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Is it impossible to add any options after finalizing?!?

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#41
I was able to change from Obeche Matte to Obeche Gloss, after I had seen both trims in real cars next to each other in the Menlo Park store. But this was back in October. It was a relatively simple, cosmetic change, and during a time Tesla was still in ramp-up mode.

I can fully understand Tesla is getting much less flexible now. If too many make changes, it impacts their forecasting, inventory, supply lines, scheduling, etc. What if the guy next in line now suddenly has to wait for restocking because you got his parts?
 
#42
An analogy I can think of why Tesla is trying to stop people from changing their orders is that scene from Ratatouille where everybody is flying around in the kitchen, food's flying people are dodging one another dangerous knives are being thrown around all in what seems to be an incredibly well orchestrated disaster while a waiter slides through the chaos and out the kitchen door to the restaurant. The job is to keep a serene calm face to the chaos that's going on behind the scenes.

Except in this case, the customer calls the waiter over and says.. "excuse me… can you change my vegetable from Asparagus to Broccoli?" Now of course, in a restaurant that's no problem, toss the asparagus, throw on broccoli, you're good. But now imagine that the cost of the meal is 2,000 times greater. The stakes are higher, the scene is the same, but the asparagus can't just be thrown away. Instead of one person brushing asparagus off the plate, you now have to stop 4 people from doing whatever it is they're doing, figure out if any of the other orders have asparagus and haven't been made yet, or perhaps you can put the asparagus in storage, but it won't taste good because the sous-chef has already begun steaming it. In the mean time *everybody else's* meals are being delayed. If you're a new restaurant, just trying to get people in the door you might toss the broccoli, knowing that you just ate into the margin of your meal, but as you become more established you understand that you cannot continue to do that.. what if next time it's Prime Rib? You'd really rather not have different policies. So, at this restaurant, where a meal costs anywhere from 60-100k.. once you order, you now have to sign a piece of paper saying that you understand that you cannot change that order. OK.. Problem solved. Right? .. Well, not for everybody I guess.

Analogies are interesting, and not always accurate, but I enjoy them anyway. And, it was a fun creative outlet for first thing in the AM. :)

- - - Updated - - -

one more thought from me on the matter, Tesla is not saying "no" because they don't like you, or because they're just trying to be spiteful, or because they're lame, or whatever. They're saying no for one very simple reason, and that is because saying "yes" without a good process for changing orders, is a cost that is too much for them to bear at this point in their ramp.
 
#44
+1000

It's been around for 300 + years...


"Marry in haste, repent in leisure".

William Congreve 1693



bonnie1194 said:
+1 to most all responses in this thread.

At some point, a manufacturing operation has to lock down what they're building. 'Finalize' is pretty clear and I think most agree it's not just the point at where you cannot get your deposit back - it's the point where you have finalized the configuration of the car. (And let's not revisit what Tesla said regarding the superchargers. There are a number of people on this forum who publicly agreed with the interpretation Tesla thought was clear.)

Tesla has been kind enough, when they were first ramping production, to change a few final configurations. But anyone involved in a manufacturing operation can tell you that changes, even BEFORE something hits the floor, causes work. Stock on hand, changes to the MRP system, scheduling, paperwork for the specific item (travelers in my business) take time to change. Multiply your *simple* request by 10 or some other number and they miss production goals for the week.

At some point Tesla needed to say 'no, not going to happen, finalize means finalize' or put the business goals at risk. As an investor, I hope this is the lockdown on changes. With enough yelling publicly on the forum, maybe you'll get your change. But I hope not. It's time for Tesla to be a manufacturing company.

Here's a question: Would you be willing to pay for the costs the change incurs in their workflow? (And before you say 'yes!', I can tell you that metrics I've run in the past show the simplest change (prior to production, parts not committed, parts in stock, etc.) show a pretty pricey tag.)

I'm sure you're disappointed and I'm sure you can't understand why, if you want to spend more money, they don't just say yes. The specialist's reported attitude (I'm sure unprovoked) was unacceptable. But out of kindness, think how you might feel if you'd had ten calls in a row asking for just a small change & a company saying 'finalize is finalize'. What do you want him to say?
Click to expand...
 
#45
#47
It's not impossible as some experiences, including mine, have indicated. Depends to a certain degree on who the person you communicate with at Tesla. I think the staff almost always denies such requests once the finalize paperwork has been Docusigned.

An interesting question concerning production is the order of assembly. Based on the videos I've seen, when the Tesla web site says "The Tesla Factory is Building Your Model S" is it really being built? For example, I have a multi-coat red, which Tesla says will not begin production until March 1. What does that mean in terms of production? Are they assembling everything but the body? As that seems to have it all out of order, I doubt it. So it's all very hard to know, and circumstances in each case may determine what's possible. My advice is to try in every case, and to go up the management ladder if your first requests are denied. The worst that can happen is a 'no.". But if you don't try you've made a change impossible all by yourself.
 
#48
It's not about ignoring a contract or special privilege. It is good customer service to allow changes where it doesn't cost anything. There are stages of pre-production that allow for this. It's not like the order goes right to the floor for production that day. For most, a car is one of the biggest purchases they ever make next to a home or education. If you want to make a change and it doesn't hurt Tesla, then they should allow it. In many cases, that's what Tesla has done.

Krugerrand said:
What I'd find disturbing is people who think just because something has a larger price tag that that somehow gives them a special privilege to ignore a contract and then complain when things don't go their way.

Absolutely, some (many) have ordered Model S sight unseen, but that's their choice. If it's not a choice you're comfortable with, then don't do it.
Click to expand...
 
#49
I think people don't get it. People here in TMC have been able to make changes but that's because they were doing this in the ramp-up period or before Tesla had started planning to produce their car.

Changes were possible in the ramp-up period because so many things were changing every day that absorbing another change was no big deal as long as the car hadn't physically gotten past the point where the change wasn't possible and there were enough parts on hand.

Things have changed. When you're producing 400 cars a week steady-state, you can't be as flexible as when you're producing 50 or 100 cars a week and people are working overtime to do it.

At these volumes, once the factory has picked your order up, things start happening that would be disruptive to interrupt and/or redo even if no physical changes have been made. They can't afford those disruptions if they want to make 400+ cars a week with people working normal shifts.

Finalize really means finalize people. Don't push the button if you're not 100% sure that you're willing to live with the results.

If you get lucky, you *may* be able to change your order after you push the button. But that's only because you're lucky the factory hasn't picked your order up and Tesla's being nice. You can't count on that luck.
 
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#50
dbanner said:
It's not about ignoring a contract or special privilege. It is good customer service to allow changes where it doesn't cost anything. There are stages of pre-production that allow for this. It's not like the order goes right to the floor for production that day. For most, a car is one of the biggest purchases they ever make next to a home or education. If you want to make a change and it doesn't hurt Tesla, then they should allow it. In many cases, that's what Tesla has done.
Click to expand...

How do you know it's not costing Tesla anything to change orders after 'finalization'? How do you know what the pre-production stages are and when each order goes to the floor for production? How do you know the person sitting on the other end of the phone hasn't already considered all that? If you know those answers, then I'd have to assume you work for Tesla, in which case maybe you'd like to have a word with 'Jason'?


Big purchases mean as an adult you make big decisions. It also means you respect contracts, indeed, respect of one's word (which is what a contract signifies - I promise to do such and such, if you promise to do such and such) is usually taught to children. There's nothing wrong with asking if a change can be made if you made a mistake, it's another to have a tantrum when you're told 'no', and it's another still to think you know more about what's going on behind the scenes and thusly determining what is or is not a big deal.
 
#53
I think that the meaning of Finalize is pretty clear. It is not Finalize unless I change my mind later... It is not Finalize unless my wife changes her mind later...

As a reservation holder and a Tesla investor, I would hate to see Tesla allow indecisive people get their way (by making enough public noise) to the point where it slows down production or costs Tesla extra money. I just got my Finalize invitation e-mail last Friday, so I am thinking long and hard about what options I choose before I pull the trigger. Once I do pull the trigger and sign the paperwork, I will live with the choices I made, with no complaints.

To the OP: You would probably get better results if you had reached out privately to people at Tesla, rather than making a public issue out of it. If Tesla caves in to too many people that go public with this type of thing, it will only encourage more people to do the same thing or else feel they have been unfairly treated. That factor alone is probably going to work against you with Tesla.
 
#54
GlennAlanBerry said:
I think that the meaning of Finalize is pretty clear. It is not Finalize unless I change my mind later... It is not Finalize unless my wife changes her mind later...

As a reservation holder and a Tesla investor, I would hate to see Tesla allow indecisive people get their way (by making enough public noise) to the point where it slows down production or costs Tesla extra money. I just got my Finalize invitation e-mail last Friday, so I am thinking long and hard about what options I choose before I pull the trigger. Once I do pull the trigger and sign the paperwork, I will live with the choices I made, with no complaints.

To the OP: You would probably get better results if you had reached out privately to people at Tesla, rather than making a public issue out of it. If Tesla caves in to too many people that go public with this type of thing, it will only encourage more people to do the same thing or else feel they have been unfairly treated. That factor alone is probably going to work against you with Tesla.
Click to expand...

No offense, but several people on this forum have posted on how they were able to get changes made. Several people on this forum post how they get VIN's after posting here. So if I were someone who wanted my voice heard, I can see how posting here would be my choice.
 
#55
mulder1231 said:
I was able to change from Obeche Matte to Obeche Gloss, after I had seen both trims in real cars next to each other in the Menlo Park store. But this was back in October. It was a relatively simple, cosmetic change, and during a time Tesla was still in ramp-up mode.

I can fully understand Tesla is getting much less flexible now. If too many make changes, it impacts their forecasting, inventory, supply lines, scheduling, etc. What if the guy next in line now suddenly has to wait for restocking because you got his parts?
Click to expand...

When Tesla was making 25 cars a week it was not a bid deal. Those of us in the first 1-2K cars made had a flexibility that can not be maintained with the current volume. I made several changes but they added functionality and cost - and therefore increased Tesla's profit, and August or October was eons ago in Tesla Time. August MVPAs also meant a reservation was made in 2009...With a three and a half year wait. Simply put, Tesla was extra patient with us as we'd proven to be extraordinarily patient with Tesla.

I think that, at this point, unless you are deciding to increase the battery size, Tesal is fair in moving back a persons place in line if she/he makes changes to the MVPA.
 
#56
We're going round in circles here. I think Tesla can be criticized for a lot of things and praised for a lot of things; they have some great staff and maybe they have a bad apple in there somewhere but one thing I am certain of is that they're not declining post-finalize changes just for the sake of ticking people off. It's also extremely unlikely to be laziness or deliberate obstructiveness as it's going to take time and work to turn down the request and if it was a simple paperwork change well, it'd just be easier to do it. So, we can agree that Tesla has a reason for this policy and speculating about what that reason is, isn't going to change it if it's an important reason. That said, the OP can vent his frustration but he certainly doesn't need to be condemned for it.

As for all the suggestions about making a final, final, finalization cut-off....there'll still be someone (or their spouse) who changes their mind afterwards. Human nature is what it is.
 
#59
Perhaps a slight addition to the reservation process would be helpful. After you click, "Finalize," there would be a pop-up or new screen saying something dire, like:

You are about to finalize your Model S configuration.
Once finalized, Tesla cannot accept any further changes to your configuration.
By pressing "Accept", you are acknowledging the following final configuration:

[list components]

Or am I mis-recollecting, and there is already a click-through screen like this? I did all this back in August....
 
#60
Maybe something like Amazon.com's 1-Click ordering where you have 30 min to change your mind. Tesla could give you 24 hours after you click finalize before it is sent to the factory allowing for a one-time change before you are locked out. Finalize really should mean finalize but sometimes people change their mind.
 
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