Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Join us if you are upset with the introduction of the D (RHD)

This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
It's a very unlucky combination of events.

For me, as I have the S85, it's fine. And personally, I don't care too much about the gadgetry, I really love the car as it is already now - not going to sell.

The HK RHD market being about 2 years behind the US market, combined with an upgraded model introduced just as the Signature Model S cars have finished delivering less than three months ago - and the non-Signature models about a month ago. All these early supporters were shorted.

Because the price is almost the same for the new model.

IF only the P85+ had been more expensive
IF only the RHD had been delivered at the same time as the LHD

Some people put their 25K USD down about 5 years ago, only got it recently. With all the almost endless delays - the cars are finally reaching the Hong Kong market, only to be outdated and undercut, almost immediately.

But let's see what happens.
 
Hi Bonnie, is it called "sudden"? For my case YES, I don't have the TMC account until I get the car(I read the news from Tesla's blog and e-mail) and 1 month 20 days later Tesla announced "D", I don't have choice and have to face the depreciation of my car.

But you did have internet access and, if you are like the rest of us, you read a lot of stuff about the car you were buying. (Having a TMC account, by the way, is not a requirement for reading the forum posts.) I posted news articles above, not just links to forum threads, that talked about Model S drive months and years ago.

Look, no one is saying this is YOUR fault (though you seem determined to believe it has to be someone's fault). Sometimes timing works out and everything aligns perfectly, sometimes you get exactly what you bought. The Model S, with no AWD, will likely be a rare sight in China and Hong Kong for the next year and years beyond that. Would you have waited another year longer for a Model S with AWD? Because that would be the reality.

Your car is only depreciated if you are trying to sell it. Otherwise nothing has changed. It's like my stock account. I see the value go up, I see the value go down. But it means nothing unless I'm actually considering selling/buying stock. Merely conversation, nothing to do with reality.

But of course ALL cars depreciate as soon as you take delivery. And of course you (and all of us) know that Tesla will continue to innovate and bring new technology to their offerings. And that's great when you wake up in the morning and find that it has magically appeared on your car. :) The innovation isn't so great, it appears, when it doesn't magically appear. But they will continue to innovate and today's buyers of the Model S AWD will soon be left behind also.

I bought a Roadster. I've held off on the Model S (all variants) & just enjoyed watching it evolve. I'll buy one of the very first Model X (Signature #2) and I understand that I will quickly be left behind again, just like with the Roadster. And I'm going to continue having fun driving a Tesla. Every mile.

And someday, when fully automated driving is a reality, my last car will be a Tesla. My son won't have to take the keys away from me, he'll be giving me the keys to that car and continued independence. And it will take me wherever I need to go. That, of course, is only possible IF we don't demand Tesla stop innovating.
 
You spent a long time missing the point Bonnie. The problem is that people are receiving cars, and will continue to do so for months, that are out of date and not what they expected when ordering i.e. a current, new car. Cars without the AP equipment are an old, out of date model. Tesla can't afford to piss off HK customers as they will get a reputation that will very quickly spread on the mainland that they are worth avoiding. HK sets the pace for China.
 
You spent a long time missing the point Bonnie. The problem is that people are receiving cars, and will continue to do so for months, that are out of date and not what they expected when ordering i.e. a current, new car. Cars without the AP equipment are an old, out of date model. Tesla can't afford to piss off HK customers as they will get a reputation that will very quickly spread on the mainland that they are worth avoiding. HK sets the pace for China.

Or perhaps you missed mine.

You might want to reread the post I was replying to ... it was about his personal satisfaction and how he didn't know and didn't have a TMC membership.

Surely you're not saying that HK customers are entitled to special treatment because China will look to them? How about asking HK customers to set an example of correct behavior? The way you state it almost makes it sound like companies have to do whatever HK customers want, or lose business all over China. That seems almost like blackmail, but I know you could not have meant it like that.

I have no doubt that Tesla is aware of the importance of different geographic locations and will run their business accordingly. That doesn't mean that as a group, customers should feel more entitled. I'd be embarrassed if I let 'what I can get away with' influence my behavior.

How Tesla behaves is up to them. How I behave is up to me. Fair?
 
Last edited:
There are valid points in most of these posts.

However, problem is Hong Kong customers are getting cars that will apparently depreciate faster than what we initially have expected, due to the fact that much better models are coming out at marginally higher prices (we're talking about 5% or so here).

Since a car is not a smart phone, should/could Tesla have informed or warned customers of the imminent depreciation *before it's too late*? Or is it the case that customers are upset simply because they collectively made a bad judgement on depreciation when they bought the car? Or should customers come to realize the fact now, that Tesla cars may simply depreciate much faster than other cars?

If it's the latter, we should take the responsibility and inform future Tesla buyers, here in Hong Kong, about the risk of high depreciation rate.

Again, an official trade up program would be one of the best solutions. Regardless of what products Tesla chooses to release and when they do it, customers are "always" guaranteed a residual value in their Tesla cars. Better yet, prospective customers can make a better informed decision, and set a more realistic expectation, before they commit to a Tesla product.
 
Last edited:
I think the problem is mainly on the waiting time. I am pretty sure people who are buying iPhone 6 now do expect Apple will probably launch iP6s or even iP7 in the future but not at the point when they are about to get their iP6.

What would be the average waiting time in US to get a MS? Let's say if I placed a buy order in mid 2012, when would I be able to get the car?
 
To those in HK, AU, etc. I really don't see the issue here. You're not going to see a D in those markets before August 2015 according to Design Center (plus Tesla time) so as odd as it sounds - there's your reconciliation. You're current vehicles will remain state-of-art for a good year in those markets. The latency of receiving vehicles into these markets looks like it will remain (and looks like 8-12 months for the D - a factor of 4 on the US).

And those in the US trying to defend Tesla in a HK thread, you'll be getting your D builds in as little as 8 weeks. I don't think you appreciate the frustration the satellite markets have and the importance that Tesla listens and responds to these issues if they're serious about business outside of the US.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to my non-D when it eventually arrives. Whenever that will be.
 
"Join us if you are upset with the introduction of the D (RHD)"

The topic of this thread is to gather those that feel the coincidence of timing for a RHD market that is lagging 2 years behind the LHD market, has been quite harsh towards those that have supported the company for so long, accepting delay after delay plastered with "white lies" for the reasoning. Combined with a near-similar price for the new model (mainly P85+ vs P85D), with the old model still on it's way for months to come, it's undermining early movers commitment and loyalty.

I wish all the success for TM, both domestic USA and world wide and believe me, I put a lot of effort into this. People who know me would think I am almost religious about it, well, kind of. I have "sold" at least 5 Model S that I know of, maybe more that I don't know of.

It's not over yet, and there will probably be some outcome which is suitable for all parties.

We all know that products do update, and they should, but that is not the point here.

Tesla was vulnerable, fighting for success, and with the help of early movers world wide, who believed in Tesla, a huge amount of free cash was raised for Tesla Motors. Not only to augment the loans Tesla Motors got, but also to indicate the market was there. Now Tesla Motors is strong, almost unstoppable, and things are going really well. Early adapters are feeling forgotten for what they did. A simple trade-up option, or buy back programme which would include Hong Kong as well, is all it would take. It's not like we are asking for a back dated discount for the P85+ customers.

For the USA, you had your cars for years, we only got them recently (sorry for repeating myself, but I am not sure it was read or not)

"Join us if you are upset with the introduction of the D (RHD)"

We are discussing the options here in this thread. It's fine if you like to chip in from outside of the HK market. If you like to tell us what is reasonable to expect, please try to understand what we have been going through, reading posts, watching videos and seeing pictures of the Model S for year, drooling over "when can we get it". Finally it's here, and soon after, it's value is hammered by the -D (especially the P85+)

It is not anything bad about the -D, it's about remembering who were there when all others didn't know or ignored Tesla Motors in Hong Kong.
 
Is it possible to post the letter here? So that everyone can give opinions or his own judgement if this letter reasonable or too "longlai"?

BTW, "long lai" is Cantonese, I don't know which word in English express this meaning right. anybody knows?
 
It's a lot like Apple selling you an iPhone 5, delaying delivery, releasing the iPhone 6 and then delivering your iPhone 5 3 months later. I ordered in Feb this year and still haven't had delivery. No one this year in the US waited more than a 4-8 weeks.
 
Do realise we got the Model S about two years later than in the USA?

That's because:

a) Tesla builds the car in the USA, so it only makes sense to sell the car there first. You do realize that customers in the USA were vehicle testers for you guys, right?
b) Demand for the car far exceeded even Tesla's optimistic estimates. This lead to supply issues all the way down the line, not just at Tesla. Some of those supply issues, like the batteries, took a very long time to get sorted out.
c) Many parts of the car had to be redone for RHD, that takes time. Takes even more time when you consider b).
d) Each new market has a different set of rules and some of the governments in those markets are difficult to deal with and slow.
e) It takes several weeks to ship cars to your market and have them clear customs.
f) Tesla specifically said they were going to slow delivery to your market as to make sure there were enough service centers and charging stations to make your life with the car more pleasant. Doing so also takes time as permits and such are obtained and service centers and charging stations are built. Again, some governments are more difficult to deal with and are slow. (This is where you take a look at your own.)

And so on down the list.

Here's a few other things to consider:

There are large markets (like Australia) that still don't have their cars.
Tesla did something incredibly wonderful and HONEST for your market that other manufacturers have never done for you...they priced the car fairly versus intentionally ripping you off by inflated pricing. Oh, how quickly we forget when something is to our benefit. And now there's people complaining that they aren't charging enough for their product? What?
Tesla was never under any obligation to bring the car to your market.

Yes, there were delays getting the car to your market. Welcome to the rest of the world, where there were also delays getting the car to those markets.
 
Do realise we got the Model S about two years later than in the USA?

It seems both sides of this argument totally miss each other.

Post #72 sums it up quite well.

Imagine if you ordered the iPhone 5 when it was announced, but because you live in a remote area, you would have to wait 2 years to get it. By the time it's finally delivered, the iPhone 6 is out, and although you waited 2 years for the phone, the guy who ordered it just last week, get the iPhone 6 instead, while you are forced to take the iPhone 5 (because it has already been produced).

I don't know how it can be so hard to understand.

That would be perfect example if in your analogy the iPhone 6 was released in your market a week later. From what I understand there is still a delay for the P85D to your market.
 
As I wrote in another thread.


"Once again, this has been done very poorly by Tesla. Every car delivered after the announcement should have the AP equipment. If you had ordered the car a year ago had to wait while some customers who ordered only had to wait for 2 months and Tesla skipped 8000 vins to boost quarterly results, you'd likely be upset if they improved equipment and you missed out. There are many people in this situation. How long should someone have to wait while others take delivery ahead of you?

Tesla could easily have said that on Jan 1 all new cars have the upgraded equipment, all customers have the option to convert their orders to the new specs. That simple act would have not upset anyone, would have been fair and would have been easily doable. It's time for the surly agressiveness to stop and some sensible understanding of another's position to take place."

Do we see another example of this behaviour above?
 
I haven't seen it mentioned in any of these threads - but as far as I understand, even though you had to wait an awfully long time to get your cars it isn't like Tesla delivered you a vehicle with the spec as of the day you ordered, rather it is the spec of the day it was built, just like everyone else.

I could understand the feelings if all the subsequent improvements had 'passed you by' during your wait, but I don't think that happened, you got all the improvements that occurred during your wait, you just didn't get those after your car was built.