Except that to get it early, it is NOT a $9,000 option. Its $9,000 for the LR battery + $5,000 premium whether you wanted it or not. Turning a $35,000 into a minimum $49,000. Get paint and its become a $50,000 car. That $14,000 you must spend extra to get the car early even if you didn't want either option. Losing a little on the $7500 rebate doesn't make up for the extra $14,000.
Is $9k worth 310 miles v 220?
- Thread starter GadgetGeek407
- Start date
Put me down for another is yes. As a retired guy, my daily typical drive is six miles to the Costco. But anywhere from four-to-ten times a year, we drive from the northernmost point on the Oregon Coast (where the winters are typically milder than they are inland, but still exist) to the middle of the San Fernando Valley (where, they don't). Most of it can be done along the 5 or 101, where there are plenty of Superchargers, but the most scenic route is to go through Reno. The distance between the Klamath Falls and Reno Superchargers is about 265 miles; too far for the base batteries.
thebigbobowski
Member
That's a good point if you don't want PUP. I was already planning on getting that anyway, so my choice comes down to whether or not I want the LR for an extra $5,250 (if SR isn't available before the full tax credit is gone).
And to be clear, I haven't made my mind up yet. I wasn't ever planning on spending that much money on this car. But all things considered, if I can get nearly $4,000 off the $9,000 LR battery, that makes the decision very difficult. It would actually mean I can't order EAP (which I was planning on), but save up and add it later.
Another personal complication is that I have a lease ending soon (which I've already extended as long as I can), and if I have to pick up another car while waiting for SR, then I stand to lose some money there as well. Decisions, decisions.
vdiv
Chief Grump
Money comes and money goes, the car will stay with you for a while. If you can afford it get the LR version, it is a better car in all regards but a slight weight disadvantage. If you can wait a year or so, you may be able to get a demo/inventory LR Model 3 for a lower price.
Either version will be just fine.
Either version will be just fine.
RyanS
Ka-chow
It really depends on indivisual. If you don’t drive much and you can be flexible, SR will work for you and save $9k.
For me, I have to include time factor. I just don’t have enough time in a day. Time is money. Drive constantly for business and personal. Spending time at supercharging station or waiting for a space (I expect this to get worse with more M3s) is a problem. Some days can be unpredictable and I might have to drive more. Darn... I wish I charged it to 100%. Driving a LR car will minimize planning and worries. As someone mentioned above, little trips do add up and sometimes I am down to 5-10%. Again, you have to look at your situation and decide.
For me, I have to include time factor. I just don’t have enough time in a day. Time is money. Drive constantly for business and personal. Spending time at supercharging station or waiting for a space (I expect this to get worse with more M3s) is a problem. Some days can be unpredictable and I might have to drive more. Darn... I wish I charged it to 100%. Driving a LR car will minimize planning and worries. As someone mentioned above, little trips do add up and sometimes I am down to 5-10%. Again, you have to look at your situation and decide.
Sudre
Active Member
- May 30, 2012
- 1,040
- 6,635
I have always posted with a strong recommendation to get the LR. That opinion is even stronger now. I have a 2013 S60 and this winter I discovered another reason to get the long range. The battery losses range sitting in cold weather at the airport.
Sure normally I have plenty of range but this time I picked up my brother and had to drop him off when we returned. A real good selling point to my brother explaining to him we MIGHT make it to his house. I did not want to cut it close in freezing temps so I drove us to my house and got my wife's car then took him home. Now my brother thinks EVs are stupid and you have to always have a back up car. He didn't believe that the reality is I bought a compromised range car when I decided on the smaller battery when I could have afforded a larger one.
Watching the supercharger roll out FINALLY happening in the US is starting to change that story but in the mid-west it's still true. Not many superchargers around compared to the East and West coast. I originally thought the US would progress faster looking at Tesla's plans in 2013 but Germany got priority.
Sure normally I have plenty of range but this time I picked up my brother and had to drop him off when we returned. A real good selling point to my brother explaining to him we MIGHT make it to his house. I did not want to cut it close in freezing temps so I drove us to my house and got my wife's car then took him home. Now my brother thinks EVs are stupid and you have to always have a back up car. He didn't believe that the reality is I bought a compromised range car when I decided on the smaller battery when I could have afforded a larger one.
Watching the supercharger roll out FINALLY happening in the US is starting to change that story but in the mid-west it's still true. Not many superchargers around compared to the East and West coast. I originally thought the US would progress faster looking at Tesla's plans in 2013 but Germany got priority.
Uncle Paul
Well-Known Member
I believe the $9,000 for the bigger battery is a bargain right now.
First, you can get a $7,500 federal tax credit by getting earlier delivery. You also will most likely be able to resell it for around $6,000 more is a few years than the lower range model.
This makes it cheaper if you get the credit, or $3,000 more if it is not included.
Better range gives you more options. On longer trips it charges faster and requires fewer stops. For driving around town it gives you additional range in case your plans change and you need to drive more than expected.
Every buyer must decide for themselves if the longer range and faster charging is worth the net costs. For many the choice is obvious, but for those right on the edge, and who do not know for certain how they will be using the car in the future, the decision can be difficult.
In my case, I sold a Jeep Grand Cherokee and a Viper to buy my 75X. Gave me enough $ to purchase it outright. Also have a Mercedes for longer trips, where speed is of the essence. For me, driving the Tesla is so much better than the Mercedes, that it just sits there. Teresa also has switched to driving the Tesla 100%. Mercedes just sits in the spare garage. Last time we wanted to use the Mercedes, the battery had gone dead from sitting. Owning a Tesla changes you.Driving becomes much more of a pleasure, and less of a chore.
First, you can get a $7,500 federal tax credit by getting earlier delivery. You also will most likely be able to resell it for around $6,000 more is a few years than the lower range model.
This makes it cheaper if you get the credit, or $3,000 more if it is not included.
Better range gives you more options. On longer trips it charges faster and requires fewer stops. For driving around town it gives you additional range in case your plans change and you need to drive more than expected.
Every buyer must decide for themselves if the longer range and faster charging is worth the net costs. For many the choice is obvious, but for those right on the edge, and who do not know for certain how they will be using the car in the future, the decision can be difficult.
In my case, I sold a Jeep Grand Cherokee and a Viper to buy my 75X. Gave me enough $ to purchase it outright. Also have a Mercedes for longer trips, where speed is of the essence. For me, driving the Tesla is so much better than the Mercedes, that it just sits there. Teresa also has switched to driving the Tesla 100%. Mercedes just sits in the spare garage. Last time we wanted to use the Mercedes, the battery had gone dead from sitting. Owning a Tesla changes you.Driving becomes much more of a pleasure, and less of a chore.
ElecFan
Member
@Uncle Paul You bought a 75X while going for the bigger battery now because of the long trips. So how do you deal with the long trips right now if not using the Merc? And why shouldn't you be able to do the same with the SR (which is comparable in range with the 75X)?
cpa
Active Member
This is our story, and I am sticking to it.
We live in Fresno, and we like to escape the insufferable heat in the Valley in summer a couple of times per year. We have an S85, and we just received our Model 3 LR.
From our home to the Eastern Sierra area --anywhere from Bridgeport south to Lone Pine is quite a drive. In summer all the mountain passes are open: not only Interstate 80, US50 and SR88, but also SR4 over Ebbets Pass, SR108 over Sonora Pass, and Tioga Road through Yosemite. We can make it home without stopping from Minden, Nevada; Topaz Lake, Nevada; Bridgeport, California; Mammoth Lakes, California. Driving eastbound I try to add about 40 miles of range to the Model S just to be safe.
We can take the roads and highways that we want without having to detour to a Supercharger or without being forced onto the interstate or US highways with much more traffic.
With the LR Model 3 we will be able to make any trip across the mountains without the need for charging until our destination.
As the individual from Astoria pointed out, the drive to LA from his home is more scenic from Eugene to Chenault to K-Falls to Reno and south. A couple of those legs are pretty long, and the long range battery allows attaining the destination with comfort.
Others drive between Winnemucca and Boise on US95. Most need to stop en route for 30-45 minutes. There are probably scores of fun highways that do not have Superchargers, and might not get them for 5-10 years, but the LR battery will enable those drives.
The Long Range battery will also permit more choices to Supercharge on a road trip. For example, one person might want to take a nice lunch to attain a 95+% charge and then be able to drive for almost four hours before stopping to recharge or for the night. Another might want to depart with 95%, drive a little, charge a little, drive a little, charge a little, etc until he reaches 12-18% before a lengthy charging session.
In a vacuum, the additional $9,000 might not be worth it. Those funds will buy a lot of miles renting an ICE. But nothing--nothing--beats driving an electric car through the mountains or on fun rural highways and byways. There is no price tag on that!
We live in Fresno, and we like to escape the insufferable heat in the Valley in summer a couple of times per year. We have an S85, and we just received our Model 3 LR.
From our home to the Eastern Sierra area --anywhere from Bridgeport south to Lone Pine is quite a drive. In summer all the mountain passes are open: not only Interstate 80, US50 and SR88, but also SR4 over Ebbets Pass, SR108 over Sonora Pass, and Tioga Road through Yosemite. We can make it home without stopping from Minden, Nevada; Topaz Lake, Nevada; Bridgeport, California; Mammoth Lakes, California. Driving eastbound I try to add about 40 miles of range to the Model S just to be safe.
We can take the roads and highways that we want without having to detour to a Supercharger or without being forced onto the interstate or US highways with much more traffic.
With the LR Model 3 we will be able to make any trip across the mountains without the need for charging until our destination.
As the individual from Astoria pointed out, the drive to LA from his home is more scenic from Eugene to Chenault to K-Falls to Reno and south. A couple of those legs are pretty long, and the long range battery allows attaining the destination with comfort.
Others drive between Winnemucca and Boise on US95. Most need to stop en route for 30-45 minutes. There are probably scores of fun highways that do not have Superchargers, and might not get them for 5-10 years, but the LR battery will enable those drives.
The Long Range battery will also permit more choices to Supercharge on a road trip. For example, one person might want to take a nice lunch to attain a 95+% charge and then be able to drive for almost four hours before stopping to recharge or for the night. Another might want to depart with 95%, drive a little, charge a little, drive a little, charge a little, etc until he reaches 12-18% before a lengthy charging session.
In a vacuum, the additional $9,000 might not be worth it. Those funds will buy a lot of miles renting an ICE. But nothing--nothing--beats driving an electric car through the mountains or on fun rural highways and byways. There is no price tag on that!
For those experiences with long distance driving with super chargers...
Is it reasonable with current spacing of superchargers to do long distance driving with a 220 mile range car?
Is it reasonable with current spacing of superchargers to do long distance driving with a 220 mile range car?
timk225
Active Member
That doesn't make sense. I could have the SR battery AND my $7500 credit if Tesla were making them now. I was at the front end of the line to reserve on 3/31, not a previous Tesla owner or Tesla / Spacex employee. And east coast.
CuriousG
Active Member
By your logic, Tesla should be giving away EAP and FSD since it's capable for all the cars now but they just have it turned on. Better yet, let's just put all LR batteries in the Model 3 to streamline production but block access to those that don't want to pay for it. I think that most people that currently have Teslas will see it as a deal for $9k.
Maybe they are holding back the true potential of the RWD motor by limiting 0-60 times (awaiting P series) but that would also mean the 0-60 time would be much faster for the LR battery due to how much power is available from the battery size. To say a 55kW battery is equivalent to an 80kW battery performance is disingenuous if you've ever read any of the technical explanations.
What you are paying for is R&D. You think you can just slap any Lithium Ion battery in there and have it perform like a Tesla? Why do you think the first generation Leafs have such bad degradation? Same goes for their induction motor which you are paying for it's R&D. And while you're at it, let's just have Tesla disable access to the Superchargers because you didn't pay into the infrastructure. But instead Tesla is offering Supercharger fees at a reasonable fixed rate based on how much you electricity is consumed rather than time based.
Now if you said, "I just can't afford to pay an additional $150/mo for the battery" and left it at that people can sympathize. But instead you make it out to sound like Tesla is committing racketeering by charging $9k for a LR battery.
1.21 Jiggawatts
Member
RyanS
Ka-chow
I believe it is possible. I think this guy drove his MS 60 from LA to Virginia. MS60 has 208miles range.
First Supercharger-Only Coast to Coast Road Trip in a Tesla Model S 60 | Tesla
First Supercharger-Only Coast to Coast Road Trip in a Tesla Model S 60 | Tesla
I once ran into a family in an S60 in Albert Lea Minnesota who came from Washington state. I think it's easily possible especially in the summer but a lot less convenient since the S60 and SR Model 3 take so much longer to charge. An extra half hour at each stop really adds up.
This is the way I look at it.
My first EV was a 2012 Leaf that had an MSRP of $32K with 80 miles of summer (highway range) and 60 miles of winter range when new. I was then dreaming of 200 mile range EVs.
Then I got an S85 3 years later that had 250 miles range but set me back by more than twice that of Leaf. That was a difficult decision. I didn't think that was rip off, but definitely a difficult decision to make.
Fast forward 3 years later. I can't imagine I can drive a 320 miles range car for a price much cheaper than an S. So this is a no brainer.
My first EV was a 2012 Leaf that had an MSRP of $32K with 80 miles of summer (highway range) and 60 miles of winter range when new. I was then dreaming of 200 mile range EVs.
Then I got an S85 3 years later that had 250 miles range but set me back by more than twice that of Leaf. That was a difficult decision. I didn't think that was rip off, but definitely a difficult decision to make.
Fast forward 3 years later. I can't imagine I can drive a 320 miles range car for a price much cheaper than an S. So this is a no brainer.
Well, I've done several 3000+ mile roadtrips on Superchargers with my 237 mile rated X in the year and a half I've had it, so I'm going to go with yes.
Between the slower charging and needing to push further into the charging taper, it can be more tedious than a bigger pack would be, especially if you are pushing the pace and minimizing stops.
If you sit down for a meal every other charging stop and keep the rest to ten or fifteen minute snack and bathroom breaks, my X is just barely fast enough to generally not be waiting for the car.
vdiv
Chief Grump
Having driven last year in my 230 rated miles S70D from VA to CO, WY, SD and back against very strong headwinds in Kansas and through a snow storm in Wyoming I would say a definite yes. Tesla has since filled up many of these Midwestern gaps making it even easier to make these trips.
Being forced to stop and take a break every two hours of driving is what makes these long trips reasonable. They keep the driver attentive. Start in the morning, first stop for a coffee, stretching legs, second stop for lunch, third stop for another coffee/decaf, last stop at hotel with destination charging. Repeat the following day. Stops can also be made to visit places along the way. If you have kids and dogs stopping is needed anyway.
Taking your Tesla on a long cross-country trip is the best way to earn an appreciation and fall in true love with it.
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jgs
Active Member
If I had ham, I could have ham and eggs, if I had eggs.
For comparison, people already gripe about the $5500 + tax and labor cost on a new replacement 24 kWh Leaf battery (Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement - My Nissan Leaf Forum). But then again, by the time a Leaf is past 5 year/60K capacity warranty, its value is very low, often below $5500.
The capacity delta between the long-range and standard version 3 is about 25 kWh, right? (Please correct me, if I'm wrong.)
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