resulting from car exhaust, gasoline vapors, and other pollutants.

    It doesn't surprise me that yours made you ill. Hopefully, Tesla can turn it off permanently.
     
    • Informative x 1
  5. msnow

    msnow Active Member

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    Thanks. I see that there was talk about this going away after 6/2015. A few months before I got my car.
     
  6. Science->Truth

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    I've posted this info in another older thread, but reposting here since it is so relevant to Jude's experience.
    I have a pre-ionizer Model S, but a loaner I used for a day when mine was in for service had an ionizer installed, unbeknownst to me. Without all the boring details, I have a lung condition making me *very* sensitive to air pollution of any kind. (I also have a PhD and am a professor in the health sciences). A short one hour driving the loaner caused me to be sicker than a dog for several days due to my lungs. I emailed the Tesla folks on how dangerous these things are. Ionizers generate ozone as a side effect. Ozone is bad for everyone's lungs, but outright dangerous to the many who have asthma or other lung conditions. I told them to implement a technical solution to *ensure* these ionizers were never turned on in any loaner vehicle in their fleet, but did not receive a response.

    Now I am seriously considering trading in my 2013 Model S for a new one, largely because of the new HEPA plus carbon-filter based air filtration system. Yet, I can't find any information on whether they are installing any electrostatic or other device or feature that may also as a side effect be introducing ozone into the passenger cabin. I sure hope and wish the new system introduces zero ozone or other pollutants (such as perfumes or scents), but I can't risk losing my origi
    nal pre-ionizer Model S in the trade if the new one also ends up producing ozone or other chemicals. If any engineer from Tesla has definitive knowledge is reading this, or any other person who has knowledgeably disassembled the new "biodefense" air filtration system, please share that information.
     
  7. jmsurpri

    jmsurpri Member

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    I emailed Tesla and asked to have the ionizer turned off. They said they can change the setting only once at my request. I asked what the rationale is for removing the option to turn on/off a feature, and they said that tech support has no idea why it was removed. It makes no sense to me why they would remove the option. The only thing I can think of is that they replaced the menu setting with the new cabin overheat protection setting and couldn't figure out how to add a 3rd button to the menu. I sure hope that's not the case..
     
  8. Science->Truth

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    Well, we have two threads discussing the cabin air filtering. Sorry for the cross-post.

    Thanks to the really helpful folks at the Tampa Sales and Service Center, I got more good info on the new air filter (biodefense) system available optionally on the Model S/X. According to them, the new HEPA filter is roughly 2 ft by 1 ft. It has a roughly ¾ inch deep HEPA filter directly fused to a roughly ¾ inch carbon filter, which is installed as a single piece in about the place where the old “microwave cubby” used to be in the earlier models. It does not have an ionizer or use electrostatic filters, according to them (which is really great since they can produce ozone, a known health risk/pollutant, esp hazardous for anyone already with asthma or other lung problems). Additionally, this new filter is a somewhat separate system/air pathway that is in addition to the normal air filter. Cars with “biodefense” HEPA filter still normally run the air through the regular air filter then into to passenger compartment, as any Model S has always done. Only when the biodefense button is turned on is the outside air re-directed through the HEPA filter. And when that mode is on, one cannot adjust the fan speed at all (fixed at high/level 9). That increases internal air pressure to make sure pollution doesn’t leak in through door cracks, etc. (And probably needs high force to be able to pull the air through the denser HEPA filter.) All in all, a major advance. My discussions with the Tesla team suggested the intention is not to run this system continuously—the fan stays on high, making some noise, and it seems the filter longevity is a concern. My impression is the system is designed for hitting that biodefense button when approaching a severely polluted area or cloud of smoke, and returning to regular circ modes right after driving through it. In that case, it’s important for folks with allergies to note that you are not getting HEPA filtered air most of the time. It will be useful to see in the future how long the HEPA filter will last when one runs the HEPA/biodefense mode continuously.
     
  9. Science->Truth

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    I would urge anyone with the old ionizer to turn it off. Given there are several reports of adverse reactions (including my own experience), I believe the ionizer emits ozone which then gets into the passenger compartment. Ozone is a known lung irritant. It's a pollutant not healthy for your lungs, and those with allergies/asthma or other lung problems are especially sensitive. EPA has many technical documents on this, and health scientists, Consumer Reports and others have warned about this for some time. Similarly, almost all aftermarket 12-volt "air purifiers" sold include ionizers. Don't get one of those either. If you want more filtering, only use aftermarket car air purifiers that use true HEPA filter plus activated carbon filter (with no ionizer).
     
  10. Chopr147

    Chopr147 Active Member

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    I had some of the same concerns when I first got my S. I kept feeling nauseous while driving. WTH? My DS told me if I turn off launch mode and drive like a normal person my nausea would go away. He was right! :) No more nausea for me.
     
    • Funny x 1
  11. Science->Truth

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    Maybe your stomach, not your lungs. :)
     
  12. msnow

    msnow Active Member

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    This is an example of a larger issue I hope Tesla resolves soon. Tech Support personnel doesn't have enough knowledge or training to respond to questions like yours yet they own the response to the customer. Tesla Engineering has the answers but isn't communicating with Tech Support and the Service Centers with the correct answer nor does their appear to be a formal escalation process.
     
    • Helpful x 1

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