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Join us if you are upset with the introduction of the D (RHD)

Discussion in 'Hong Kong' started by Alipapa, Oct 11, 2014.

  1. Alipapa

    Alipapa Member

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    There is a group of owners in Hong Kong joining together to write a letter to Jerome Guillen expressing our disappointment about the sudden introduction of the D.

    The letter will be "result oriented" instead of "pure complaining", we are just trying to seek for a solution.

    If you want to be a part of the letter, please send me your phone number and i will add you to the Whatsapp chat group.

    There are 17 of us right now.

    Thank you very much!
     
  2. sonywong

    sonywong Member

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  3. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    How else can one announce a new option on a vehicle. It sort of has to be 'sudden'. It's not like Tesla developing an AWD system was unknown. And they were developing the AWD for the Model S/X platform. It seemed pretty logical that they would offer an AWD system for the Model S slightly before or directly after introducing the Model X.

    When BMW announces an X-Drive variant they do it at a press conference. No difference than what Tesla did.
     
  4. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    Anyone who has read this forum at all, knew the Model S AWD was coming soon. I posted months ago predicting it would be introduced late Q3 of this year. (Okay, I missed it by a week and a half.) The info has been out there for a long time. The only thing *sudden* is that Tesla officially announced what has been obvious to anyone that follows Tesla.
     
  5. Alipapa

    Alipapa Member

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    Sorry, you may have gotten your car for a long time, but here is hk they just started to deliver ( many of us paid deposit 3 years ago) I dont plan to discuss this matter with people who has different ideas, and thank you for respecting that
     
  6. theBaumisch

    theBaumisch New Member

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    What does "result oriented" even mean? Do you want upgrades (not possible) or a buy back renew offer (unlikely)?
     
  7. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    They offered heated Cloth seats the same way they announced the Model D. I ended up with non-heated cloth seats. I also waited over a year for my car. It isn't unfair. It just is unfortunate.
     
  8. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    You are on a public forum. You can choose to respond to others or not respond to others. But we're not eavesdropping nor are we prohibited from responding.

    Again, the information regarding AWD has been public for a very long time. Blaming Tesla because you did not know that a Model S AWD was coming would be like blaming them for not telling you that there will be a pickup truck someday, because you want a pickup truck and you would have waited if you'd known. They will always be innovating and releasing new features and new models. You got exactly what you paid for.

    I am getting a Signature Model X. Here is what that means for me: Within months of receiving it, there will be new features and whatnot that means people getting their X after me will get MORE. Yep. That's how it goes. And no matter how it goes, there will be something better, if I'd just known, if they'd just told me. So I can wait around all my life for the next best thing and never have any enjoyment, or I can enjoy getting exactly what I paid for.

    I plan to enjoy every moment of driving it. Just like I enjoy every moment of driving my very crude Roadster with old-school technology (it uses a KEY!!) and lower range and slow charging and uncomfortable seats and didImentionitisslowerthantheAWDmodelS? And I got exactly what I paid for and I have loved that car every mile since February 2011.
     
  9. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    Good. And good luck.
    Bad, and counterproductive.

    Unsolicited advice: Stick with the path of your first post, IMO.

    - - - Updated - - -

    My interpretation is that they are looking for options from Tesla to remedy what they feel is an unpleasant situation. That could be any number of things. In their shoes, I would start with the broad concern and listen carefully to Jerome's response. When (debatably) an entire market is "unhappy" due to the timing of the delivery of the first cars to that market vs. introduction of new features, it might be a case that Tesla takes note and tries to do something to make owners happy. It's totally reasonable IMO for these folks to share their feelings with Tesla and see if a happy result can be found. To not do so, just means unhappy owners before they even get their vehicles which is, frankly, bad for everyone.
     
  10. deonb

    deonb Active Member

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    The sales staff in the U.S. pointed me LONG ago (2012), to the space in the frunk, and said: "This is where the AWD motor will go, and we will offer this as a feature later on".

    How was anybody blind-sided by this? AND, it's still not available, it will only be available 3 months from now.

    I don't know how this announcement could have been done any less "sudden". What, should Tesla be announcing the new motor 1 coil at a time?
     
  11. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    Based on the number of 1) new orders taken in the last day by Tesla, 2) updated current orders, and 3) extremely few canceled orders ... I don't think there is a debate within Tesla re if the market is happy or unhappy with this. A forum tends to attract those who want to have their voice heard, so opinions are almost always skewed. Just the nature of things.

    (general comment, not in response to specific post) That said, a reasonable discussion with Tesla can always be had. But it needs to be two-way, with a willingness to consider that perhaps you are the one in error. Approaching them with demands and not being willing to consider their position will get the discussion nowhere.
     
  12. DITB

    DITB Charged.hk co-founder

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    The main issue is not just "lack of newest features". We all know - and appreciate - that new features are introduces all the time (some software update, some hardware updates, while others are only available on new cars).

    The RHD model was delayed for so much longer than the LHD. Not only that, the delays kept being replaced by more delays, with a lot of misinformation and outright lies from TM.

    Some people here have let Tesla Motors borrow 25,000 USD for years, up to 5 years, while the last two years, we have watched scores of 10,000 cars delivered in other markets. With no guarantees against TM crashing, we let them borrow our money with no interest paid, and no other guarantees.

    Now that the cars finally arrived, the first 8 delivered on July 23rd this year, the long wait was over.

    Barely finished with the "honeymoon", the "bride" has suddenly lost 30K in value overnight, despite being a new car, the first to hit the market.

    The timing is very unfortunate, as these many delays, the relentless support of Tesla Motors (despite delays and lies), we kept in there. Surely, other markets also had to wait, and there were cloth heating, auto fold mirrors and much more. But this is like - a Model S60D will be much cheaper but in some ways better, than a fully loaded P85+ delivered just months before that.

    Trusting Tesla Motors, lending them the money and doing all we can to support "the cause", many now feel stabbed in the back, that their car has lost a lot of its value, before they even take delivery of it.

    My guess is that there WILL be some kind of compensation of sorts, given the magnitude of the impact here. I am not selling my straight 85 - unless I really had to for a reason. I love the car to bits, just a bit disappointed that it lost 30K value just like that!

    I am not the most upset one, I wasn't Signature, and "only" lend Tesla Motors my 5,000 USD (39,000 HKD) for 21 months.

    As for you who have had your cars for two years already, those cars will be - two years old - while ours in the Hong Kong market are close to brand new (mine not even three weeks old).

    Surely there will be updates, new models and so on. It will be interesting what the second hand price of non-D model S cars will be, as I know several people have now put their car up for sale. And some customers who paid deposit are considering not taking delivery, despite losing their deposit.
     
  13. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    I get that, DITB - but surely you and others saw the forum chatter over the last several months that we expected AWD to be introduced right about now. Why did no one speak up BEFORE you took delivery? "If AWD is coming, please hold my delivery until that is available." Such a simple request to be made in advance.

    - - - Updated - - -

    And, for the record, there are many many others who have had deposits for far larger amounts down, for longer periods of time, without even seeing what they were buying. Using that as a reason probably won't gain much traction here.
     
  14. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    I waited 3.5 years for my car. 6 months later they announce the P85+ which handles much better and want $13,500 more if I wanted to retrofit that. Innovation sucks if you miss it but is good for everyone. Your next car will be that much better you can always sell your new car and get the D.
     
  15. ChriZ

    ChriZ Member

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    #15 ChriZ, Oct 11, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2014
    I think all owners feel the same way especially if we can't retrofit these upgrades. I hope you do get something but that's being greedy and will probably hurt tesla. Now I don't see any evidence of a 30k loss in value. I don't see any 60kwh on sale for 40k, 85kwh for 50k or P85s sold for 70k. I'd buy one at that price right away. In fact I see the market for a used tesla will be hot since more folks are willing to sell their tesla at a used price. Before it was hard to get one at a decent price but now owners are willing to let go. I recently posted my 60kwh for sale and got multiple offers within a day for 65k. I ultimately decided to keep my 60kwh as I don't need the new features. Besides Hong Kong doesn't have snow and barely any highways so you won't need AWD and auto pilot unless you drive to China a lot. Ultimately, you don't expect apple to compensate you if you bought an iPhone 5s one month before the iPhone 6 release right?
     
  16. Lerxt

    Lerxt Member

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    Im not sure I buy the argument with vehicles that have been delivered, however any cars delivered from now, without the new features would Tesla delivering a new vehicle to a lower spec than is currently advertised.
     
  17. cpa

    cpa Member

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    Some have posted that we consumers "knew" about the AWD feature that was imminent. Well, this came as news to me! (In fact, I had never heard of such a thing.) I spent an hour on the telephone with a Tesla representative back in March asking all sorts of questions about the car. The call was a very pleasant experience. She gave us an appointment for a test drive in San Jose for a week later. We drove the car, and placed an order on the spot. Not once did the sales associate inform us that there was AWD in the works in the coming months; did we wish to wait? As a consumer, we can't possibly ask all the right questions, especially about items that we have no knowledge of. Reading forums such as this have no real credibility beyond speculation or rumor. And, we all know that Tesla's definition of "soon" does not necessarily correspond with our definition of "soon."

    If I had known about this AWD feature, would I have waited? I don't really know. Maybe because of the additional "range" that the dual drive motors provides. Maybe not.

    I think the bigger lesson here is that if Tesla is planning a revolutionary new concept like AWD that cannot be retrofitted for a modest price, then there should be some form of communication to prospective buyers when that feature is going to be implemented so they can choose whether to wait or not. I realize that this might cut into immediate sales, but it may pay dividends in the long run with customer satisfaction. Tesla in general takes very good care of its customers, but sometimes is woefully deficient in timely communication.

    I can see history repeating itself when a much larger battery comes down the pike, particularly if the pricing point is equal to or just slightly more than the 85kWh battery now offered.
     
  18. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    World's worst kept secret. Just a sampling of threads on this forum, discussing Model S AWD (months and years before now). Same thing over on Tesla Motors forum.


    Some media articles about it,


    And many many more.
     
  19. TES-E

    TES-E Member

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    +1 Bonnie. I got the car I ordered. I expect nothing more in non-software upgrades.
     
  20. markwj

    markwj Moderator, Asia Pacific

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    A few facts:

    1) From earliest reservations to earliest deliveries in Hong Kong was just over 3 years. First deliveries (8 signatures) here were late July.

    2) The time from factory production to customer delivery here is around 2 months (shipping by sea). For the next 1 1/2 months, customers taking delivery here are going to be receiving old spec cars.

    3) To avoid issue (2) in Australia, Tesla are re-manufacturing the Australian cars (signatures). Their cars are being further delayed, but they'll get latest spec. They won't get D at launch.

    4) The P85+ are the hardest hit, as the P85D kills that. For those customers, it is not a matter of snow and ice.

    5) It will probably be summer 2015 before HK sees its first D cars.

    6) All that said, the cars we are receiving are what we signed up for, when we signed our order confirmations earlier this year. For me, I also got a free parcel shelf, a free mobile charging cord, and a free better charging solution (40A wall connector vs 13A mobile charger).

    I am not affected by this. Even if it was available, I would not have chosen the D option, and certainly would not have waited another year for the car. That said, I feel for the guy that gave Tesla HK$250k three years ago, took delivery of a P85+ a couple of months ago, and learns of the P85D today.
     

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