Jason71
Active Member
is 50% really the worst case for an M3 with 200K miles? its certainly not going to be the 25 % in your calculation. the post you replied to had 13.7K as the retained value i.e. 75% depreciation you have reversed that.
Is Tesla viable for very high mileage delivery driver?
- Thread starter WannabeOwner
- Start date
PeteSanders
Member
I think this post is key to this issue and is probably the most important consideration here. As someone who spent over 30 years working in the transport industry at all levels up to qualified transport manager and company owner, I would think the cost of insurance for a group 50 vehicle , not just for 'business use' but for 'Carriage of Goods for Hire and Reward', which is the level of cover required and the high mileages involved, will be completely prohibitive, indeed, that's if such cover is even available!
Rooster6655
Active Member
Yeah your right, misread.
I did a quote with WBAC and for a near 3 year old M3 and 200k they were offering £18k, based on the original purchase price being £48k that's roughly 62.5% depreciation, so I think its a fair estimate to use for an estimate
Purchase
EV
-£55k
£20k value after depreciation of 35k over 3 years (63%)
+£47k fuel reclaim
=+12k take home
Van
-£8k
-£4k depreciation over 3 years
+4.5k fuel reclaim
=+£500
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Cleevely mobile team use an MG ZS with a similar mileage and are happy. The problem with Tesla is that they are very complex and you can only get it serviced by Tesla. MG and even Nissan can be bought with minimum spec like no fancy heat pump or touch screen and reduce the overall downtime and maintenance cost.
Thanks. I'd forgotten about that example. Cleevely Mobile have been here to service my EVs ... I'm nowhere near them, and one of their YouTube recently was a 7-day-ish tour of remote parts of Scotland servicing EVs ... so they are putting a lot of mileage on their vehicles, and without the benefit of Supercharger network for travel (although I expect many/most owners are happy for them to plug-in when on-site, which is going to be a hour or two per stop - not the same for a courier driver
)
UkNorthampton
TSLA - 12+ startups in 1
Regarding used prices for EVs, my opinion...
1) Short-term HIGH prices, 20-40% higher than 18-24 months ago for same car, even though it's older by 18-24 months,
2) Medium-Term HIGHER prices
"The area within this Red triangle represents 600 million vehicles of unmet Demand because the BEV industry needs time to ramp up, especially in Battery Supply"
1) Short-term HIGH prices, 20-40% higher than 18-24 months ago for same car, even though it's older by 18-24 months,
2) Medium-Term HIGHER prices
"The area within this Red triangle represents 600 million vehicles of unmet Demand because the BEV industry needs time to ramp up, especially in Battery Supply"
I think that EVs will have good 2nd price for some time. New Buy numbers are increasing, and with it awareness, and thus I think number of people wanting a 2nd hand EV will increase too ... but the number available is the number sold as-new X-Years ago ... so limited supply not matching the demand ...
But I'm not so sure about high mileage ... there won't be much experience of those knocking about ... so might be harder to find many takers?
I think a better bet might be to sell e.g. annually as a "high mileage" vehicle, and then anyone doing very low mileage can snap it up for what they see as a bargain, and without the risk of an "extremely high mileage vehicle".
Basically that would mean that the courier was just cashing in on fuel-saving ...
Its a bit like my Lettuce plants. I sow half a dozen, and then when I prick them out, ready to plant out a bit later, I sow another 6 seeds. Rinse and repeat.
"Got an EDD for my car, need to order another one NOW"
But I'm not so sure about high mileage ... there won't be much experience of those knocking about ... so might be harder to find many takers?
I think a better bet might be to sell e.g. annually as a "high mileage" vehicle, and then anyone doing very low mileage can snap it up for what they see as a bargain, and without the risk of an "extremely high mileage vehicle".
Basically that would mean that the courier was just cashing in on fuel-saving ...
Its a bit like my Lettuce plants. I sow half a dozen, and then when I prick them out, ready to plant out a bit later, I sow another 6 seeds. Rinse and repeat.
"Got an EDD for my car, need to order another one NOW"
Jason71
Active Member
I had genuinely considered doing this but the delivery times are still a bit short on the MY if it was nearer a year a might on the assumption the new price will go up ( just went up by £1000 already last week) and then I can trade in the one I don't even have yet in 9 months to a year with almost no loss of value. might even make a profit! I know you can put it off for a bit so there is that option. And the deposit is low so not much to lose even though it may not be refundable if its a company purchase..."Got an EDD for my car, need to order another one NOW"
I think that might work?
Presume "Can't take delivery" will push you back to next Quarter ...
So order at end of Q1, refuse delivery at end Q2, take delivery at end of Q3 ... that's 6 months from placing order ... so provides some leeway of placing an order after 6 months, in order to trade-up after 12 months, and depending on how the Trade-In price looks at that time ...
Got to sort out / roll-over the finance. But if that is a Bank Loan that might be more straightforward than any sort of lease that might have early-termination clauses.
Surely he could insure himself put of the breakdown/off the road problem? Commercial insurance to at least get him moving the next day in a loaner.
Equally at the price difference enhancement would a 3 phase upgrade be worth it to get a full charge in the octopus 4hr? Most businesses looking at this type of conversation will be looking at infrastructure upgrades to support their fleet.
I've seen some threads about the relative delicacy of the wheels in commercial use (although those were not owner driver situations so they were getting a hammering) - might be worth getting a set of compatible steelies and put the 'good' wheels away for trade in time.
Don't underestimate the life quality change from walkaway lock and auto start. Every stop and start loses about 10 actions (park brake, engine off, key out etc) - they are automatic but the Tesla with the phone as a key eliminates many of them. Get in and go.
Overall I would have thought at those milages it's a no brainer - more miles more the gap grows. Just have to find ways to manage down the risks, and know where to go for splash and dash when it's needed and time a lunch pause around it.
Our local DPD lady is in a little nissan EV van. Mostly last mile around the urban world so a bit different, bit she always seems really smug
.
Equally at the price difference enhancement would a 3 phase upgrade be worth it to get a full charge in the octopus 4hr? Most businesses looking at this type of conversation will be looking at infrastructure upgrades to support their fleet.
I've seen some threads about the relative delicacy of the wheels in commercial use (although those were not owner driver situations so they were getting a hammering) - might be worth getting a set of compatible steelies and put the 'good' wheels away for trade in time.
Don't underestimate the life quality change from walkaway lock and auto start. Every stop and start loses about 10 actions (park brake, engine off, key out etc) - they are automatic but the Tesla with the phone as a key eliminates many of them. Get in and go.
Overall I would have thought at those milages it's a no brainer - more miles more the gap grows. Just have to find ways to manage down the risks, and know where to go for splash and dash when it's needed and time a lunch pause around it.
Our local DPD lady is in a little nissan EV van. Mostly last mile around the urban world so a bit different, bit she always seems really smug
.
henderrj
Active Member
Not sure what the policy is there, but over here we get free supercharging when we have a loaner. That is to say, our account doesn't get dinged for it. That might make it actually a good deal to have your car in the shop!
His warranty and therefore access to loan vehicles will end after about 9 months. I can’t imagine that Tesla would cover the thousands of miles he would rack up whilst waiting for a new windscreen! He would have to have an alternative back up plan. This is what any commercial business would do anyway but we’re talking about a lone operator here, no doubt running his operation on a shoestring.
RAC has this as an extra:
Onward Travel
Can't do without your car? Get a hire car while yours is in the garage.~
They also have the option of:
Battery Replace
Get a new battery if we can't recharge yours.
which would be a stunning deal in a Tesla
Onward Travel
Can't do without your car? Get a hire car while yours is in the garage.~
They also have the option of:
Battery Replace
Get a new battery if we can't recharge yours.
which would be a stunning deal in a Tesla
Rooster6655
Active Member
Last time I actually read an agreement for a loaner Tesla, there was a limited mileage of 100 miles a day, but that was a while ago as they favour Uber credit these days
I am not sure that it would work to use a loaner car for commercial reasons on commercial insurance, sounds fine in theory but I am sure Tesla wouldn't want you doing it and put something in the terms for the car separate to any insurance
The 3 phase thing is a good idea however would depend on costs and availability in the person's area.
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My point was that he may be spending more time charging than driving if he gets an older model. While free supercharger miles is a plus, having to 'fill up' a few times a day is less appealing.
I'd second that. My 2015 Model-S was 250-miles-ish (at motorway speeds) and current MS LR is 300-miles-ish.
I've gone from needing out-of-range charging 2 days a month to once or twice a year, and that includes trips that we didn't use to do with the old one - e.g. Skiing in the Alps.
The delivery driver is around the 300 miles on a max-miles-day - so right around the point where charging would be needed, So at worst (in a 300-miles-raqnge EV) "splash and dash" rather than "20 minutes charging" (for a 250 mile range EV). But I'll mention it to him - he may say that he has to stop to eat every day, and if every day he stopped for 20 minutes at a Supercharger and put 150 miles in the tank for free ... that might make the sums work for him.
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