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Just sold my Model Y - Parting thoughts

I just sold my Model Y to Driveo. Great price BTW - 62,500 for a May Build 2021 Model Y with 20" wheels. It was a quick and smooth experience.

Since this was my first Tesla, I thought I'd share some thoughts on the car having owned it for almost 7 months.

Highs:
1) Powertrain. Power deliver was very impressive - especially given this was the LR and not the Performance model.
2) Phone Key. I love the phone key. It is so simple and I don't know why every OEM doesn't implement it in the same way. This is one of those things other companies over complicate.
3) Some other cool nuggets in software - I like the built-in streaming services, the ability to open and close garage door based on proximity, the simple and intuitive user profiles and the way you set them up.
4) Space. The Model Y is extremely well packaged with lots of interior space and lots of storage. It's really amazing.
5) Value. At the $52k price this car sold for new, it was untouchable in terms of value.
6) 5 standard heated seats and heated steering wheel. This was very impressive to me and is one of the things that makes Tesla appealing on the used market. You don't need to worry if it has this or doesn't have it depending on how it was specced.
7) Impressive resale value.

712B4324-9010-4DD8-B466-44CA82E37D10.jpeg

Lows:
1) Rigidity. The car did not feel very rigid. You could sense a the chassis flex every time you drive. It felt cheaply built compared with a German car. They went with style over engineering. I would prefer a more rigid car than an uninterrupted glass roof.
2) Rough suspension. The suspension on the Model Y is pretty poor. You feel everything. I know some will say it is because I got the 20" wheels. However a lot of cars have 20" wheels with low profile tires and don't have this issue. This is one area they should have done a better job.
3) Autopilot. I like the Autopilot, but I also hate it. I regularly found myself in situations where it would tell me auto steering is disabled for the rest of the drive. I've never experienced that with any other brand.
4) Extreme minimalism. No roof blind or blackout function. No instrument cluster. Cheap doorhandles. No ambient lighting. Lack of physical buttons and switches to an extreme.
5) Range falls short of EPA estimates.

Overall I would say I leave Tesla with a positive impression of the brand, but I also feel there are a few areas they badly need to address if they want to stay leaders in this segment. The lows I described above will be important to address as the competition catches up in other aspects.
 
So... EV6... there are ways to get it a MSRP. There are high volume Kia dealers that will custom order it. How do I know? I pinged various Kia dealers since I'm seriously considering ditching one of my EVs for a Telluride because these EV crossovers are too small and with Tellurides you absolutely need to order out of state because of $20K markups. I really want the R1S to arrive at this point.

As for Toyota at MSRP... lol. Even if my Toyota dealer (that sold me my Prime at MSRP) decided to give me first dibs on the bz4z... they will still add $4K in junk/fees. The bz4x is RAV4 Prime 2.0 buying insanity all over again because there's no online reservation system and they will only be allocated to certain states.

My Solterra reservation I may get it a MSRP because the local dealer I reserved it with seems to be reasonable (and small). If there was a small $2K markup I'd might consider accepting delivery if it drives like a BEV-version of the RAV4 Prime. From what I hear though... I don't foresee MSRP for either of these two EVs.

If getting a Toyota, you'll probably want to buy out-of-state. The company that does the Toyota distribution for Florida is notorious.
I don't expect much markup for the bZ4X because Toyota is expected to cross the 200,000 limit before the end of June so credits will soon be decreasing.
 
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So... EV6... there are ways to get it a MSRP. There are high volume Kia dealers that will custom order it. How do I know? I pinged various Kia dealers since I'm seriously considering ditching one of my EVs for a Telluride because these EV crossovers are too small and with Tellurides you absolutely need to order out of state because of $20K markups. I really want the R1S to arrive at this point.

As for Toyota at MSRP... lol. Even if my Toyota dealer (that sold me my Prime at MSRP) decided to give me first dibs on the bz4z... they will still add $4K in junk/fees. The bz4x is RAV4 Prime 2.0 buying insanity all over again because there's no online reservation system and they will only be allocated to certain states.

My Solterra reservation I may get it a MSRP because the local dealer I reserved it with seems to be reasonable (and small). If there was a small $2K markup I'd might consider accepting delivery if it drives like a BEV-version of the RAV4 Prime. From what I hear though... I don't foresee MSRP for either of these two EVs.
I see you live in FL. Good luck ever finding a Toyota EV there. Im shocked you were able to get a prime!
 
All current-technology Lithium-Ion based batteries degrade over time. Exact rate mostly varies with thermal management and range of charging cycles. Tesla is by far at the lead of the industry at competence in those domains.

Pretending there won't be range-loss-over-time in ANY other electric vehicle is laughable.
Nice comment noting issues with battery degradation.
My issue with this thing is more like making buyer esp new EV user aware of these issues. So it’s not just range loss due to degradation (which gets into fuzzy territory and my pet peeve with Tesla). It’s also that (at least current battery tech) there is 20% - 90% range of battery which affects the EPA when vehicle is sold (to not cause further degradation on top of what there already may be for current chemistry). Why not list this 70% range (practical daily use) when selling EVs. I also do not buy Elon’s argument (if that is what he suggested in the first place) about EV range (that 250-280 is more than enough). True that smaller range but lighter EVs will be more efficient for daily use, but lot of folks don’t buy ~70k vehicle for just daily driving. Tech may not be there at this point but given the research it’s bound to happen in the next few years (reduced weight from large battery, and improved range which is definitely desirable).

I’m eagerly looking at LFP (100% suggested charge), and other emerging tech improvements - that’ll be huge step forward for EVs.
 
Nice comment noting issues with battery degradation.
My issue with this thing is more like making buyer esp new EV user aware of these issues. So it’s not just range loss due to degradation (which gets into fuzzy territory and my pet peeve with Tesla). It’s also that (at least current battery tech) there is 20% - 90% range of battery which affects the EPA when vehicle is sold (to not cause further degradation on top of what there already may be for current chemistry). Why not list this 70% range (practical daily use) when selling EVs. I also do not buy Elon’s argument (if that is what he suggested in the first place) about EV range (that 250-280 is more than enough). True that smaller range but lighter EVs will be more efficient for daily use, but lot of folks don’t buy ~70k vehicle for just daily driving. Tech may not be there at this point but given the research it’s bound to happen in the next few years (reduced weight from large battery, and improved range which is definitely desirable).

I’m eagerly looking at LFP (100% suggested charge), and other emerging tech improvements - that’ll be huge step forward for EVs.

I'm also excited about LFP, but at the moment, it's a double-edged sword.

On one side, it's much happier to charge and hold up to 100%, so you can more reasonably use the very top of your battery all the time (still not great to run any battery to full 0 for both battery-health reasons, and risk-of-turtle-mode).

However the basic chemistry of LFP is less power dense. A lot less. If you take a 80 KHh NMC pack and replace it with LFP cells, you get a 60 KWh pack (which you can now charge to full). That's not an immediate win, since you could have simply charged the same-weight/volume NMC pack and stopped most of the time at 3/4ths full and gotten the same experience.

And when it first came out LFP was more expensive. That's changing, and so we're immediately seeing LFP start to take over fixed-storage use cases where weight and physical size of the pack are not a big deal. Cars is still iffy, and what we've got is LFP for the standard-range variants of cars that carry an NMC battery for their top-range offering.
 
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AmpedRealtor

Well-Known Member
Jun 30, 2013
6,433
4,164
Phoenix, AZ
Yup the ride in the iX was amazing I was super impressed with the tech in that car, the suspension, the way it handled, the hud was the best I've ever seen. Also drive the i4M50 very impressive as well. Other car makers are definitely catching up which is a good thing, Tesla cant be the only game in town forever.
Today I would prefer the i4 M50 to the Model 3 hands down. No contest.

Checking out the BMW EV forums it appears most are former Tesla owners who are tired of the "Cult of Tesla", the poor build quality, and the lousy service experience. Tesla is heading towards troubled waters in terms of its reputation, and that's one thing that is almost impossible to rebuild.
 
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advocate8

Active Member
Nov 12, 2019
1,053
1,603
Maryland
Today I would prefer the i4 M50 to the Model 3 hands down. No contest.

Checking out the BMW EV forums it appears most are former Tesla owners who are tired of the "Cult of Tesla", the poor build quality, and the lousy service experience. Tesla is heading towards troubled waters in terms of its reputation, and that's one thing that is almost impossible to rebuild.
Nice interior! But it is a pig that weighs over 5000 lbs, has just 227 miles of EPA range and ... there is no reliable place to charge them on the road.
Pretty sweet sitting in the garage though!
 
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AmpedRealtor

Well-Known Member
Jun 30, 2013
6,433
4,164
Phoenix, AZ
We can complain all we want of other features we might need. but fact is Tesla is killing the auto market wildly right now, sure they have lots of quirks... But when the legacy brands catch up (2-3 years) Tesla will have better tech and better interiors for sure, they are so fixated right now on decreasing costs and increasing volume that it should give room for interior improvements and build quality on next gens.
I don't know where you've been, but "legacy" (a term used pejoratively by Tesla owners to marginalize) has already caught up. BMW iX has comparable range to Model X in real world conditions and destroys it in almost every metric that matters to those who care about vehicle dynamics, passenger comfort, driving experience, and driver assistance technology. BMW destroys Tesla in terms of tech. Ford Mach-e is sold out for rest of model year and Ford has stopped taking orders. I am thankful to Tesla for cracking this market open and for making it so that I can purchase a quality BEV without subjecting myself to Tesla's lies, BS, and crappy service experience where they can't even wash your $140,000 car prior to delivery.

Except....Tesla is 3 years away from matching BMW’s 2019 interiors. And shows zero interest in improving 3/Y interiors now except for tiny stuff like magnetic console lids and a cargo cover that seemingly every $20k SUV every made comes with.
Tesla's interior quality is only now starting to approach that of Volkswagen circa 2005. I think you're being generous. The Ford Mach-e interior destroys every Tesla ever made and at a lower price that is eligible for a $7,500 tax credit. Tesla is no longer the only game in town—they're now objectively the worst.

My biggest disappointment is that they fall way short of the EPA estimate range.

Feels like somehow they lied or deceived consumers by selling you on the 300+ range; Knowing that their testing conditions are not real under normal everyday driving. ☹️😡
Tesla is deceiving consumers by utilizing the EPA 5-cycle test in order to get more optimistic and totally unachievable results. Other manufacturers like Porsche, Audi, BMW, Mercedes, VW, etc. use the EPA 2-cycle test to provide their customers with achievable range figures and a better ownership experience. Tesla doesn't understand that disappointing customers is the single best way to alienate customers.

I made more than that on Tesla stock just in past year alone.
Great point: Buy the stock, not the car.
 
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I don't know where you've been, but "legacy" (a term used pejoratively by Tesla owners to marginalize) has already caught up. BMW iX has comparable range to Model X in real world conditions and destroys it in almost every metric that matters to those who care about vehicle dynamics, passenger comfort, driving experience, and driver assistance technology. BMW destroys Tesla in terms of tech. Ford Mach-e is sold out for rest of model year and Ford has stopped taking orders. I am thankful to Tesla for cracking this market open and for making it so that I can purchase a quality BEV without subjecting myself to Tesla's lies, BS, and crappy service experience where they can't even wash your $140,000 car prior to delivery.


Tesla's interior quality is only now starting to approach that of Volkswagen circa 2005. I think you're being generous. The Ford Mach-e interior destroys every Tesla ever made and at a lower price that is eligible for a $7,500 tax credit. Tesla is no longer the only game in town—they're now objectively the worst.


Tesla is deceiving consumers by utilizing the EPA 5-cycle test in order to get more optimistic and totally unachievable results. Other manufacturers like Porsche, Audi, BMW, Mercedes, VW, etc. use the EPA 2-cycle test to provide their customers with achievable range figures and a better ownership experience. Tesla doesn't understand that disappointing customers is the single best way to alienate customers.


Great point: Buy the stock, not the car.
Tesla must be doing something right as those that leave just can’t avoid staying.
 
Actually there is quite a bit of BMW iX content here. Or were you not aware? Try doing a search. I don't understand the provincial thinking being expressed above.

🙊 🙉 🙈
bleh thats the ugliest looking thing. the new i7 looks very nice but those weird pig nose grills are horrendous. everytime i see it in person, i throw up a little in my mouth. why do electric cars need grills? why dont they have frunks? im sorry but id take a plaid model x over a bmw ix any day of the week.
 
bleh thats the ugliest looking thing. the new i7 looks very nice but those weird pig nose grills are horrendous. everytime i see it in person, i throw up a little in my mouth. why do electric cars need grills? why dont they have frunks? im sorry but id take a plaid model x over a bmw ix any day of the week.
It's almost like they are going out of there way to make ugly electric cars. They use to be able to design good looking cars. I wonder what happened. I guess it's a good way to keep demand down, so they don't have to raise their prices all the time, like Tesla.
 

advocate8

Active Member
Nov 12, 2019
1,053
1,603
Maryland
With its handling it should be an 'M'. Not that Tesla is any better at handling.
You’re parroting testers. But the range isn’t practical, and worse yet with a short-range car you don’t have a reliable network of highway charging. Trust me, I would MUCH rather be in an EV made by BMW, who know how to actually make a car. But they aren’t there yet. Need another generation, two-three years out. and maybe there will be a reasonable array of chargers they can use by then.
 

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