Is Tesla losing its USP?

[AnthonyLR]

I can report the Tesla USP of surprising owners is well an truly alive, my passenger side window has become manually operated via pushing it up and down with my hands........I have to say in over 2 decades of owning cars with powered windows I've never had the pleasure of this experience, including a 15 year old Mazda.

£71K I believe was how much our Tesla cost, under 40K miles and just over 3 years old.......Good work Elon, I wonder what the next 'surprise' will be

My late Dad had a Rolls Royce Silver Shadow II in the 1970's where the window did the same. It also conked out going up hills as the Rover-sourced fuel pump wasn't strong enough for the massive engine. Ah, happy childhood days...

 

[flowuk]

Just to put my two-penneth in.

I ordered an M3LR (company lease) last week. This was after looking at both the new Mustang Mach-E & the Polestar 2. I was really taken with the Polestar 2 but, one thing stopped me from ordering it instead of the Tesla. The Supercharger network. This to me is currently their last remaining USP.

 

[Jason71]

My late Dad had a Rolls Royce Silver Shadow II in the 1970's where the window did the same. It also conked out going up hills as the Rover-sourced fuel pump wasn't strong enough for the massive engine. Ah, happy childhood days...

That's nothing we had a private Jet with a window that fell right out mid flight and we were all sucked out of the window at 30,000 feet and killed instantly
And you tell that to the youth of today and they wont believe you.

 

[SpareHeadOne]

The TM3 is unashamedly an EV - not trying to be something it's not. That, combined with the charging network is the reason I bought mine and I still think it's the EV that sets the benchmark for everyone else.

If the Jag had the network? Maybe could have been tempted, but not interested in the Porsche or Audi.

The main problem I have with the Jag is the location of the charge port. My car goes in a garage, so with the Jag I have a choice of being able to charge or being able to get in and out of the car on the driver's side as the garage isn't wide enough to allow me to do both because I can't get down the passenger side of the car to reach the port.

In an LHD environment that wouldn't be a problem, but in that case the charge port will make the cable stick out into the middle of the road when using kerbside public charge points.

For the life of me, I can't understand the logic. The sides of the car are always going to be problematic within the wheelbase.

 

[Zakalwe]

That's nothing we had a private Jet with a window that fell right out mid flight and we were all sucked out of the window at 30,000 feet and killed instantly
And you tell that to the youth of today and they wont believe you.

You had a jet? Luxury.
We had to make do with a paper-plane made from a bit of paper borrowed from t'neighbour.

 

[MrBadger]

You had a jet? Luxury.

Not now that he is dead

 

[nxsynjs]

It was inevitable legacy auto would start to catch up, so in that sense yes Tesla is losing it's USP.. However for me, the real USP of tesla ownership is the super charger network and atm it seems that in the uk other networks arent even close

 

[MrBadger]

It was inevitable legacy auto would start to catch up, so in that sense yes Tesla is losing it's USP.. However for me, the real USP of tesla ownership is the super charger network and atm it seems that in the uk other networks arent even close

I am thinking that Gridserve may change that somewhat as they roll out to more sites Gridserve Charger Sites in UK [megathread]

Maybe not as convenient so far as pulling into some motorway services, but it looks to be a very workable format that they are working with. Good selection of charging options too.

 

[eight]

Yeah, I'd agree that Tesla has lost some of it's USP.
There are loads of EVs available now but if you want to use an EV for long distance travel there's still only one manufacturer capable of delivering... in the UK at least.
I've lost count of the Taycan/Audi/other YouTube videos where they can't charge as quickly as expected, if at all.

 

[Jason71]

I am thinking that Gridserve may change that somewhat as they roll out to more sites Gridserve Charger Sites in UK [megathread]

Maybe not as convenient so far as pulling into some motorway services, but it looks to be a very workable format that they are working with. Good selection of charging options too.

The likes of Gridserve is definitely what we need but its going to take them years to catch up to the SuC network and motorway services seem like the main place Rapid charging is needed and there it looks like it will shake out that the main competition will be Ionity and Ecotricity i.e. the one that is 3 times the price and the one that doesn't work.

 

[Dasher]

Courtesy of Green Car Guide and Electrifying.com, I note that the government is planning on providing money to enable “at least six high power chargers in every motorway service area by 2023”, with service level agreements. I think this would be great, but seems very unrealistic. Most motorway services could probably utilise, say, 30 to 40 chargers, or more. I don't have the figures, but I bet that even expensive motorway petrol stations handle large numbers of cars and vans refuelling, every day. Perhaps the government's assumption is that commercial companies will join in the investment.

New 150kW ultra-rapid EV chargers in all motorway services by 2023 - GreenCarGuide.co.uk

 

[MooseBerg]

I'm a bit unclear what Tesla think their direction is - don't get me wrong, I've ordered an LRAWD and take delivery in 8 days, I like the cars, but they've got some weird mixes of decisions.

The model 3 aims to be sporty. All Teslas accelerate fast. So it's a drivers car - except they don't give you all the controls and feedback you expect, because you won't need it once it drives itself. Well, you won't need the performance or relatively harsh ride either. For me it's two totally separate car visions that have collided.

Why did I buy it? Range, speed, not an SUV, superchargers making charging quick, easy and reliable. Why did I consider not buying it? Not a hatch so less practical, frameless windows, excessive touchscreening, bad wipers, Superchargers - the idea of walled gardens is not one I wish to persist. Yeah yeah I know, I put it on both sides, I didn't say I made any sense! I wonder where we'll be in a few years.

 

[OttoR]

Courtesy of Green Car Guide and Electrifying.com, I note that the government is planning on providing money to enable “at least six high power chargers in every motorway service area by 2023”, with service level agreements. I think this would be great, but seems very unrealistic. Most motorway services could probably utilise, say, 30 to 40 chargers, or more. I don't have the figures, but I bet that even expensive motorway petrol stations handle large numbers of cars and vans refuelling, every day. Perhaps the government's assumption is that commercial companies will join in the investment.

New 150kW ultra-rapid EV chargers in all motorway services by 2023 - GreenCarGuide.co.uk

Big difference with cars refuelling is that they have to refuel at a petrol station. EV's typically can leave with fully charged and recharge at their destination.

Most ICE drivers fuel ad-hoc whenever the tank is empty and end up at the most convenient stop, even if this is an expensive motorway station. I assume this is due to employers reimbursement of fuel or rich people .

In the past 20 years I rarely used them and planned for a stop at the cheapest station in the network of brand reimbursement by my employer.

EV drivers would have less use of these unless they were on a long drive exceeding the one charge range.
With my ICE if I was able to fuel at my home, work or hotel while sleeping / working. I would have used a highway fuel station probably four times per year when on vacation / long road trip for work.

 

[interbear]

With many of the main stream brands now having or certainly nearly having a half decent EV line up I think The Tesla USP of being the only decent EV is going to quickly go.
Brand loyalty is a big thing as we know , Apple have it in abundance... this is not only because they make great products but also have some of the best after service you can get anywhere in the world.... Tesla, do make a great product but the customer service is shocking and the reliability is still a bit questionable.
So if the only USP is being the current best EV maker, I think that could go down hill pretty fast now ....

Agree ?

I think Tesla has 2 USPs that will keep it ahead of the ICE manufacturers for some time yet as they transition from ICE to EV.

1) Battery tech - Tesla have a significant head start on this, range, charge speed etc seem better than most competitors. Given that Tesla is a pure EV player, with years of expertise in battery tech, I expect them to stay in front for some time.
2) Supercharger network - huge USP for Tesla, the hassle and unreliability of a 3rd party charging network would put me off buying any other EV and I don’t think they are even close to catching up with Tesla on this.

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

I don't think the battery tech is ahead anymore. The new Model S and X are using pretty much the same battery that came out in 2015 when they changed the anode coating to create the 90 battery, its been increased in size and the cooling has been tweaked but its otherwise pretty similar. Those charging the e-tron in a rapid rapid (150kw+) are maintaining a higher charge rate for longer. The M3 is a bit better and the Plaid+ and maybe the Berlin MY battery when it appears is better again, but Tesla market the future and deliver the past at the moment, they do it with FSD as well. They might have the tech in the lab but are not putting it into delivery.

Supercharging has always been a USP as many feel, but with increasing numbers of destination chargers and range now increasingly into the 200 and 250+ mile bracket, the combination is reducing the need to charge. 5 years ago I'd travel 200 miles to friends, have to stop and supercharge on the way down to have enough to get back to the supercharger a few days later and I couldn't quite cover the journey. Today I could get there, plug into their charger and return home 2 days later without looking at a supercharger. So the supercharger USP is under threat from both a general reduction in need and more and more other rapid choices, some of which are more conveniently located than superchargers.

Mooseberg makes a great point about the mixed messages - in addition to the performance v its going to drive you, the same can be said for safety. The relative lack of nags (or easily defeated) on AP, not great driver communication regarding visual clues when slowing for an junction, accelerating as fast as it does, everything being beta, phantom braking etc all don't seem 100% aligned to the a more Volvo mentality on safety.

 

[Jason71]

looks like Tesla still has a few things going for it:

 

[SpareHeadOne]

That's interesting, I think the last time Carwow did a test like that including a Tesla they managed something like 69% of the claimed range.

 

[Jason71]

That's interesting, I think the last time Carwow did a test like that including a Tesla they managed something like 69% of the claimed range.

I noticed that the Perf started out with an estimate of 307. and did 286 so 93% of what IT thought It could do. The 356 is EPA or WLTP I assume?

 

[Dilly]

You had a jet? Luxury.
We had to make do with a paper-plane made from a bit of paper borrowed from t'neighbour.

Luxury
we ‘ad a soap box cart wi‘ no wheels... it were a Rolls-Royce to us.
OMG I can’t believe I’m old enough to know the sketch and young enough to remember the entire script

 

[Peteski]

A big hidden Tesla USP is battery cost. Tesla have the cheapest unit battery manufacturing cost and are likely to do so for at least this decade. I believe GM are in second place in this respect and the likes of VW are paying a hefty premium for their packs. It's a major advantage in actually achieving a commercially viable EV product.