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Is Tesla losing its USP?

With many of the main stream brands now having or certainly nearly having a half decent EV line up I think The Tesla USP of being the only decent EV is going to quickly go.
Brand loyalty is a big thing as we know , Apple have it in abundance... this is not only because they make great products but also have some of the best after service you can get anywhere in the world.... Tesla, do make a great product but the customer service is shocking and the reliability is still a bit questionable.
So if the only USP is being the current best EV maker, I think that could go down hill pretty fast now ....

Agree ?
 
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So I was recently in the market for a Model 3. So where exactly is the direct competition for this car? There’s the VW ID3 if you want a cheaper hatch with less performance. There’s the Polestar 2 if you want more of an SUV feel. I can’t think of anything else?

Next year I’m looking to replace my MX. There’s the Audi e-tron, the Merc or much smaller iPace. The Audi is the only one of those 3 I would even consider and it looks to be slower and less efficient, which is not a good start.

Then there’s the charging network. I’m not yet ready for the gamble of public charging. So Tesla remain my go-to EV choice.
 
There’s the Audi e-tron, the Merc or much smaller iPace. The Audi is the only one of those 3 I would even consider and it looks to be slower and less efficient, which is not a good start.
Just before I collected my M3 I was parked next to an Audi e-tron at the supermarket. Owner returned as I was loading the boot, so I asked about it, particularly the range as it's a BIG car.
His reply: "On a good run I can get 190miles from full, but if I hoof it it will be down to double figures in no time"

I wouldn't want that kind of range anxiety.....
 
So I was recently in the market for a Model 3. So where exactly is the direct competition for this car? There’s the VW ID3 if you want a cheaper hatch with less performance. There’s the Polestar 2 if you want more of an SUV feel. I can’t think of anything else?

Next year I’m looking to replace my MX. There’s the Audi e-tron, the Merc or much smaller iPace. The Audi is the only one of those 3 I would even consider and it looks to be slower and less efficient, which is not a good start.

Then there’s the charging network. I’m not yet ready for the gamble of public charging. So Tesla remain my go-to EV choice.

The new Audi coupe , the Jag , the VW family including a great looking Skoda concept due this year, BMW i4 and those are just the ones I can think of off the top of my head ...

granted the supercharger network is a big advantage for Tesla , but Rapid chargers are in the increase ... it won’t be long before that won’t matter as much

I do like my M3P, it’s a great car ... I’m just wondering how long Tesla will have the advantage, I don’t think it will be long
 

GRiLLA

Active Member
Jul 5, 2020
2,079
2,265
UK
Disagree, always had great service from Tesla and I don't know what you mean by reliability being questionable. Sure I had some issues from new, but now it's all fixed my Model 3 has been flawless as you would expect since August 2019.

It's good to see competition starting to make viable electric cars, that will drive Tesla on and hasten the electrification of transport. Being electric isn't the USP.

The USP should be having the best entertainment, best efficiency, best charging network, and Autopilot. Compare the competition fairly, for example look at

Things to learn from PoleStar | Tesla Motors Club

It's clear Tesla are still well ahead
 
The new Audi coupe , the Jag , the VW family including a great looking Skoda concept due this year, BMW i4 and those are just the ones I can think of off the top of my head ...

granted the supercharger network is a big advantage for Tesla , but Rapid chargers are in the increase ... it won’t be long before that won’t matter as much

I do like my M3P, it’s a great car ... I’m just wondering how long Tesla will have the advantage, I don’t think it will be long

But there isn’t actually much else you can actually buy today. There is more choice in the sub £30k category, but not much in Tesla price range.

When you look at all the ICE cars mainstream brands are still very much pushing, you have to question their real commitment to BEVs. Especially from the eyes of a franchised dealer. Their whole business model could collapse with a major shift to EVs.
 
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The USP should be having the best entertainment, best efficiency, best charging network, and Autopilot.

Different people have different priorities. I couldn’t give a fig about entertainment or about the fact that my car can fart. I’ve used a supercharger twice in 23K miles, and both times there was a viable alternative. Autopilot is good, but Tesla’s version is very unreliable, sometimes downright dangerous, and other manufacturers have much better systems.

Not everyone needs blistering performance or the very best range. For these people I can see little advantage in owning a Tesla. In fact if your priority was build quality, comfort and refinement an M3 would not on my shopping list. I’d be more likely to go for an e-tron, despite having less range and performance.
 
For me the Audi and Jag are way out of my budget and from my view point don't offer good range given their cost.
The M3 is a stretch for me on my budget, but look at the range against the Audi and Jag.
Throw in the charging network and Tesla have it.
I know all about supercharging on the 'other' networks, had a leaf for nearly 3 years. It can be very trying at times.
If I didn't need the charging network (because maybe I didn't drive far very often) then e-niro 64kwh would have been the one for me.
 

Drew57

Active ember
Apr 4, 2020
1,495
1,786
Chester UK
Mobileye looks impressive & if many others can adopt this, maybe the hyped-up, rumoured FSD pricing will have to be much more realistic. I've seen some ridiculous figures suggested, allegedly from Musk

Once charging and autonomy are widely available along with premium quality and a more customer focused Corporate approach from competitors,Tesla will have a much tougher challenge.

That's not to say I have any issues whatsoever with my own car & if I can get a Model Y in a few years in the same (virtually perfect) condition from the forthcoming Chester Service Centre with the same levels of support I've received from Stockport then I will remain loyal.
 
Different people have different priorities. I couldn’t give a fig about entertainment or about the fact that my car can fart. I’ve used a supercharger twice in 23K miles, and both times there was a viable alternative. Autopilot is good, but Tesla’s version is very unreliable, sometimes downright dangerous, and other manufacturers have much better systems.

Not everyone needs blistering performance or the very best range. For these people I can see little advantage in owning a Tesla. In fact if your priority was build quality, comfort and refinement an M3 would not on my shopping list. I’d be more likely to go for an e-tron, despite having less range and performance.

Looks like you maybe chose the wrong car. That’s the thing with cars. The idea is to pick one that best suits your needs. For me right now that just happens to be a Tesla. Same for my wife, which is why we ended up with two.

Pros: performance, range, efficiency, tech, infotainment, minimalist style, quiet EV drivetrain

Cons: build quality
 

Glan gluaisne

Active Member
Supporting Member
Sep 11, 2019
2,782
2,922
UK
Different people have different priorities. I couldn’t give a fig about entertainment or about the fact that my car can fart. I’ve used a supercharger twice in 23K miles, and both times there was a viable alternative. Autopilot is good, but Tesla’s version is very unreliable, sometimes downright dangerous, and other manufacturers have much better systems.

Not everyone needs blistering performance or the very best range. For these people I can see little advantage in owning a Tesla. In fact if your priority was build quality, comfort and refinement an M3 would not on my shopping list. I’d be more likely to go for an e-tron, despite having less range and performance.

I agree 100%. I've not yet used a supercharger at all, in over 14 months of ownership (accepting that it's been a strange year). Most important entertainment feature for me is having a very good radio, and I have to say, as someone that lives in an area with generally lousy radio reception, the Tesla Model 3 radio is outstandingly good, far and away the best I've had in any car I've ever owned.

It's the atrocious behaviour and interface for things I need to use all the time that has convinced me to not buy another Tesla. This winter, most of my driving has been at night, often in bad weather, and mostly on narrow and winding rural roads. The poor performance of the headlights and wipers is something that is a constant source of irritation. I know they will probably work a fair bit better come the summer, but I didn't buy the car only to use it in good weather. The high level of wind noise in the cabin is also a PITA, and something that the SC can apparently do nothing more about.

I quite like the e-Tron and the i-Pace, but am also leaning towards the Mustang Mach E, and definitely want to take a look at an ID.4, just to see if the interior is better than that in the ID.3. Since making the decision to buy the Model 3, nearly 2 years ago now, the availability of alternatives has increased a great deal, which has to be a good thing.
 
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Once charging and autonomy are widely available along with premium quality and a more customer focused Corporate approach from competitors,Tesla will have a much tougher challenge.

I’ve never personally found any car dealerships that are genuinely customer focused. Our local BMW dealership is not bad actually, but most car dealerships are pretty dodgy, both in sales and service. People often criticise Tesla service, but I’ve never had a problem with them. On the contrary they’ve been very good. Sample of one, but it’s the one that counts for me.
 
i saw my first Mustang Mach E yesterday and happened to talk to the owner. It still had temp tags on and he said he's had it a week and is very underwhelmed. He also has a model 3 DM and said there's just no comparison on the tech and the interface. It ended up he worked for a ford dealer....not the glowing review i would have expected. I did the notice i couldn't see any door handles but overall it the car looked fairly cool.
 

Glan gluaisne

Active Member
Supporting Member
Sep 11, 2019
2,782
2,922
UK
i saw my first Mustang Mach E yesterday and happened to talk to the owner. It still had temp tags on and he said he's had it a week and is very underwhelmed. He also has a model 3 DM and said there's just no comparison on the tech and the interface. It ended up he worked for a ford dealer....not the glowing review i would have expected. I did the notice i couldn't see any door handles but overall it the car looked fairly cool.

Mentioned here before, but there is a potential issue here with the Model 3 interface, at least for right handed people that haven't grown up with prehensile thumbs. I know from driving a rental car in the US that had a touch screen nav system that it was dead easy to use, as I'm right handed and the screen was on the right. I find the Tesla screen on the left a lot harder to use with my left hand, and have often had to pull over and stop just to turn the wipers on or off this winter (the auto wipers just don't seem to work at all well). It's the driver interface, more than anything else, that's pushing me to changing the car, TBH. This winter, with lots of night driving, has highlighted just how challenging it is to get things like the wipers and headlights to work quickly and easily when needed, something that's never been a problem on any other car I've ever owned. The last few cars had auto wiper systems that pretty much just worked, pity that the Tesla system has so many bugs, as these small, but massively annoying, bugs let down what is an otherwise very good car in many respects.
 
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15Peter20

Member
Supporting Member
Oct 26, 2020
753
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Coincidentally I was reading the new Lexus UX specs before I noticed this thread and: what a joke.

Range and performance all miles away from anything Tesla makes and the price is in M3 SR+ territory.

So bad that the last page of the price list asks whether you might prefer a ‘self charging’ hybrid.

This is Lexus for crying out loud, the poster child for Japanese automotive engineering.
 
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Mentioned here before, but there is a potential issue here with the Model 3 interface, at least for right handed people that haven't grown up with prehensile thumbs. I know from driving a rental car in the US that had a touch screen nav system that it was dead easy to use, as I'm right handed and the screen was on the right. I find the Tesla screen on the left a lot harder to use with my left hand, and have often had to pull over and stop just to turn the wipers on or off this winter (the auto wipers just don't seem to work at all well). It's the driver interface, more than anything else, that's pushing me to changing the car, TBH. This winter, with lots of night driving, has highlighted just how challenging it is to get things like the wipers and headlights to work quickly and easily when needed, something that's never been a problem on any other car I've ever owned. The last few cars had auto wiper systems that pretty much just worked, pity that the Tesla system has so many bugs, as these small, but massively annoying, bugs let down what is an otherwise very good car in many respects.

Yes, i understand there seems to be issues with right hand drive ( i'm not sure why Tesla can't resolve this) a lot of bugs or problems i read on here seem very specific to your cars like the lights and wipers, things we don't have an issue with. Maybe once the cars are made in Europe things will be better although being built in Germany won't help with right hand drive setup.
 
My 2 pence - I drove a ford fiesta for 10 years, and a BMW 3 series for 11 years. I'm waiting for my M3LR. I was 5 minutes from buying a BMW 5 series PHEV, but they wouldnt liver it, and I wasnt waiting weeks for the lockdown the end to get the car.

The 5 series would have furfilled my needs - electric for all of my daily commute was the goal. My problem was that I would still have the same anxiety whenever I went to get it serviced - would it £200/£500/£700 this time? That's what drew me to Tesla. I expect to keep it for a minimum 7 years. But I fulling expect all the other car manufacturers to catch up and this will be my last Tesla. Especially after seeing what they have done to the model S - the steering wheel and no gear stick is a step too far.
 
Looks like you maybe chose the wrong car. That’s the thing with cars. The idea is to pick one that best suits your needs. For me right now that just happens to be a Tesla. Same for my wife, which is why we ended up with two.

Pros: performance, range, efficiency, tech, infotainment, minimalist style, quiet EV drivetrain

Cons: build quality

No, the M3 was the best option for me at the time and I don’t regret buying it. But in my next car I want much better refinement and build quality, intelligent cruise control that doesn’t slam the brakes on for no reason and windscreen wipers and headlights that aren’t a constant source of irritation. Oh, and a decent binnacle display and a HUD. That pretty much rules Tesla out.
 
Mentioned here before, but there is a potential issue here with the Model 3 interface, at least for right handed people that haven't grown up with prehensile thumbs. I know from driving a rental car in the US that had a touch screen nav system that it was dead easy to use, as I'm right handed and the screen was on the right. I find the Tesla screen on the left a lot harder to use with my left hand, and have often had to pull over and stop just to turn the wipers on or off this winter (the auto wipers just don't seem to work at all well). It's the driver interface, more than anything else, that's pushing me to changing the car, TBH. This winter, with lots of night driving, has highlighted just how challenging it is to get things like the wipers and headlights to work quickly and easily when needed, something that's never been a problem on any other car I've ever owned. The last few cars had auto wiper systems that pretty much just worked, pity that the Tesla system has so many bugs, as these small, but massively annoying, bugs let down what is an otherwise very good car in many respects.

I think this is one of those divisive personal things. My father-in-law would never stand a chance with a Tesla UI (due to eyesight issues), but I think it’s great.
 
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