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From everything I have heard and read, tesla is all done making any new batteries, and haven’t made any new ones for years. At this point there may be some used ones coming in from the trade in program that they have for the roadster, but that’s about it. I hope I’m wrong, but I wouldn’t bet on it. They will avoid any replacements and keep pushing it out and out until people either give up, sue, or forget about it. Just like the 3.0 program that’s been right around the corner for about 7 months now. Even suing them probably won’t get far, they will just settle it for some small amount of money that’s less than making a new battery. Someone will eventually start rebuilding the current sheets if tesla doesn’t get it together on the batteries; with a lot of aging and dead batteries out there demand should be high enough to do it soon.
IslandRoadster
Former Owner of #609
There is no requirement to provide parts for 10 years. The Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act requires that manufacturers who provide a warranty for their vehicles to stand behind their warranties. Once the warranties expire, you're on your own. Now, if you had an ICE vehicle, then federal law would require that the emissions controls system be warranted for 2 years and 24,000 miles or up to 8 years/80,000 miles for certain components. That is federal law that requires a certain duration. There is no other requirement as far as I know. Anyone telling you otherwise needs to provide a citation, which no one in these forums has done.
The battery replacement contract does not require Tesla to provide a "new" battery. It does require Tesla to provide a replacement pack, which may or may not be a reman pack (Tesla's choice). You are required to give them your old pack in exchange. It requires the replacement pack have a usable capacity of at least 53 kWh which is the same as the OEM pack when new. It does not stipulate what kind of cells they have to use. They could easily meet the contract requirements by using the same LG cells that were used in the 3.0 packs. They could do that and reduce the number of cells in each brick to bring it down to 53 kWh. That would be the worst outcome because then you'd have the OEM pack capacity but 3x the degradation rate. I'm hoping for a better solution.
IslandRoadster
Former Owner of #609
Once they start getting the new 3.x packs in for people, will be interesting to learn what cells they are using and whether they changed the pack design. Hope they do something innovative rather than giving us old crap that's hobbled like you've thought they might, Henry. But who knows, it is Tesla!
Appreciated it @ViperDoc! If you could pls post the photos and update the original Mud on the Door Sills thread so we don't hijack this JdeMO one, that would be super.
IslandRoadster
Former Owner of #609
I’ve started a new thread to gauge interest in a JdeMo bulk buy. Find the thread here. Head on over and take the poll. I’ll be setting up a spreadsheet to add contact info to when we hit about 10 folks interested.
IslandRoadster
Former Owner of #609
We’re getting closer!
Tony from QC charge got back to me and asked me an additional question. He said:
I’ve started a spreadsheet to gather contact information and pricing interest. If you were a YES or POSSIBLY, please fill in the form here. No obligation at this point, but need to get an idea of who is serious by collecting contact info.
Roadster JDEMO Adapter Contact & Interest List
Thanks, everyone!
Joe
Tony from QC charge got back to me and asked me an additional question. He said:
Ok, one more question for your group... how much more would they pay to add CCS in addition to CHAdeMO?
The list price of the units when they were originally made was $3k. QC raised the price to $4k toward the end of the run. Given that, I would be willing to pay $5k to have both CHAdeMO & CCS capabilities. Would still need to fit behind the license plate though. - North America - SAE-J1772-DC-CCS-Combo1
- Europe, Australia, New Zealand - CCS-Combo2
I’ve started a spreadsheet to gather contact information and pricing interest. If you were a YES or POSSIBLY, please fill in the form here. No obligation at this point, but need to get an idea of who is serious by collecting contact info.
Roadster JDEMO Adapter Contact & Interest List
Thanks, everyone!
Joe
n2mb_racing
Active Member
I wonder if it should be CCS only? It seems like anywhere that has CHAdeMO also has CCS, but everything that is new that is going in is CCS, right?
IslandRoadster
Former Owner of #609
mom bot sure that’s necessarily correct. Here’s what Tony from QC Charge notes when I asked him that question a while back:
I don’t foresee us making an SAE-J1772-DC-CCS-Combo1 only unit, since that would only be viable in North America, where we sold about a dozen kits. The same would be true of GB/T for China, since I’m not even aware of a single Roadster there. CHAdeMO is worldwide, with over 28,000 units on 5 continents and over 100 countries.
Your fears about CHAdeMO might be just that. But, it looks like CHAdeMO v3.0 is already released, with 500kW capability, AND with reverse compatibility with tje previous CHAdeMO (with an physical adaptor), as well as China’s GBT. It might also be compatible with CCS. We would be interested in that.
it sounds like CHAdeMO should be around for a a while.Your fears about CHAdeMO might be just that. But, it looks like CHAdeMO v3.0 is already released, with 500kW capability, AND with reverse compatibility with tje previous CHAdeMO (with an physical adaptor), as well as China’s GBT. It might also be compatible with CCS. We would be interested in that.
I'm pretty sure it will be around, but just not in Europe where IONITY is rolling out CCS2-only stations, and other networks at best add one CHAdeMO station for every location to cater the odd Nissan Leaf. All the other available car models are CCS2.
I mean, nothing bad in offering CCS2+CHAdeMO but that's a lot of space for a plug you'd never use in Europe once you have CCS2.
But alas, if that's the only option available in the market you'd get it, no?
IslandRoadster
Former Owner of #609
I'm pretty sure it will be around, but just not in Europe where IONITY is rolling out CCS2-only stations, and other networks at best add one CHAdeMO station for every location to cater the odd Nissan Leaf. All the other available car models are CCS2.
I mean, nothing bad in offering CCS2+CHAdeMO but that's a lot of space for a plug you'd never use in Europe once you have CCS2.
But alas, if that's the only option available in the market you'd get it, no?
It would. For me it’s about having the ability to road trip in some form. A dual solution future proofs things and ensures reverse compatibility for years to come. And for the manufacturer, he’s trying to figure out what will generate the most demand. A dual solution might be that. But for me it’s gotta fit behind that rear license plate. I don’t want some unsightly connector sticking out under my number.
IslandRoadster
Former Owner of #609
There was a problem with the form for non-US residents, and particularly those with non-numerical characters in the postal codes. I think I’ve fixed that. If you’re still having troubles, please let me know.
i don't know if both would fit behind the license plate. if he did the combo, i'd probably only install the CCS port
I'm thinking what Drewski said... Certainly no need for both connectors, especially given the very limited space for connectors (not to mention the heavy wiring behind them), and given a choice between the two, I'd opt for CCS over CHAdeMO. The argument where one counts the number of stations of various kinds reminds me of the discussion I had with a video store back in the VHS vs Beta days, looking at the store where both sides were equally populated (at the time). That one didn't end well.
Separately, though related, I think the question perhaps isn't so much whether CHAdeMO will be going away, it's whether the various J1772 stations will remain viable. I can imagine that charging stations not directly associated with an establishment of some sort (restaurant, especially) will either stop maintaining the lower power ports, or opt to convert them to higher power DC in order to make best use of the limited parking space that they occupy. The "fad" of putting up a bunch of J1772 ports to attract customers will quickly disappear when faster charging is available, and when faced with the real cost of maintaining the older ports.
It's a matter of matching the charging with the use situation. One simply can't add enough mileage from a J1772 port during a fast-food stop. The one place where I have used en-route charging is at a park-n-ride. That station I'm not worried about, since the intended use is a day's charging. In fact, the DC charging station there is down, and has been for years, likely because it doesn't make sense to park there for an entire day while charging. Hotels are probably also ok. The point is that in the reverse situation, where you're looking for freeway-access en-route charging, the J1772 stations will more likely disappear or be replaced by DC charging. Secondary is what sort of DC charging it will be.
So the real reason for this rambling is this... Is it worth it to me to add DC charging to my car in support of moderate-distance (more than a single charge, less than two) travel? Lacking a 3.x battery upgrade, and with a slow-but-relentless decline in CAC, it would seem that I should. On the other hand, even pre-pandemic, I haven't done much long distance travel in the Roadster, and am less likely to do so in the future. I am thinking that perhaps my funds might be better spent on other things, or saved for the inevitable expensive-parts replacement. Still on the fence, however.
If I were to do it, I’d do a chademo in the bay and a CCS behind the plate.
That being said, I’m still not completely sold on lvl3 charging and the sheets in our pack.
chademo will (in theory) be around a loooonnnnggg time due to V2H/V2G.
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