Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Is the Tesla wave / chin hello dead?

This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
Yesterday while driving in Napa, we'd just seen a Model S and were commenting on it, when coming straight at me with no DLRs, crossing the double yellow line, was Model S #2. I guess he'd seen me, I hadn't noticed him, so he was weaving (not waving) to say "Hi."

I prefer the chin wave, the headlight flash, or the chin nod. Even DLRs on might have helped!

Can't say I knew the car. Coulda been a tourist (wine-o country), or they might know me and were just being goofy like me.
 
Is there a good reason for NOT using the DRLs all the time?

Yes: they're incredibly distracting. There's nothing worse than having a vehicle with DRLs in your rear view mirror. The twinkling of those lights (due to bumps in the road changing the angle of incidence off the mirror) constantly alerts your peripheral vision, distracting you from what's ahead. DRLs are a menace and I wish they were banned.
 
Yes: they're incredibly distracting. There's nothing worse than having a vehicle with DRLs in your rear view mirror. The twinkling of those lights (due to bumps in the road changing the angle of incidence off the mirror) constantly alerts your peripheral vision, distracting you from what's ahead. DRLs are a menace and I wish they were banned.

completely disagree. DRLs are required by law in Canada and mandatory to be on. AFAIK No car can be sold in Canada without DRLs. statistics have proven that DRLs reduce accidents. US should mandate a similar law.
 
Agree with ecarfan: I drive in the SF Bay Area (...lots of S on the road) and most have DRLs on (mine are....). Proven safety factor. Never bothered by glare in my rear view mirror (..but often amused by the patterns many LED DRLs make in the rear camera).
 
statistics have proven that DRLs reduce accidents.

Citation please? I'd be interested in the methodology (I'm a statistician). This seems like the kind of effect that would be extremely hard to measure, because (a) it's a minor effect on an already small number, (b) there are many confounding variables in rate of accidents, and (c) I'd be surprised if they counted, or even found a way to count, the number of accidents caused by DRL distraction. Happy to be proven wrong though. If they really are a net positive, I'll make peace with the annoyance.
 
Citation please? I'd be interested in the methodology (I'm a statistician). This seems like the kind of effect that would be extremely hard to measure, because (a) it's a minor effect on an already small number, (b) there are many confounding variables in rate of accidents, and (c) I'd be surprised if they counted, or even found a way to count, the number of accidents caused by DRL distraction. Happy to be proven wrong though. If they really are a net positive, I'll make peace with the annoyance.

NHTSA has several studies about the effectiveness of DRL, both pro and con. Here's a pro one: http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/Pubs/809760.pdf

Searches for NHTSA DRL will yield a plethora of statistical analysis on the topic.
 
Last edited:
I wouldn't expect it to last. Somehow the Jeep Wrangler wave endures, but it's a rare exception (It's a Jeep thing). Tesla has made their cars appealing enough to the masses to have a lot of customers who are not rabid fans and probably won't wave. But I think that's a good thing, overall.
 
NHTSA has several studies about the effectiveness of DRL, both pro and con. Here's a pro one: http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/Pubs/809760.pdf

Searches for NHTSA DRL will yield a plethora of statistical analysis on the topic.

Thank you! This is a rather interesting read, at multiple levels.

Before getting to the substance, let's take a moment to savor this glimpse into a delightfully bitter academic squabble. It is rare in a peer-reviewed paper even to mention the reviewers, other than in the Acknowledgements section to thank them for their time and helpful comments. In this paper, right up front in the abstract there's this:

"Reviewers of this paper required the inclusion of results using the odds ratio technique. The estimated the effect of DRLs are –6.3 percent, –7.9 percent, 3.8 percent, and 26 percent, respectively. None of these results were statistically significant."

In other words: we didn't want to publish these numbers, but they made us. By academic standards, that is downright testy. But it gets better in the prologue to Appendix B, where they get into the details of the math:

"This section is included at the request of the reviewers of the paper. The odds ratio is easier to understand for inexperienced analysts than the simple odds and, like the simple odds, attempts to control for a variety of factors other than the presence or absence of DRLs."

Ooooo, SMACK! They REALLY didn't like being told what to do. Having been part of this kind of process myself, I suspect what happened is a negotiation along these lines: Authors submit the paper using method A (simple odds). Reviewers say that's bogus, use method B (odds ratio). Authors say no, we really like A. Reviewers say look, use method B or we'll reject the paper. Authors say OK, how about a compromise: we'll publish both A and B. Reviewers relent, accept the paper. Final draft expresses authors' frustration. Reviewers probably piqued at the way it was presented, but technically the authors did what was asked, so they don't spike the paper.

Now, on to the actual data. Using the simple odds method, the authors conclude that DRLs reduce head-on collisions by 5%. By the usual p=0.05 standard, this result is not statistically significant; they admit this, and note the p=0.07 value. Using the odds ratio method, the authors find that DRLs actually *increase* head-on collisions by 6.3%, but this is not statistically significant either (p=0.23). I think (and will explain why if anyone actually cares, but fair warning, it would not be brief) that the reviewers were right: odds ratio is a better way to exclude exogenous variables in this case, although it's still pretty weak. By this metric, none of the results were statistically significant -- which means, in plain English, that given the available data, we cannot reject with 95% confidence the null hypothesis that DRLs make no difference. That is not surprising: small signals against a noisy background are just hard to measure.

They mentioned a number of other studies, including this rather amusing one: "Lau[17] estimates that DRLs reduce multiple vehicle crashes by 5 to 13 percent. Lau even estimates that DRLs reduce multiple vehicle nighttime crashes by 5 percent, which suggests that there may a confounding lurking variable within the data." Do tell. :rolleyes:
 
Last edited:
Sorry to derail the conversation with DRLs (though I find that topic interesting, so I'm happy to continue in another thread).

I drove a BMW back in the dark ages, so I'm all about flashing the lights, or "the nod." In our little town of 25K people, there are eight Teslas that I know about. Over time, my wife and I have either met, or know who owns the other seven. The breakdown is like this:

- 3 Model S & 1 Roadster are car enthusiasts and have the Tesla to replace a luxury or high-end sports car. They Flash or Nod.
- 2 Model S upgraded from Prius. They also Flash or Nod.
- 2 Model S were gifts from a spouse -- and replaced an SUV. They don't acknowledge a flash or nod.

We also have a fair number of Leafs and I find they're enthusiastic wavers to each other and to me.

I have problems identifying Volts, but I sometimes get a flash or wave from them.

So, I'd say that the members of the "awesome car" club and the "environmentalist car" club are still willing to wave. For those whom the Tesla is just next in a series of cars, not so much.
 
The other day, I had a white Roadster follow me on the freeway for about an hour back to my office where he charged for a bit. Well, that drew a lot of attention. I guess seeing a Model S followed by a Roadster was enough of an eye-catcher that I had all kinds of people staring and waving.
 
I flash my lights and wave every time. I would say in the 4 months of ownership I have passed by 10 other Model S'es. Five of them we too far over on the other side and relative speeds so far no time to react. For the rest, three waved back, two didn't - both of those were women who didn't even see my Tesla.

Sometimes I see them when I'm walking in the city - then I also give the thumbs-up and if possible waggle my fob to show I'm an owner.
 
I owned one of the very first Prius's and this waving phenomenon was common in the Bay Area until we discovered it was distracting and unsafe. I have waved at other MS owners when we are both stopped--it's a nice exchange. But when we are going opposite directions on CA-84 around curves, I don't think I want to look for someone to see if they are waving behind the hard-to-see-through windshield and looking for their reaction if they wave at me back. I'd rather not crash my MS into a tree. :)

Yes, the more MS's there are, the less likely you are to wave. I went to a meeting in Palo Alto and from the parking lot to the highway on-ramp (a 5 minute drive), I saw 7 other Model S's. On my regular drive home from San Francisco to San Mateo, I see 4-6 MS's on that commute without looking ... probably missed a few. I still stare at them because they are pretty cars (like any ego-stroking maneuver of looking in a mirror!), but I can't justify taking my hands off the wheel and my eyes off the road on US-101 or I-280 to wave to someone who will never see it, because by the time I do it, the car is 400 yards behind me already.

- K
 
I rarely see a Tesla in E. Texas but when I drive to Dallas...I see at least one and I wave at them but usually get no response.

I still get attention from other ICE car owners...the other day somebody honked at me while we were bumper to bumper traffic in downtown Dallas and asked my wife who was sitting right next to me..if she was willing to trade cars...my wife smiled and said no:biggrin: