Issue with Reverse/autopilot cancel on the stalk

[angelman]

Maybe it's just me but several times now I have found myself throwing the car into reverse in the middle of traffic instead of turning off autopilot. In stop/go freeway traffic autopilot is pretty great. However there are times (like suddenly changing lanes) when I need to turn off autopilot. I have been finding that at very low speeds I am too frantically trying to disengage autopilot and accidentally putting the car into reverse! Of course I should pay more attention or be more careful but sometimes you have to make snap decisions and muscle memory takes over. I wish that going into reverse was a little more secure, at least some kind of detente or perhaps a second button to push. Having autopilot cancel the same as reverse seems a little dangerous to me.
Or maybe I am just a terrible driver

 

[M3LL0]

Just press the brake and it will turn autopilot off!

 

[DopeGhoti]

However there are times (like suddenly changing lanes) when I need to turn off autopilot.

Are you saying that you are suddenly changing lanes, or that Autosteer is? In either case, take your hand (which should already be on the wheel) and:
- in the former case, steer as to make the lane change. Autosteer will self-diable, and TACC will remain active, keeping you at speed notwithstanding cars in your way
- in the latter case, grip the wheel and do not let Autosteer move you over if you don't want to. Autosteer will self-disable, and TACC will remain active, keeping you at speed notwithstanding cars in your way. Later, go into settings, and turn off lane changes without your explicit approval.

at least some kind of detente or perhaps a second button to push

There is a detent. Press to the detent to disable Autosteer and TACC. Hold at the detent to "shift" into Neutral. Press past the detent to "shift" into Reverse.

 

[angelman]

I used to press the brake to disable everything and of course I can just move the wheel. However I got into the habit of just flicking the lever up to quickly (and smoothly without braking or wrestling the steering wheel) stop autopilot. The issue is that in stop and go traffic I have found that TACC can get really jerky (dangerously so) and skittish, trying to keep distance from the car in front (but in LA traffic even at 1 follow distance that's too far for a traffic jam). Several times even at very slow speeds it will jam on the brakes suddenly. Seems worse in latest updates (although many other aspects of autopilot are better and smoother). For this reason I have started to flick the lever up. Just at times I will not realise that I already disengaged autopilot (while I am attending to checking for traffic, motorbikes lane splitting etc. I can't be checking the screen) and one more flick puts it in reverse at low speeds.

 

[jdcollins5]

Please remove the dangerous design flaw from your title. This is operator error.

 

[ultimate_99]

I Agreed. I have done this as well. But I think if you raise the shift lever all the way up once while in auto pilot and under 5 MPH it will cancel the auto pilot and a second raise WILL put it in reverse. I will test this soon.

 

[justsomeguy]

Any more of these guys and Tesla is going to add the Prius's reverse beeping and knowing them it won't be a toggle. I will send all of you people a very angry message the day this happens.

 

[ultimate_99]

Another thing to be aware is when backing up!
Not realizing you went even slightly over 5 MPH then pressing shift down to go forward and pressing your foot down with a car behind you! HELLO!

 

[tameware]

Whether dangerous or not, I agree that this is a design flaw. The designer's goal is to make the vehicle's functions as straightforward to use as possible and to avoid having similar actions produce dissimilar effects.

ICE vehicles have over a century of experience and user expectations built into their user experience. Much, but not all of this, transfers into EVs. There will be some trial and error, and if progress is to be made we must speak up about what we consider errors.

 

[640k]

honestly this is all just because Tesla tried to cram too much multi-functionality into a single stalk. your brain is on autopilot and you're not considering the impact of your actions. i accidentally thought i was in park and pressed down to move to drive, and autopilot engaged and tried to scream me through the parking lot. whoops. my own dumb fault and i've made a mental note for next time.

 

[Glamisduner]

You can't put the car into reverse at over 5mph.

Pressing down once does not turn on autopilot...Nor will AP engage from park, and when engauged it will do the speed limit or a default value over the speed limit. so not sure how it could engage and scream you through the parking lot.

 

[polyphonic54]

honestly this is all just because Tesla tried to cram too much multi-functionality into a single stalk.

Don't Model S and X use a 3 stalk system where AP gets its own dedicated stalk?

 

[ecarfan]

I have been finding that at very low speeds I am too frantically trying to disengage autopilot and accidentally putting the car into reverse! Of course I should pay more attention or be more careful but sometimes you have to make snap decisions and muscle memory takes over.

I am unclear on why you are “frantic” when you wish to disengage AP. Simply push the gear stalk lever up and release and AP will disengage. It works every time. Or tap the brakes or turn the steering wheel about a 1/8th turn. You have many options.

The issue is that in stop and go traffic I have found that TACC can get really jerky (dangerously so) and skittish,

I’ve been using TACC in heavy traffic for years. That has not been my experience. To call TACC “dangerous” in stop and go traffic is I think an exaggeration unless the TACC in your car is defective. In which case, if you think that feature on your car is “dangerous” you need to go to your local Service Center and have them test drive your car.

Having autopilot cancel the same as reverse seems a little dangerous to me.

I don’t understand why that is your perception. If you are in D and the car is moving forward, pushing the stalk up to engage R will not cause the car to lurch backwards. If you are going more than a few miles per hour nothing will happen, the car will continue going forward. The car’s software is smart enough to manage that situation.

 

[ecarfan]

Don't Model S and X use a 3 stalk system where AP gets its own dedicated stalk?

Yes on the S and X there is a dedicated AP stalk.. As as someone who has put over 38K miles on an X, while I think that the dedicated AP stalk works just fine, I have found that after 16K miles on my Model 3 the integrated stalk (PRND and AP) is my preference. It’s simpler, more efficient, and that stalk is slightly closer to my hand than the S/X AP stalk.

 

[jdcollins5]

I Agreed. I have done this as well. But I think if you raise the shift lever all the way up once while in auto pilot and under 5 MPH it will cancel the auto pilot and a second raise WILL put it in reverse. I will test this soon.

Thank you.

You do not have to lift the stalk all of the way up to cancel AP. If you just barely bump it up it will cancel, Try it.

 

[Puddles]

...at least some kind of detente or perhaps a second button to push.

Easy guys, no need to get strident. It is true there are two stops up, and down, on the right stalk, but you have to admit they are not obvious.

I think it might be helpful to a) name the positions and b) practice while parked with the foot on the brake.

I call the first stop a "soft click" or "half click" when describing it to test drivers, and the second stop a "full click". I'm sure any of you can come up with more descriptive names, but that's what I use.

If you think of the Tesla as being a product of the gamer generation, maybe it's a good idea to have a tutorial mode where there is a little on-screen game you can play which rewards you for accurately selecting various control positions. Those tutorial videos... they're so 2000's.

 

[DopeGhoti]

they're so 2000's

To think I, having had lived through times when "the year 2000" was considered far-future territory (hello, "Century 21" real estate, and Beyond 2000 on the Discovery channel!), am now living in times when "the year 2000" (or indeed the entire first decade of the oughties) is considered archaic. It kind of baffles me to contemplate that very soon there will be full-grown adults who have never lived in a time without smartphones and ubiquitous high(er)-speed internet services.

 

[angelman]

Look I know it's kind of ridiculous and of course I need to be more careful. That said I am only talking about speeds below 5mph. I am talking about bumper to bumper traffic. TACC isn't keen on this kind of traffic because it likes a little more space in front than is usual (at least for the 405 freeway in the morning). Like I said, I have found TACC to recently get quite skittish at times at low speed. Often I try to creep forward a little to close the gap and it really tries hard to stop me. It can be dangerous having TACC active when suddenly doing things like changing lanes to try and grab a space in the next lane before it closes up. Of course I know that one tap up will turn off autopilot but it can be quite easy to lose track of if you have already done this and mistakenly tap it again. I certainly don't want more nannying on my car but I was trying to think of a way to make reverse just a little harder to accidentally activate. In an ICE car (old one) with 3 on the tree (my previous car was a 1967 Buick so I am well used to this), it would be very hard to accentally hit reverse since you are never shifting the lever up during normal driving. Having reverse and autopilot as a double duty on the same stalk is convenient but maybe a little too convenient at times. That's all

 

[Glamisduner]

Look I know it's kind of ridiculous and of course I need to be more careful. That said I am only talking about speeds below 5mph. I am talking about bumper to bumper traffic. TACC isn't keen on this kind of traffic because it likes a little more space in front than is usual (at least for the 405 freeway in the morning). Like I said, I have found TACC to recently get quite skittish at times at low speed. Often I try to creep forward a little to close the gap and it really tries hard to stop me. It can be dangerous having TACC active when suddenly doing things like changing lanes to try and grab a space in the next lane before it closes up. Of course I know that one tap up will turn off autopilot but it can be quite easy to lose track of if you have already done this and mistakenly tap it again. I certainly don't want more nannying on my car but I was trying to think of a way to make reverse just a little harder to accidentally activate. In an ICE car (old one) with 3 on the tree (my previous car was a 1967 Buick so I am well used to this), it would be very hard to accentally hit reverse since you are never shifting the lever up during normal driving. Having reverse and autopilot as a double duty on the same stalk is convenient but maybe a little too convenient at times. That's all

why not just leave a safe amount of space in front of you? Sure people might cut in, but who cares?

 

[Puddles]

why not just leave a safe amount of space in front of you? Sure people might cut in, but who cares?

I've made this suggestion to Los Angelinos and they generally look at me like I'm speaking Greek.

Wait, you're a So Cal person too. You must be a transplant.