Is my Model S going to start on fire? ScanMyTesla

[cleverscreenam]

Are these temperatures way too hot?? What is the hottest battery temp you've seen in your cars with ScanMyTesla?

Outside temp was only 86 degrees, and why is "chiller bypass" at 100%? Looks like Thermal Controller was completely off at 0.02kw, not even any fans running, and chiller bypassed, for the entire supercharge from 8% to 70%. No faults or warnings on the screen, and it's been getting hot like this the last 4 supercharges (couple times a month), and this 140 degrees is the hottest yet. I'm worried it'll keep rising as summer gets hotter.

Car is classic P85 with MCU1, no upgrades. Last year had an unknown battery fault, service center simply replaced the whole pack under warranty.

 

[dannycamps]

140 degrees F is hot for sure but it's not absurdly hot - especially while supercharging. Think of it this way, a typical ICE (internal combustion engine) runs somewhere between 180-220 degrees F with coolant flowing through it.

 

[SilverGS]

@cleverscreenam I don't have any feedback to add regarding your question about temperature.

I'm just curious about the battery pack replacement. So Tesla still makes the 85 kwh pack? I would have just assumed they would replace it with what they make for the current cars, but perhaps that is an absurd assumption.

 

[Dave EV]

Are these temperatures way too hot?? What is the hottest battery temp you've seen in your cars with ScanMyTesla?

Outside temp was only 86 degrees, and why is "chiller bypass" at 100%? Looks like Thermal Controller was completely off at 0.02kw, not even any fans running, and chiller bypassed, for the entire supercharge from 8% to 70%. No faults or warnings on the screen, and it's been getting hot like this the last 4 supercharges (couple times a month), and this 140 degrees is the hottest yet. I'm worried it'll keep rising as summer gets hotter.

Car is classic P85 with MCU1, no upgrades. Last year had an unknown battery fault, service center simply replaced the whole pack under warranty.

60C / 140F should be the max temperature the car will let the cells get to while Supercharging, so I'm a bit surprised that cooling hasn't kicked in yet. There are also screens with temperature targets (active and passive cooling / heating targets), check that screen out next time you Supercharger and see what they are.

 

[cleverscreenam]

Thanks guys, can you tell me more about these temperature targets?
On the first screen Perf, the cell temp graph has the dash all the way on maximum.

If I turn on cabin AC on, then I hear the fans spinning, and if I turn it to 11, they roar like a jet engine... just like they used to do automatically while supercharging last year.

I heard they don't make the 85 pack anymore, I think I received a 90. My 100% charge is now 298 miles, I've only charged that high once. Lucky break huh, but not if their software is trying to kill it eh!
I also saw that with a battery temp of 105 degrees, navigating to a supercharger still turns on the battery heater to go even hotter, crazy! (I canceled that and navigated by address instead.)

 

[SilverGS]

I heard they don't make the 85 pack anymore, I think I received a 90. My 100% charge is now 298 miles, I've only charged that high once. Lucky break huh, but not if their software is trying to kill it eh!
I also saw that with a battery temp of 105 degrees, navigating to a supercharger still turns on the battery heater to go even hotter, crazy! (I canceled that and navigated by address instead.)

Thanks! What was your max range before the battery replacement?

 

[NewbyMaybe]

Gotta better chance of being struck by lightning with a tinfoil hat.

 

[DerbyDave]

I'm just curious about the battery pack replacement. So Tesla still makes the 85 kwh pack? I would have just assumed they would replace it with what they make for the current cars, but perhaps that is an absurd assumption.

The warranty replaces the battery with a used and refurbished battery that meets the age and capacity of the original (as close as possible) from their used battery inventory. You don't get a new battery, and it will not have specs, capacity, or remaining life that equal a new battery.

 

[SilverGS]

The warranty replaces the battery with a used and refurbished battery that meets the age and capacity of the original (as close as possible) from their used battery inventory. You don't get a new battery, and it will not have specs, capacity, or remaining life that equal a new battery.

What happens if the SC does not have a close enough equivalent replacement battery?

 

[DerbyDave]

They match with the closest possible. If there are no batteries of the type dead under warranty, it is likely the battery is very new, and would be replaced with a new battery -- if that were the only option. This likely doesn't happen very often these days. They would not be replacing an 85kwh battery with a new 100 kwh battery. It would require new crash test certification and upgraded suspension. They might replace it with a 90kwh battery.

 

[cleverscreenam]

Thanks! What was your max range before the battery replacement?

243 miles and the pack had 210,000 miles on it. The 85 new from factory was 265 miles.

 

[Dave EV]

Thanks guys, can you tell me more about these temperature targets?
On the first screen Perf, the cell temp graph has the dash all the way on maximum.

Here's 2 screenshots from my temp tab - first one is just sitting there, the second is after entering navigation to a nearby Supercharger.

In this case, look at the Target bat ActiveCool, Target bat Passive and Target bat ActiveHeat. Definitions:

Target bat ActiveCool: If the battery temp exceeds this, the car will use AC to cool the battery.
Target bat Passive: The car will try to get the battery to this temperature without active heating or cooling.
Target bat ActiveHeat: The car will run the heater or motor until the battery hits this temperature.

So at least for my Model 3, the car targets 102F (39C) to Supercharger. I believe the ActiveCool target will go up when actively Supercharging, but you can see from the first screenshot the ActiveCool target is 131F (55C), which I think is close to the ActiveCool target when Supercharging.

 

[cleverscreenam]

Thanks Dave, looks like you get a lot more information from a 3 than a S. It's some relief knowing the 3's batteries are within design specs up to 131* F. Still surprising since an internet search for "18650 max temp" says 60c/140f discharging and 45c/113f charging.

 

[DerbyDave]

Wondering if the Model 3 is a newer model with lithium iron phosphate (LFP) battery, which may have different characteristics, or is it a nickel-cobalt-aluminum battery?

 

[Droschke]

Target bat ActiveCool: If the battery temp exceeds this, the car will use AC to cool the battery.
Target bat Passive: The car will try to get the battery to this temperature without active heating or cooling.
Target bat ActiveHeat: The car will run the heater or motor until the battery hits this temperature.

Is there a source/link for these definitions?

 

[airborne spoon]

what was your charging speed while the temps were at 140f? Because if the speed is dropping off you could have a closed louver and that'll make the batt be warmer than normal. That happened to me and i had to replace all 3 louvers, it was like $500 for the parts and i did it in my driveway pretty easy job.

 

[cleverscreenam]

At 70% I pulled 72 kw and I hit 140 F. At 8% start I pulled 121 kw. The current slowly decreased and the temp slowly increased. The whole supercharging session looked the same as all previous charging, except for the extreme heat, hotter temps each month as we roll out of winter. March-April I recall 130-135 temps before stopping at 70% and Jan-Feb I recall 125-130 temps before stopping at 70%

Just keep in mind my front fans didn't spin at all, even putting my ear right to the bumper at 140 F. But as soon I turned on the AC, the bumper fans spun up. Looks like this replacement battery pack has no chargegate.

I see "louver" rows in ScanMyTesla HVAC tab. What should those rows be reading?

 

[Dave EV]

Thanks Dave, looks like you get a lot more information from a 3 than a S. It's some relief knowing the 3's batteries are within design specs up to 131* F. Still surprising since an internet search for "18650 max temp" says 60c/140f discharging and 45c/113f charging.

The Model S has those data points on the CAN bus, too, I'm surprised if they aren't there for you. Here's a photo of the Model S diagnostic screen from 2016 that shows the following:
Passive Cooling Target: 52.0C
Active Cooling Target: 55.0C
Active Heating Target: 2.0C

Tesla Model S Service Screens Exposed - CleanTechnica

Sign up for daily news updates from CleanTechnica on email. Or follow us on Google News! I recently picked up a Certified Pre-Owned (CPO) Tesla Model S (part 1 and part 2 of that story), and in the first month, drove it across the US, gave the Supercharging network a ... [continued]

cleantechnica.com

Wondering if the Model 3 is a newer model with lithium iron phosphate (LFP) battery, which may have different characteristics, or is it a nickel-cobalt-aluminum battery?

My Model 3 is a 2018, so similar chemistry as the Model S (NCA). Don't know how Tesla changed the targets for LFP, but I'm sure the data is out there.

 

[cleverscreenam]

How about the motor, what are its' tolerances? Today I saw 225f (107c) drive unit temperature, and it was only 66f (19c) outside.

 

[demundus]

your temps are fine, the car will scream at you when they are not. and even if they were not, theres not much you can personally do, you'd be jumping a zillion hoops trying to prove to tesla that the cell temp went to 141 degrees for a minute on your 3rd party monitoring app.