Just sold my Model Y - Parting thoughts

I just sold my Model Y to Driveo. Great price BTW - 62,500 for a May Build 2021 Model Y with 20" wheels. It was a quick and smooth experience.

Since this was my first Tesla, I thought I'd share some thoughts on the car having owned it for almost 7 months.

Highs:
1) Powertrain. Power deliver was very impressive - especially given this was the LR and not the Performance model.
2) Phone Key. I love the phone key. It is so simple and I don't know why every OEM doesn't implement it in the same way. This is one of those things other companies over complicate.
3) Some other cool nuggets in software - I like the built-in streaming services, the ability to open and close garage door based on proximity, the simple and intuitive user profiles and the way you set them up.
4) Space. The Model Y is extremely well packaged with lots of interior space and lots of storage. It's really amazing.
5) Value. At the $52k price this car sold for new, it was untouchable in terms of value.
6) 5 standard heated seats and heated steering wheel. This was very impressive to me and is one of the things that makes Tesla appealing on the used market. You don't need to worry if it has this or doesn't have it depending on how it was specced.
7) Impressive resale value.

Lows:
1) Rigidity. The car did not feel very rigid. You could sense a the chassis flex every time you drive. It felt cheaply built compared with a German car. They went with style over engineering. I would prefer a more rigid car than an uninterrupted glass roof.
2) Rough suspension. The suspension on the Model Y is pretty poor. You feel everything. I know some will say it is because I got the 20" wheels. However a lot of cars have 20" wheels with low profile tires and don't have this issue. This is one area they should have done a better job.
3) Autopilot. I like the Autopilot, but I also hate it. I regularly found myself in situations where it would tell me auto steering is disabled for the rest of the drive. I've never experienced that with any other brand.
4) Extreme minimalism. No roof blind or blackout function. No instrument cluster. Cheap doorhandles. No ambient lighting. Lack of physical buttons and switches to an extreme.
5) Range falls short of EPA estimates.

Overall I would say I leave Tesla with a positive impression of the brand, but I also feel there are a few areas they badly need to address if they want to stay leaders in this segment. The lows I described above will be important to address as the competition catches up in other aspects.

 

[TigerNinety]

Now Tesla hasn't committed "fraud" in the same sense (lying to regulators) with its EPA range, but it DOES calculate gas savings in its pricing based upon the EPA range.

Do people really consider that Tesla-provided number when deciding whether to buy a Tesla or not? I mean, you have to be able to lay out the cash or set up the financing for the purchase price and that savings-based number in reality is completely variable by location and the fuel price across ownership days.

 

[friscomelt314]

I believe the minimalist point is too subjective...think about when the iPhone launched in 2007. The 'horror' for not having buttons!

At 21K miles and ownership since June 2020, my wife and I are so used to the minimalist approach, that driving our other cars has become annoying. But again, to each their own.

I agree the suspension is rough, but having well more than a decade of BMWs, I can say that any sport BMW suspension can be as rough or rougher, however, BMWs still 'feels' more sophisticated to me, and of course many of their models offer air/adjustable suspension, which I've owned.

My range has always been pretty close to EPA, including the fact that close to 40% of all my driving has been highway. But I don't live in an area where above 75 MPH is available, and I pretty much stay at 72 or so, and that is only a portion of the highway where most of the ones I drive are 55-60 max. My lifetime Wh/Mi is 270, and 20K of my 21K miles is with softer Vredstein Quatrac Pro tires, and this includes 2 East coast winters.

I also think the chassis could be more rigid, but this is a consequence of a "skateboard" platform, and it is clear that Tesla is moving towards a new chassis design that will bring with it a significant improvement across the board.

In my opinion, the biggest "Low" with owning a Tesla is the lack of service centers. Outside of where I live where the closest SC is within 50 miles, where I typically travel, I would need to drive at least 120 miles to get to a SC, which is always in the back of my mind when I'm on road trips. Service center availability was rarely on my mind with previous brands I've driven over the past three decades.

Have to agree on the lack of buttons to a degree. I love the display...however controlling simple functions like volume, temperature, etc. while the car is in motion can be difficult with the screen especially coupled with the harsh ride. Difficult to get my finger to hit the right thing on the screen the first time around!

 

[WhiteWi]

Have to agree on the lack of buttons to a degree. I love the display...however controlling simple functions like volume, temperature, etc. while the car is in motion can be difficult with the screen especially coupled with the harsh ride. Difficult to get my finger to hit the right thing on the screen the first time around!

Agreed and that is when your wife comes in handy

 

[buddhafree]

Have to agree on the lack of buttons to a degree. I love the display...however controlling simple functions like volume, temperature, etc. while the car is in motion can be difficult with the screen especially coupled with the harsh ride. Difficult to get my finger to hit the right thing on the screen the first time around!

I just use steering wheel volume control and voice commands to change temperature... They wanted to make a minimalist interior so they removed buttons. I'm ok with it as long as there is another easy way to get the results I need.

 

[Anothergeek]

I just sold my Model Y to Driveo. Great price BTW - 62,500 for a May Build 2021 Model Y with 20" wheels. It was a quick and smooth experience.

Since this was my first Tesla, I thought I'd share some thoughts on the car having owned it for almost 7 months.

Highs:
1) Powertrain. Power deliver was very impressive - especially given this was the LR and not the Performance model.
2) Phone Key. I love the phone key. It is so simple and I don't know why every OEM doesn't implement it in the same way. This is one of those things other companies over complicate.
3) Some other cool nuggets in software - I like the built-in streaming services, the ability to open and close garage door based on proximity, the simple and intuitive user profiles and the way you set them up.
4) Space. The Model Y is extremely well packaged with lots of interior space and lots of storage. It's really amazing.
5) Value. At the $52k price this car sold for new, it was untouchable in terms of value.
6) 5 standard heated seats and heated steering wheel. This was very impressive to me and is one of the things that makes Tesla appealing on the used market. You don't need to worry if it has this or doesn't have it depending on how it was specced.
7) Impressive resale value.

View attachment 772718​

Lows:
1) Rigidity. The car did not feel very rigid. You could sense a the chassis flex every time you drive. It felt cheaply built compared with a German car. They went with style over engineering. I would prefer a more rigid car than an uninterrupted glass roof.
2) Rough suspension. The suspension on the Model Y is pretty poor. You feel everything. I know some will say it is because I got the 20" wheels. However a lot of cars have 20" wheels with low profile tires and don't have this issue. This is one area they should have done a better job.
3) Autopilot. I like the Autopilot, but I also hate it. I regularly found myself in situations where it would tell me auto steering is disabled for the rest of the drive. I've never experienced that with any other brand.
4) Extreme minimalism. No roof blind or blackout function. No instrument cluster. Cheap doorhandles. No ambient lighting. Lack of physical buttons and switches to an extreme.
5) Range falls short of EPA estimates.

Overall I would say I leave Tesla with a positive impression of the brand, but I also feel there are a few areas they badly need to address if they want to stay leaders in this segment. The lows I described above will be important to address as the competition catches up in other aspects.

Sounds like you bought the vehicle sight-unseen, based on all of your complaints?

A simple test drive would have exposed all of those concerns.

I just don’t understand this trend.

Some folks are buying homes sight-unseen!

And then, unsurprisingly, many have buyer’s remorse.

 

[Anothergeek]

I agree with most of what you said. The drivetrain, technology, and performance are impressive. There are many things a Tesla can do.. that literally nobody else is doing at any price. That said I still have gripes about the lack of fairly simple stuff like HUD, CarPlay, real blindspot monitoring sensors with mirror LEDs, and rear cross-traffic sensors w/auto braking. If Tesla added these 4 things.. most of my gripes would be gone. That said, anybody who purchased a Model Y a year ago.. got a pretty awesome deal. Its an extremely competitive car for the old price. Now that it starts at $60K.. Im not so sure anymore.

I also agree that the range is flat-out overestimated and basically deceiving. Is it possible to actually achieve the EPA ratings? Yeah if you have absolutely perfect conditions like a flat road, windows up, no HVAC, 70-degree weather, and maintaining a perfect 40mph cruising speed. I've pointed out way too many times that in actual real-world testing.. Tesla's results (regardless of model) are shown to be always overestimated. Meanwhile, others like Ford generally meet or exceed their EPA rating. Some like the Taycan we get as much as 30% more range than what is advertised.

You do realize that the EPA ratings are determined, funny enough, by the EPA, right?

Not the vehicle manufacturers.

The vast majority of vehicles do not meet those numbers, in general, as they are tested under very-generous conditions, and almost no one drives that gently.

Some vehicles do meet them, of course. Some even beat them, but that is totally dependent on how you drive.

Never exceed 30 mph and you’ll get great numbers.

Never turn on your headlamps, heat, or a/c and you’ll do great.

 

[mangrove79]

I sold my Tesla not that long ago and I am no longer a member of the cult. I haven't been drinking the koolaid for a few years, giving me much needed perspective to rediscover what I once loved about cars. You see, after joining the Tesla Cult I would defend the company and cars against all threats. I wrapped my identity so far up into that Model S that sometimes you couldn't tell where the car ended and where I began. I had to accept deficiencies that every other car owner would laugh about, that every other manufacturer but Tesla seemed to get right.

Seriously, no offense, but everything you described here is not a reflection of Tesla, or this forum, but yourself. What comes to mind with that description of your state of mind, again no offense, is the QAnon cult. Those people "wrapped their identity so far up the conspiracies that they can't tell where lies ended and where they began." Certainly not comparing you with them, but just an analogy that jumped into my mind. Substitute any cult mentality and it will work just as well. I would've definitely looked within myself and try to find out why it happened instead of just rejoicing in your newly discovered liberty.

There are plenty of us here who can accept Tesla's faults and mistakes (and Elon's by extension) just as well as we can recognize its strengths and successes. I have a long list of shortcomings of my Model Y that I want Tesla to address, but I don't hold them against a company that is literally an infant compared to your favorite BMW in terms of age (and yet in terms of market cap dwarfs all German automakers combined). We don't defend Tesla blindly, but we do against trolls and unreasonable characterizations. I certainly don't consider that "cult" or "kool-aid" or even "fanboy", but I don't mind if you think so.

 

[mangrove79]

Fast forward to 2022. It's not just Teslas that are electric now. There are BMW. Mercedes. Audi. Polestar. All who know how to build a car 10x better than Tesla. And then there's Tesla's "big lie" about range.

True, Tesla is no longer the only game in town. But you probably should've fast-forwarded to 2025 instead, because how many of those brands can you actually find EVs on the road on a daily basis? Can you really tell that their single-digit EVs are built 10x better? Okay, I admit I'm using hyperbole.

The truth is, Tesla has built millions before some of these brands built a single one. They will forever be followers, at least for a long time, because of their ICE origin. A long history of traditions can only be baggage on the road to change. Of course, Tesla has lots of issues, anyone can name more than ten off the top of their head. But your comparison is kinda like asking why the Wright brothers couldn't just build a 747. Their plane is so poorly built, it didn't even have a seat!

As for the range, somewhat agree. While there's a thread discussing this every month, and one can argue if it's a lie or loophole, I do believe Tesla should follow the under-promise, over-deliver mentality. Its place in the EV market is firmly established and its technology is unrivaled (until proven otherwise), there is no need to expose itself to this type of criticism.

 

[oghowie]

Interesting, have owned my MYP for only a few weeks and the ride on 21" has been a lot better than I thought. My 2019 C300 on 18" run flats were rougher than this. My only real complaint so far is I really miss Carplay. Tesla maps, texting, and music all suck in comparison.

 

[Corndart]

Interesting, have owned my MYP for only a few weeks and the ride on 21" has been a lot better than I thought. My 2019 C300 on 18" run flats were rougher than this. My only real complaint so far is I really miss Carplay. Tesla maps, texting, and music all suck in comparison.

Agreed. Was fairly concerned about the MYP having driven the MYLR with 20" inductions and found it harsh, the MYP seems to be smoother overall thus far. Caveat - only put 200 miles on it since taking delivery .

Don't miss Carplay but having a native Apple Music app would be nice.

 

[Epradox]

You do realize that the EPA ratings are determined, funny enough, by the EPA, right?

Not the vehicle manufacturers.

The vast majority of vehicles do not meet those numbers, in general, as they are tested under very-generous conditions, and almost no one drives that gently.

Some vehicles do meet them, of course. Some even beat them, but that is totally dependent on how you drive.

Never exceed 30 mph and you’ll get great numbers.

Never turn on your headlamps, heat, or a/c and you’ll do great.

Actually the EPA ev range rating is a bit of a racket and honestly sounds corrupt. Like forcing manufactures to pay them extra to get the 5 cycle test rating or else good luck trying to sell your ev with the lower cycle rating. I haven’t come across a good reason why the EPA even has two separate tests for range and why it’s not just standardized on a single test…

 

[ShelJW]

Have to agree on the lack of buttons to a degree. I love the display...however controlling simple functions like volume, temperature, etc. while the car is in motion can be difficult with the screen especially coupled with the harsh ride. Difficult to get my finger to hit the right thing on the screen the first time around!

Volume is easily controlled by the scroll wheel, and temp can easily be set by voice.

I understand, some people would simply prefer physically knobs and buttons, but as far as distractions... not sure what could be less distracting then simply pressing a button and saying "turn heater up"... or "set temp to 72 degrees"..

 

[Corndart]

You do realize that the EPA ratings are determined, funny enough, by the EPA, right?

Not the vehicle manufacturers.

The vast majority of vehicles do not meet those numbers, in general, as they are tested under very-generous conditions, and almost no one drives that gently.

Some vehicles do meet them, of course. Some even beat them, but that is totally dependent on how you drive.

Never exceed 30 mph and you’ll get great numbers.

Never turn on your headlamps, heat, or a/c and you’ll do great.

This one has been beat to death in other threads but the curious thing is that Tesla consistently underperforms the stated EPA ratings, yes based on tests specified by the EPA. However there is a big asterisk there - most of these tests are conducted and reported by the manufacturer, not by the EPA.

Fuel Economy and EV Range Testing | US EPA

EPA's National Vehicle and Fuel Emissions Laboratory (NVFEL) tests new cars and trucks sold in the U.S. to ensure that they comply with federal emissions and fuel economy standards.

www.epa.gov

Given that additional detail, and the data that shows Tesla consistently underdelivers across all of its model lineup, why wouldn't they sandbag the numbers a little, set more realistic expectations with their customers, et al? The oversimplified answer is it makes them look better on the Monroney label, and it helps reduce range anxiety. Maybe it's that simple, but it doesn't make a lot of sense to many of us, and failing to grasp the concern is pretty myopic.

 

[Corndart]

True, Tesla is no longer the only game in town. But you probably should've fast-forwarded to 2025 instead, because how many of those brands can you actually find EVs on the road on a daily basis? Can you really tell that their single-digit EVs are built 10x better? Okay, I admit I'm using hyperbole.

The truth is, Tesla has built millions before some of these brands built a single one. They will forever be followers, at least for a long time, because of their ICE origin. A long history of traditions can only be baggage on the road to change. Of course, Tesla has lots of issues, anyone can name more than ten off the top of their head. But your comparison is kinda like asking why the Wright brothers couldn't just build a 747. Their plane is so poorly built, it didn't even have a seat!

As for the range, somewhat agree. While there's a thread discussing this every month, and one can argue if it's a lie or loophole, I do believe Tesla should follow the under-promise, over-deliver mentality. Its place in the EV market is firmly established and its technology is unrivaled (until proven otherwise), there is no need to expose itself to this type of criticism.

Whether you like, loathe or are indifferent to Munro and his coverage of Tesla and EV's, this video has a pretty interesting perspective on why pivoting for the traditional manufacturers is neither easy nor should it be taken for granted they'll be able to pull it off and survive the battery revolution.

It oversimplifies issues like geographies where the transition to BEV, hybrid, or some combination will take longer (transition costs will be high, poor countries will lag) but it's worth a watch.

 

[ShelJW]

I sold my Tesla not that long ago and I am no longer a member of the cult. I haven't been drinking the koolaid for a few years, giving me much needed perspective to rediscover what I once loved about cars.

I'm sure I speak for all of us here, in thanking you for taking time out of what I'm sure is a busy day, to spread your wisdom on a Tesla forum!

 

[Daekwan]

You do realize that the EPA ratings are determined, funny enough, by the EPA, right?

Not the vehicle manufacturers.

The vast majority of vehicles do not meet those numbers, in general, as they are tested under very-generous conditions, and almost no one drives that gently.

Some vehicles do meet them, of course. Some even beat them, but that is totally dependent on how you drive.

Never exceed 30 mph and you’ll get great numbers.

Never turn on your headlamps, heat, or a/c and you’ll do great.

You do realize the manufacturers test their own vehicles and then send those results to the EPA.

You can argue this all you want. The real-world results will still be exactly the same.. whenever you decide to stop typing and start looking at the facts. And yes.. many of these vehicles DO actually achieve their EPA results. At 70mph. With the A/C set to 72 degrees.

In case you forgot this has been proven many times over.. let me remind you:

What's The Real World Highway Range Of Today's Electric Cars? We Test To Find Out

We take the most popular electric cars, fully charge them, and then drive them at 70 mph to find out just how far they will go. Which one goes the furthest?

insideevs.com

 

[buddhafree]

You do realize the manufacturers test their own vehicles and then send those results to the EPA.

EPA testing is done based on official EPA procedures. Manufactures have to follow them when providing final numbers.
To make it worse, there are two different EPA procedures delivering different results and some manufactures choose to publish lower numbers than observed during tests and some don't.
I see two issues:
a. The EPA tests themselves are not producing numbers similar to observed during regular driving especially for electric vehicles.
b. We can't reliably use EPA numbers even to compare different EVs.

 

[Peteski]

It's hilarious that some don't see the irony in recommending smaller wheels as a fix for a suspension issue. With a Tesla you have to choose between comfort and sporty feel. With other brands like BMW, you get both. If you're relying on wheels—the point of contact between the vehicle and the physical world—as a primary mode to change ride dynamics, the suspension has failed to do its job.

Ever driven a BMW iX? That's an almost 6,000 lb EV that rides on rails that Björn Nyland called a "magic carpet ride". I don't mean this towards anyone here, but I generally imagine those defending Model 3/Y as pimply faced teenagers who play video games all day long in their mom's basement, and don't know what a real car is supposed to feel like. I can understand how to people like that a Tesla might feel premium.

I sold my Tesla not that long ago and I am no longer a member of the cult. I haven't been drinking the koolaid for a few years, giving me much needed perspective to rediscover what I once loved about cars. You see, after joining the Tesla Cult I would defend the company and cars against all threats. I wrapped my identity so far up into that Model S that sometimes you couldn't tell where the car ended and where I began. I had to accept deficiencies that every other car owner would laugh about, that every other manufacturer but Tesla seemed to get right. But none of that mattered to me—it's electric, dammit!

Fast forward to 2022. It's not just Teslas that are electric now. There are BMW. Mercedes. Audi. Polestar. All who know how to build a car 10x better than Tesla. And then there's Tesla's "big lie" about range. The Porsche Taycan and Audi e-Tron achieve real-world numbers that are pretty much the same as Tesla because Tesla's EPA figures are baloney. Of course Tesla is acting within the EPA rules and guidelines, but the fact that they are using a 5-cycle alternate methodology to everyone else's 2-cycle—resulting in EPA figures nobody can replicate in the real world—makes the figures de facto misrepresentations. If those numbers are not achievable in the real world, what is the point of those numbers other than to misrepresent the car's capabilities to consumers as an inducement to buy?

Looks like you've now joined an alternative cult.

 

[Wooloomooloo]

Do people really consider that Tesla-provided number when deciding whether to buy a Tesla or not? I mean, you have to be able to lay out the cash or set up the financing for the purchase price and that savings-based number in reality is completely variable by location and the fuel price across ownership days.

I have no idea whether people really use it to make the decision, but they sure as sugar use it to justify the decision after the fact, especially in public forums. I know rationally that my $75k purchase in 2018 replacing a paid-off Golf GTI that got around 28 MPG on Average can't possibly be justified by gas savings. I've "saved" about $5000 over 45k miles in 4 years, so in about 35 years it will be justified.

EVEN if I had bought a brand new ICE car for $40k it would take over 20 years to justify the difference.

However I do think that people factor in the cost over time, given most people finance their cars - so they will justify say $400 + $200 for gas for an ICE and say a Tesla at $600/month is worth it, especially when they get told services are low cost (they're not) and the cars require minimal maintenance overall (not true in my experience Vs a new car from a good manufacturer who will maintain there car for free for the first 3 - 5 years).

What they forget is that charging isn't completely free, and if you don't have FUSC (which I got with my P3D) Superchargers can be just as expensive as gas, if not more so especially if you lose a lot to vampire drain or can't plug in at home).

 

[doomsday997]

It's hilarious that some don't see the irony in recommending smaller wheels as a fix for a suspension issue. With a Tesla you have to choose between comfort and sporty feel. With other brands like BMW, you get both. If you're relying on wheels—the point of contact between the vehicle and the physical world—as a primary mode to change ride dynamics, the suspension has failed to do its job.

Ever driven a BMW iX? That's an almost 6,000 lb EV that rides on rails that Björn Nyland called a "magic carpet ride". I don't mean this towards anyone here, but I generally imagine those defending Model 3/Y as pimply faced teenagers who play video games all day long in their mom's basement, and don't know what a real car is supposed to feel like. I can understand how to people like that a Tesla might feel premium.

I sold my Tesla not that long ago and I am no longer a member of the cult. I haven't been drinking the koolaid for a few years, giving me much needed perspective to rediscover what I once loved about cars. You see, after joining the Tesla Cult I would defend the company and cars against all threats. I wrapped my identity so far up into that Model S that sometimes you couldn't tell where the car ended and where I began. I had to accept deficiencies that every other car owner would laugh about, that every other manufacturer but Tesla seemed to get right. But none of that mattered to me—it's electric, dammit!

Fast forward to 2022. It's not just Teslas that are electric now. There are BMW. Mercedes. Audi. Polestar. All who know how to build a car 10x better than Tesla. And then there's Tesla's "big lie" about range. The Porsche Taycan and Audi e-Tron achieve real-world numbers that are pretty much the same as Tesla because Tesla's EPA figures are baloney. Of course Tesla is acting within the EPA rules and guidelines, but the fact that they are using a 5-cycle alternate methodology to everyone else's 2-cycle—resulting in EPA figures nobody can replicate in the real world—makes the figures de facto misrepresentations. If those numbers are not achievable in the real world, what is the point of those numbers other than to misrepresent the car's capabilities to consumers as an inducement to buy?

Yup the ride in the iX was amazing I was super impressed with the tech in that car, the suspension, the way it handled, the hud was the best I've ever seen. Also drive the i4M50 very impressive as well. Other car makers are definitely catching up which is a good thing, Tesla cant be the only game in town forever.