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Is non enhanced autopilot included.

Discussion in 'Model X: Ordering, Production, Delivery' started by Gregkeys, Oct 21, 2016.

  1. Gregkeys

    Gregkeys Member

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    Starting a new thread here because this subject has come up in a couple places.

    When ordering a MX there is no option for non enhanced AP yet the APE wording says the enhancements include going from one to four camera's

    Does this mean that non standard is now included for no extra cost?
     
  2. MP3Mike

    MP3Mike Active Member

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    I highly doubt it as no AP features are listed on the Specs page for the car.

    I suspect one of two things happened with the EAP description:
    1. They expect people to know about AP1 and are talking about how EAP is better.
    2. They are talking about how you upgrade from "AP Safety Features" that are standard and probably only use 1 camera: "Active safety technologies, including collision avoidance and automatic emergency braking, will become available in December 2016 and roll out through over-the-air software updates."
     
  3. Sonny Daze

    Sonny Daze Member

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    Agree with @MP3Mike, I believe this sentence is just explaining the difference between the "old" and "new" AP. It does seem a bit confusing as it assumes the reader knows what the "old" AP is.
     
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  4. Gregkeys

    Gregkeys Member

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    Any ideas how they might handle people who opted not to get AP but we're expecting to only pay $3000-$3500 surely they will make the 1 camera option available to maintain that promise?
     
  5. vigge50

    vigge50 Member

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    I'm not sure of that, with new hardware they will need to reprogram a lot wish is the reason many functions that was included before won't exist from the beginning but added later. Because of this reason I don't believe they will make a new software for the few how order a car with old autopilot but get a car with new hardware.
     
  6. S4WRXTTCS

    S4WRXTTCS Active Member

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    All I have to say about it is it's horribly written.

    They don't need to talk about AP 1.0 or mention anything about it since it's completely irrelevant.

    Just say what it is, and what separates it from the active safety. Even with the active safety they failed to say what it all used (how many cameras, etc).
     
  7. vigge50

    vigge50 Member

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    What is it that is horrible written? The safety features is mention at the bottom of the page about autopilot and it's probably using the ultra spencer and one of the front cameras but what does it matter wish equiptment it need as long as it work? The standard feature is automatic emergency braking, side collision warning, front collision warning and auto high beam. If you buy the enhanced autopilot it can do all highway driving wish I would is like level 3 autonomous and the full selfdriving capability is just that, it's level 5 autonomous driving.
     
  8. S4WRXTTCS

    S4WRXTTCS Active Member

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    #8 S4WRXTTCS, Oct 22, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2016
    Because ultra-sonic sensors have significant limitations and are prone to failing to detect things. If you have the first generation AP you'll see this first hand with the side monitoring system when it fails to detect semi trucks right next to you. Or when you park it straight it that sometimes it will go from saying 15 inches to saying like 30 inches as you pull in. It does this because it's just measuring bounced sound waves and has no way to present a vertical gradient.

    When I buy something I want a good sense that it's going to be able to do what it purports to do. The first generation AP cannot do side-collision avoidance well enough. So what I'm looking for as a potential customer of a car with AP 2.0 is to see if it fixes the first generation problems.
     
  9. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    There is no longer any such thing as "non enhanced AP" or what is often referred to as AP 1.0. Is has been replaced with Enhanced AP with 4 cameras, 12 new and improved ultrasonic sensors, and still includes one forward radar.

    I do not know what "promise" you refer to. Please specify and provide a source.

    If you ordered a Tesla without AP before the recent announcement of the new options of Enhanced AP and Full Self Driving Capability you will still get your Tesla without AP. I can't tell from your post if that is what you did or not. Your statement "people who opted not to get AP but we're expecting to only pay $3000-$3500 " seems contradictory to me.
    The new Enhanced AP and Full Self Driving Capability options use new ultrasonic sensors that are more capable, according to Tesla. You can decide whether or not to believe them.
     
  10. Troy

    Troy Active Member

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    #10 Troy, Oct 22, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2016
    No. If you don't order the Enhanced Autopilot, you don't get any autopilot. The exception is, orders confirmed before 19th Oct that didn't go into production yet. Those people have the option to keep their original Autopilot 1.0 order for $3,000. Their car will have Autopilot 2.0 hardware but it will work like Autopilot 1.0.

    Quote: "If you choose not to upgrade, your car will be delivered with the options you configured, without Enhanced Autopilot features." Source 1, Source 2
     
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  11. Gregkeys

    Gregkeys Member

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    There is actually such a thing as AP1.0 with the new hardware it's being offered to those who ordered prior to the announcement and consists of 1 camera AP, it's just not publicly being offered, which is causing a problem and confusion because it is coming across as a shifty way to charge more for increased costs after a mutual agreed price.

    The promise I'm referring to is this https://goo.gl/images/1vD07V the text on the bottom of the option clearly states that AP can be enabled after for $3000 the reasonable expectation is that price is locked in for the customer, otherwise it would contain fine print or parentheses something like "price subject to change"

    If they don't stick to the reasonable expectation they are opening the door for bad things to happen.

    I'm assuming their plan is to always make the AP 1.0 equivalent available to maintain that expectation, I'm thinking they just aren't advertising it in an effort to push people toward APE

    If they don't have that AP 1.0 option available then they pretty much have to either make APE available for the price expected which isn't fair to the people who are being told they have to pay the difference if they want APE.

    The simplest solution to this whole mess is to simply put AP 1.0 on the order form for the last price listed, either that or give APE for the price expected.

    As for me im all in, the nerd in me couldn't handle not having the self driving Capability.
     
  12. vigge50

    vigge50 Member

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    Haven't it happened before? For some weeks ago they change the price for autopilot both if you bought it directly and if you bought it afterwards. Here in Sweden where the price have gone up several times because of more expensive dollar the price of activating autopilot have change several times for activating it afterwards. If they have higher the price on exactly same packege I have hard to belive that can't change the price if more funktions is included.
     
  13. Gregkeys

    Gregkeys Member

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    I think that is why they are packaging it as a new product, there is s certain level of continuity they must maintain so that they don't upset customers to the point their reputation delta becomes too negative.

    They also don't want to open themselves up to lawsuits like false advertising.

    Small movements in price probably go relatively unnoticed but large ones +$5000 need special care.
     
  14. vigge50

    vigge50 Member

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    The price haven't increase by over $5000, it cost $3500 before to upgrade and now it cost $6000, it's an increase of $2500 wish is a lot of money but you also get more functionality.
    If you talk about a increase of other +$5000 you must mean the full autonomous packege and you can't compere that, it's lvl 5 autonomous instead of lvl 2 wish you order. You schould be happy that you got a car wish is mush better then you order, there are several in Europe that ordered P100D when it was revealed and still waiting, they won't get the new equipment wish mean there cars have lost value before they even got them delivered.
     
  15. Gregkeys

    Gregkeys Member

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    I'm very happy and not speaking about my situation.

    Im simply talking about my observations.

    There is a general misunderstanding about many things around the update and I'm looking to see what others think about the confusing parts.
     

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