Is FSD really worth the money?

[OCR1]

I get the general sense that most of the forum members strongly believe in the functionality of AP/EAP/FSD. I feel like an outlier here because while I love everything else about our Model 3’s, I don’t like AP or FSD.

I’l preface it by saying that I live in the LA/Orange County area where heavy traffic and crazy drivers are the norm. There is almost always someone in my blind spots at all times and there is a lot of traffic weaving in and out of lanes very quickly.

When I’m using just plain AP, I find the car randomly brakes when there is nobody in front of me. It drives in other people’s blind spots. It drives way too fast when my lane is moving quickly but the lanes on both the left and right are moving much slower. And it drives very rough, meaning lots of abrupt accelerating and braking as the traffic conditions are changing.

When I add FSD, my car rarely seems to be comfortable making lane changes, even in mad max mode. It attempts a lane change and then aborts, or it leaves the turn signal running while car after car passes me and it never seems comfortable making the change. It nags me to get in the right lane behind a truck three miles before my exit. Or it nags me to get in the left lane when I’m getting ready to transition to another freeway. It nags me to keep my hands on the wheel even when my hands have been on the wheel the whole time.

As far as it’s overall skill as a driver, I would rate it a D. When I’m using it I feel like I’m supervising a student driver that is just learning how to drive. I’m letting the car drive while keeping my hands on the wheel at all times just in case it screws up, just like they used to do in driving school when they had those cars with two wheels and two sets of brakes. And the whole time I’m doing this I’m thinking “Why am I teaching this car how to drive when I could just drive it myself far better on my own with much less stress?”

We talk a lot about HW3 and the general consensus is that AP is feature complete and HW3 won’t improve it. Really? So it’s never going to be better than a really bad student driver at driving my car? And even with all of that extra computing power Tesla is not going to attempt to make AP any better unless I pay them extra for FSD?

Anyways, just needed to get that off my chest. I’m still a big Tesla fan but I’m not an FSD fan. At least not yet. Maybe some day if it really can demonstrate to me that it can drive better than I can, but until then...no thanks.

 

[Uncle Paul]

This is not much different than I feel when anybody else is driving my car, and I am a passenger.

They rarely brake precisely when I think the should. Often seem unaware of things that I see and would compensate for. They do not accelerate at the speed I would, nor brake when I would.

They do not slow down to use regeneration as I prefer, and often seem more on and off the throttle, while I prefer to look ahead, judging traffic and keeping a smooth pace.

They often do not jam themselves into a tight space in traffic like I can to get into a faster lane, and often drive in a lane that I would also not choose.

In other words, other people drive differently than I would.

Autopilot seems that way to me as well. I have gotten used to the way it drives, and appreciate how it has gotten much better over the past couple years. I use it as an aid to take away some of the drugery of driving, but when things get critical I tend to want to take over myself.

 

[mcars]

I'm in Chicago and I use FSD heavily while in traffic and find it hugely beneficial. But it just seems you're a more aggressive driver than what FSD is, at least from what I'm reading. And that's going to happen, and if you are that type maybe FSD isn't for you.

Remember that these cars are sending up data every day from what they see from the cameras, and if you generate bug reports when it does something you don't like (won't change lanes, requests change of lanes too quickly) it can definitely help.

But the last thing Tesla wants right now is an accident "caused" by FSD, so they will be cautious to begin with.

 

[Uncle Don]

I used AP during the trial they offered last month. For me, it drove to close to the left lane. I would be driving as normal and when I engaged AP the first thing the car did was move left. I didn't like it. That's one reason I didn't buy it. I won't buy FSD until I can sit in the back seat and there is no steering wheel or pedals.

 

[ngogas]

At the moment no, it’s not worth the money. Since FSD is no available.

For AP I think it is at the moment for me personally. No other cars can do what it does even though it’s limited and in beta.

 

[Silicon Desert]

Sounds like FSD is not for you, but for me on my long trips, it is fabulous and I don't want to do without it. Having said that, I call it PSD (Partial Self Driving). Nothing FULL about it at present, but it keeps getting better. It's just a personal thing. Worth it to me, but obviously not to others.

 

[Eno Deb]

I used AP during the trial they offered last month. For me, it drove to close to the left lane. I would be driving as normal and when I engaged AP the first thing the car did was move left.

Which means you probably have a drift to the right when you drive normally. AP usually drives dead center (which sometimes doesn't feel appropriate e.g. if there's a big truck in the neighboring lane).

Generally I'm pretty happy with AP in heavy stop-and-go traffic, but perhaps the drivers here aren't as crazy as in LA. I don't use NoA except for some brief testing. Way too unreliable at the moment.

 

[Uncle Paul]

The new Navigation on Autopilot has been better than I expected. It moves me on and off freeway interchanges and off ramps with pretty good results.

While not perfected yet, it shows a tremendous increase in self driving capabilities.

I also love it when I use my turn signal, it will show a warning if something is in my blind spot.

While I am gaining trust in the system, it continues to freak out passengers.

 

[Triplett]

Dunno...still endlessly waiting for my car.

I have, however, blown 5 grand on a lot stupider things...

 

[OCR1]

I'm in Chicago and I use FSD heavily while in traffic and find it hugely beneficial. But it just seems you're a more aggressive driver than what FSD is, at least from what I'm reading. And that's going to happen, and if you are that type maybe FSD isn't for you.

You’re probably right, but I really have no desire to be an aggressive driver. But where I drive nobody will let me in the lane just because I put my turn signal on. I’m just trying to navigate the chaos and avoid the really bad drivers.

On the few longer distance trips I’ve been on AP seemed to handle most things just fine. I just don’t do that many long trips to where I’m in non-congested freeway driving much.

I’d say it also generally does fine when the traffic is so heavy that it’s stop and go, where the speed rarely exceeds 20mph and all I need it to do is stay in the lane and stop and go as the traffic allows.

 

[Uncle Paul]

If you want to scurry back and forth between lanes, manual driving is the way to go.

 

[Big Dog]

I used AP during the trial they offered last month. For me, it drove to close to the left lane. I would be driving as normal and when I engaged AP the first thing the car did was move left. I didn't like it. That's one reason I didn't buy it. I won't buy FSD until I can sit in the back seat and there is no steering wheel or pedals.

What you are really saying is that you tend to drive closer to the right. (AP is really good about tracking dead center between the lines. Of course, that sometimes means really close to the retaining wall in a car pool lane, when most drivers would drift slightly.)

That being said, don't use EAP about town. But its great on the I-5 thru the Central Valley.

 

[Lhshockey24]

$6,000 to change lanes. No.

 

[rhaekar]

Just to be clear, the mad max mode doesn't affect how your car changes lanes. It affects when it tries to change lanes to pass slower moving vehicles.

 

[afadeev]

I get the general sense that most of the forum members strongly believe in the functionality of AP/EAP/FSD. I feel like an outlier here because while I love everything else about our Model 3’s, I don’t like AP or FSD.

You might like this thread, then:
How many EAP owners would pay for the 3.0 FSD computer at what price?

I used AP during the trial they offered last month. For me, it drove to close to the left lane. I would be driving as normal and when I engaged AP the first thing the car did was move left. I didn't like it.

My AP does that too, but not always.

There are a few spots in town where they put out "pedestrian crossing" warning signs in the middle of the road. AP puts me within inches of clipping those (and does not detect them at all). I usually jerk the wheel further towards the middle of the lane to avoid paying for a new paint job.

On multi-lane roads, it tracks straight down the middle of the lane.

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[MaBlaBa+]

I wonder if the FSD price will drop further, below the current $6k for upgrade. It used to be $8k.

 

[Kant.Ing]

Putting a driver behind the wheel is the single best feature of AP/EAP/FSD.

The driver carries all the responsibility and the system will automatically become an order safer (90% to 99%) when it collects several more billions AP miles.

 

[Paddy3101]

On my commute, I get to use AP/NoA for about 60 of my 70 miles per day, which equates to 80 minutes a day of boring, drudging following along with the car ahead.

So definitely worth it for me.

 

[Knightshade]

There are a few spots in town where they put out "pedestrian crossing" warning signs in the middle of the road. AP puts me within inches of clipping those (and does not detect them at all). I usually jerk the wheel further towards the middle of the lane to avoid paying for a new paint job.

User error- as AP is explicitly not intended for use on local roads in town and where there's pedestrian crossings.

Do not use Autosteer on city streets, in construction zones, or in areas where bicyclists or pedestrians may be present

 

[GolanB]

Its not really possible to answer this question right now based on any practical experience with FSD. My conclusion is FSD will be worth it, if it delivers.