Just sold my Model Y - Parting thoughts

I just sold my Model Y to Driveo. Great price BTW - 62,500 for a May Build 2021 Model Y with 20" wheels. It was a quick and smooth experience.

Since this was my first Tesla, I thought I'd share some thoughts on the car having owned it for almost 7 months.

Highs:
1) Powertrain. Power deliver was very impressive - especially given this was the LR and not the Performance model.
2) Phone Key. I love the phone key. It is so simple and I don't know why every OEM doesn't implement it in the same way. This is one of those things other companies over complicate.
3) Some other cool nuggets in software - I like the built-in streaming services, the ability to open and close garage door based on proximity, the simple and intuitive user profiles and the way you set them up.
4) Space. The Model Y is extremely well packaged with lots of interior space and lots of storage. It's really amazing.
5) Value. At the $52k price this car sold for new, it was untouchable in terms of value.
6) 5 standard heated seats and heated steering wheel. This was very impressive to me and is one of the things that makes Tesla appealing on the used market. You don't need to worry if it has this or doesn't have it depending on how it was specced.
7) Impressive resale value.

Lows:
1) Rigidity. The car did not feel very rigid. You could sense a the chassis flex every time you drive. It felt cheaply built compared with a German car. They went with style over engineering. I would prefer a more rigid car than an uninterrupted glass roof.
2) Rough suspension. The suspension on the Model Y is pretty poor. You feel everything. I know some will say it is because I got the 20" wheels. However a lot of cars have 20" wheels with low profile tires and don't have this issue. This is one area they should have done a better job.
3) Autopilot. I like the Autopilot, but I also hate it. I regularly found myself in situations where it would tell me auto steering is disabled for the rest of the drive. I've never experienced that with any other brand.
4) Extreme minimalism. No roof blind or blackout function. No instrument cluster. Cheap doorhandles. No ambient lighting. Lack of physical buttons and switches to an extreme.
5) Range falls short of EPA estimates.

Overall I would say I leave Tesla with a positive impression of the brand, but I also feel there are a few areas they badly need to address if they want to stay leaders in this segment. The lows I described above will be important to address as the competition catches up in other aspects.

 

[Tgcmyp924]

Based on OP's signature, it seems the EQS was the replacement vehicle.

I'll +1 to the OP's comments on the Pros & Cons, I can't understate enough how firm the ride is (borderline uncomfortable like a BMW M 3-series) that is the biggest negative I'm struggling with on this vehicle. Right now with WFH, I barely drive it (wife runs errands & picks kids up from school with it) but when normalcy resumes, I'll either get smaller rims, underinflate the tires or get something else.

I’ve have the Y for 2 weeks now and I still have my E class. I try to ignore it but it doesn’t do well on the rough road compared to the E350. I kind of feel everything which is something I hate (as a passenger), so it’s not as bad as the driver, but I still feel every bump and dip which I’m not used to. That being said, so far, the pros outweighs the cons IMO.

 

[Fidalgo]

Another Y owner in agreement with your pros and cons. Improving the stiff suspension would be the one thing that might tempt me to trade my 2020 for a newer model.

Another pro/con is the sales and service model. No dealership shenanigans but one pays the ever-shifting msrp with limited information on just what upgrades a particular car has, or has not, when ordering. On service, no way to ask a phone or email question; text only for take-it-or-leave it service appointments. When you finally meet staff they're generally nice and competent, but the impersonality of contacting Tesla bothers me.

 

[Fairchild]

Don't worry, I still have my sense of humor and of course we shall see what it's like, but an EV Camper Trip is what I've waited my whole life for! Old hippy is about right.

On VAG Vs Tesla... well if you'd owned my 2018 P3D with all the delights of CV_FRONT errors, 12v failures, charging plug failure and most recently a brake failure (but but but they last forever because of regen) and put that against the anecdotal experience of over 300k miles of driving in my life, almost exclusively in VW's and never once had a breakdown, you might think differently. But none of them were EV's, 'tis true m'laud.

Objectively I think a Model Y is better in most (important) respects than an ID4 and if a complete stranger asked me, I'd tell them to get a Tesla. But the heart wants what the heart wants, and Teslas are not prefect, despite what you might think if you only got your news from Teslerati.

Also after 25 years of frequenting VW message boards (and Porsche forums) I never experienced the level of mockery and toxicity you see here. It's really unfortunate.

One has to be able to trust a vehicle and when major corporations like VW and Hyundai lie to manipulate the public, they have lost me as a customer for life. Just the facts.

One word. Dieselgate. If you can't trust the engineers, who can you trust? What other shortcuts have they taken that affect my safety?

Another example of great engineering??

 

[LHC22]

I also agree that the range is flat-out overestimated and basically deceiving. Is it possible to actually achieve the EPA ratings? Yeah if you have absolutely perfect conditions like a flat road, windows up, no HVAC, 70-degree weather, and maintaining a perfect 40mph cruising speed. I've pointed out way too many times that in actual real-world testing.. Tesla's results (regardless of model) are shown to be always overestimated. Meanwhile, others like Ford generally meet or exceed their EPA rating. Some like the Taycan we get as much as 30% more range than what is advertised.

This is the part that ALWAYS gets me fired up. Tesla doesn’t set range. I’ll say it again because STILL can’t figure this out. Tesla does NOT dictate to the EPA what range to put on the car. The end…full stop. Blaming Tesla for failed EPA testing is the most absurd thing I’ve ever read. That and the whole “Ford beats there estimate. Porsche beats there estimate”… congrats? When they beat it, the range is STILL less than the equivalent Tesla. So you want a car that underestimated its range, just you can have less range? Got it.

 

[Corndart]

This is the part that ALWAYS gets me fired up. Tesla doesn’t set range. I’ll say it again because STILL can’t figure this out. Tesla does NOT dictate to the EPA what range to put on the car. The end…full stop. Blaming Tesla for failed EPA testing is the most absurd thing I’ve ever read. That and the whole “Ford beats there estimate. Porsche beats there estimate”… congrats? When they beat it, the range is STILL less than the equivalent Tesla. So you want a car that underestimated its range, just you can have less range? Got it.

You do realize the manufacturers run the test, in conformance with EPA specifications regarding test composition...right?

So when you say "Tesla doesn't set the range" , that's a half truth. They do the test, they provide the results. Why do other manufacturers conducting tests in accordance with EPA guidelines regularly meet or beat them?

How Vehicles Are Tested

Fuel economy is measured under controlled conditions in a laboratory using a standardized test procedure specified by federal law. Manufacturers test their own vehicles—usually pre-production prototypes—and report the results to EPA. EPA reviews the results and confirms about 10-15 percent of...

www.fueleconomy.gov

 

[leaftoy]

This is the part that ALWAYS gets me fired up. Tesla doesn’t set range. I’ll say it again because STILL can’t figure this out. Tesla does NOT dictate to the EPA what range to put on the car. The end…full stop. Blaming Tesla for failed EPA testing is the most absurd thing I’ve ever read. That and the whole “Ford beats there estimate. Porsche beats there estimate”… congrats? When they beat it, the range is STILL less than the equivalent Tesla. So you want a car that underestimated its range, just you can have less range? Got it.

It is not as absurd as you make it out to be. There seems to be a dial each manufacturer can turn to skew the EPA range to more accurately reflect real-world range, and Tesla always turns the dial towards higher number while other manufacturers (at least a few of them) turn it to make it closer to what can be expected in real world.

The Secret Adjustment Factor Tesla Uses to Get Its Big EPA Range Numbers

How Tesla puts distance between itself and the competition while still playing by the EPA's rules.

www.caranddriver.com

 

[Daekwan]

This is the part that ALWAYS gets me fired up. Tesla doesn’t set range. I’ll say it again because STILL can’t figure this out. Tesla does NOT dictate to the EPA what range to put on the car. The end…full stop. Blaming Tesla for failed EPA testing is the most absurd thing I’ve ever read. That and the whole “Ford beats there estimate. Porsche beats there estimate”… congrats? When they beat it, the range is STILL less than the equivalent Tesla. So you want a car that underestimated its range, just you can have less range? Got it.

I'm putting this 100% on Tesla. EVERY other manufacturer seems to be pretty close or even better than what EPA testing shows. Whatever it is Tesla is doing, they have figured out a way to absolutely game the EPA test. Tesla customers dont get the same result.

One of the most amazing EV achievements I've recently read about is Lucid's Air advertising 500+ miles of range. Not only did the Lucid AIr deliver on its 500-mile claim on a single charge.. but it did while cruising at 70mph.

Watch Record-Setting Lucid Air Dream Edition 70-MPH Range Test

We fully charge a 2022 Lucid Air Dream Edition Range and drive it at a constant 70-mph to see how far it will go before running out of power.

insideevs.com

Do you know how many miles the Plaid with an EPA rating of 348 miles got on the exact same test? 300..

Or better stated a negative difference of about -12% vs its EPA rating. And this isnt a one-off occurrence. Or a bad apple perhaps. In fact, pretty much every vehicle Tesla produces.. using the exact same testing method.. got around the same negative result. I first learned about this years ago when Alex on Autos (the car reviewer I trust the most) pointed out that no Tesla he has driven has ever gotten the EPA rating. And he specifically tested the Mach-E vs the Model Y about a year ago.. and of course the Mach-E met its rating, but the Model Y fell well short.

But I know.. the blame should still go to anybody else BUT Tesla according to you.

What's The Real World Highway Range Of Today's Electric Cars? We Test To Find Out

We take the most popular electric cars, fully charge them, and then drive them at 70 mph to find out just how far they will go. Which one goes the furthest?

insideevs.com

Alex on Autos testing:

Model Y=244
MME = 274

 

[voxel]

So the Alex in Autos efficiency number is exactly what I've experienced in Florida:

303 Wh/Mi = 3.3 mi/kWh on the Mach-E
260 Wh/Mi = 3.8 mi/kWh on the Model Y

The Mach-E has a 99 kWh (88 usable in 2021) so that's 88 * 3.3 = 290 miles
The Model Y has a 75 kWh (or 77?) usable so that's 75 * 3.8 = 285 miles

The massive battery pack helps but of course the weight has side effects which is why I would ONLY get the GTPE with MagneRide and the beefier motors.

I've seen Ioniq 5 and EV6 with 330 Wh/mi number (that's the official data from Kia EV6 Long Range AWD) so the above two are definitely more efficient.

 

[Stealth.Pilot]

I’ve have the Y for 2 weeks now and I still have my E class. I try to ignore it but it doesn’t do well on the rough road compared to the E350. I kind of feel everything which is something I hate (as a passenger), so it’s not as bad as the driver, but I still feel every bump and dip which I’m not used to. That being said, so far, the pros outweighs the cons IMO.

Yes the pros of being electric are a huge pro. But when there is an Electric E-Class (EQE) then it will be a different story.

Another pro/con is the sales and service model. No dealership shenanigans but one pays the ever-shifting msrp with limited information on just what upgrades a particular car has, or has not, when ordering. On service, no way to ask a phone or email question; text only for take-it-or-leave it service appointments. When you finally meet staff they're generally nice and competent, but the impersonality of contacting Tesla bothers me.

Agree 100%. Dealership shenanigans are a pain.

 

[Stealth.Pilot]

I'm putting this 100% on Tesla. EVERY other manufacturer seems to be pretty close or even better than what EPA testing shows. Whatever it is Tesla is doing, they have figured out a way to absolutely game the EPA test. Tesla customers dont get the same result.

One of the most amazing EV achievements I've recently read about is Lucid's Air advertising 500+ miles of range. Not only did the Lucid AIr deliver on its 500-mile claim on a single charge.. but it did while cruising at 70mph.

Watch Record-Setting Lucid Air Dream Edition 70-MPH Range Test

We fully charge a 2022 Lucid Air Dream Edition Range and drive it at a constant 70-mph to see how far it will go before running out of power.

insideevs.com

Do you know how many miles the Plaid with an EPA rating of 348 miles got on the exact same test? 300..

Or better stated a negative difference of about -12% vs its EPA rating. And this isnt a one-off occurrence. Or a bad apple perhaps. In fact, pretty much every vehicle Tesla produces.. using the exact same testing method.. got around the same negative result. I first learned about this years ago when Alex on Autos (the car reviewer I trust the most) pointed out that no Tesla he has driven has ever gotten the EPA rating. And he specifically tested the Mach-E vs the Model Y about a year ago.. and of course the Mach-E met its rating, but the Model Y fell well short.

100%. The data speaks for itself. Teslas range is consistently overrated relative to other brands.

 

[Stealth.Pilot]

This is the part that ALWAYS gets me fired up. Tesla doesn’t set range. I’ll say it again because STILL can’t figure this out. Tesla does NOT dictate to the EPA what range to put on the car. The end…full stop. Blaming Tesla for failed EPA testing is the most absurd thing I’ve ever read. That and the whole “Ford beats there estimate. Porsche beats there estimate”… congrats? When they beat it, the range is STILL less than the equivalent Tesla. So you want a car that underestimated its range, just you can have less range? Got it.

The same is true for emissions testing but look at Dieselgate. EPA range estimates is Tesla’s dieselgate. The data shows they are uniquely benefiting from a bias in the estimations. What we don’t know is how they are manipulating it.

 

[OxBrew]

Also after 25 years of frequenting VW message boards (and Porsche forums) I never experienced the level of mockery and toxicity you see here. It's really unfortunate.

I agree with this. Spent way too much time at VW TDI forums keeping my 2000 Golf diesel running, and almost everyone was really helpful and friendly. Same with the Subaru Outback forums later. 2006 to last year, pretty regular visitor to those forums.

This place is really disappointing. Often, not always, need to wade through pages of defensive put downs to find nuggets of helpful information. Really quite odd. Everyone I know with a Tesla are genuinely cool friendly people.

The ignore button works wonders though, makes this place almost tolerable, when used early and often.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

This is the part that ALWAYS gets me fired up. Tesla doesn’t set range. I’ll say it again because STILL can’t figure this out. Tesla does NOT dictate to the EPA what range to put on the car. The end…full stop. Blaming Tesla for failed EPA testing is the most absurd thing I’ve ever read. That and the whole “Ford beats there estimate. Porsche beats there estimate”… congrats? When they beat it, the range is STILL less than the equivalent Tesla. So you want a car that underestimated its range, just you can have less range? Got it.

This is factually incorrect because there are a lot of things manufactures can do to manipulate the range number.

When Tesla released the Model 3 they claimed the same range for the LR rear wheel drive, LR AWD, and Performance Model 3. Why did they do this? I dunno. Probably simplicity. The EPA allowed them to do this because I believe degrading the number is okay. For the Performance Model 3 they used smaller wheels than what was sold with it.

When Porsche did their EPA numbers they purposely used bigger tires despite the range hit. After a year or so they redid the EPA numbers with a more common tire/wheel setup and got better numbers so they went with those.

What I'm getting at is there is a lot of wiggle room.

The other problem is the EPA numbers aren't really a good indicator of real world situations. They won't tell what range to expect in the dead of winter when your commute is only 9 miles each way. They won't tell you what to expect driving 70+mph on the freeway for hours on end.

The EPA numbers aren't useful for things like why the dual speed transmission in a Taycan is better for freeway driving, or why the Heat Pump in a Model Y is better for the cold.

 

[Corndart]

Yes the pros of being electric are a huge pro. But when there is an Electric E-Class (EQE) then it will be a different story.

Agree 100%. Dealership shenanigans are a pain.

2023 Mercedes-AMG EQE Revealed, Offers up to 677 HP

The companion to the AMG EQS promises to be a bit sportier than its big sibling with a staggered tire setup and other performance options.

www.caranddriver.com

 

[Pianewman]

The same is true for emissions testing but look at Dieselgate. EPA range estimates is Tesla’s dieselgate. The data shows they are uniquely benefiting from a bias in the estimations. What we don’t know is how they are manipulating it.

Even a casual reader would agree that this comparison is totally absurd.

Dieselgate was about deliberate and total corporate fraud about pollution, and had nothing in the slightest to do with EPA range (which, FYI, VAG actually underestimated!)

An examination of the charts provided above show there is nothing at all "uniquely benefitting" Tesla.

 

[Fairchild]

Even a casual reader would agree that this comparison is totally absurd.

Dieselgate was about deliberate and total corporate fraud about pollution, and had nothing in the slightest to do with EPA range (which, FYI, VAG actually underestimated!)

An examination of the charts provided above show there is nothing at all "uniquely benefitting" Tesla.

C'mon man. Stealth Pilot - Your logic must have been damaged by flying under the radar. Volkswagen was forced to buy back the affected cars and fix their emissions-cheating software and parts. Volkswagen and BMW are fined nearly $1 billion for colluding on emissions technology. NOT my kinda car company.

And Mercedes?
Not to even mention the exorbitant cost of repairs on a Mercedes or the time spent in the shop. Drivers pay about $908 on average per year to maintain and repair their Mercedes vehicles, according to RepairPal.com.

With the six Telsa's I have owned, I have been in for service four times. One for a new motor, because it made a slight whir (NO charge), one for a battery replacement on a Model X at 17,545 miles (NO charge), once for Raven software download (and they woke up an engineer to do it, so I could race that afternoon). Currently, they have my 2014, yes eight-year-old vehicle, and they are replacing the eMMC and computer for FREE, not because it doesn't work, but because it is slow. Each time, I am given a loaner Tesla to play with. Today, I have a 2022 Model 3 White loaner, named Betty White. That kind of service with ANY other automaker is stealth - nowhere to be found.

In eight (8) years of Tesla driving, I have NEVER had a range issue. Wall socket in the garage. Plug in. I don't understand the challenge here.
Quite honestly, anything beyond 250-mile range is somewhat of a waste anyway, unless you are in a cross-country trip competing for how long your bladder can hold out. And the award goes to: Envelope please. Drum roll. LUCID BLADDER!

If you want to pay $170,000 for 471 miles of Lucid Air battery range to go to the grocery store, it's your choice. Have at it. Nice car. Made some good money off of Lucid stock, and got out before they tanked. And ALL EVs contribute to a more sustainable future. Celebrate Tesla accomplishing its goal.

 

[Wooloomooloo]

Even a casual reader would agree that this comparison is totally absurd.

Dieselgate was about deliberate and total corporate fraud about pollution, and had nothing in the slightest to do with EPA range

Not to be a pedant, but this isn't true either. The underlying reason for the fraud was higher MPG. With diesel engines (apologies if you already know this) a cleaner burn results in lower MPG. Anyone who owned a VW TDi will tell you that when the emissions were lowered back to acceptable levels (if any levels are really acceptable) the MPG dropped by about 15%, which is a lot and made the financial purchase of a TDi questionable given its higher purchase price and the higher price of diesel compared to gasoline/petrol.

Now Tesla hasn't committed "fraud" in the same sense (lying to regulators) with its EPA range, but it DOES calculate gas savings in its pricing based upon the EPA range. If you only charge your Tesla with superchargers, when you take into account vampire drain, cold weather, highway driving speeds and other factors, running a Tesla isn't any cheaper than running a Prius. In fact it could cost more in some states. I probably realistically get about 180 miles per 100% charge on average throughout the year when those factors are taken into account. I lose close to 100% of charge to vampire drain every month for example, especially in winter.

I'm not equivocating at all, but the underlying motivation for both, is the same. It's a claim about the financial viability of the vehicle and justifying to an extent its additional cost over gasoline/petrol powered cars by claiming greater efficiency. The greater efficiency is true in both cases, but the margins are lower in both cases than the manufacturers claim.

 

[gx9901]

Re: EPA numbers. If I recall correctly, currently only Tesla and Polestar uses the so-called 5-cycle test while everyone else uses the 2-cycle test. Apparently the 5-cycle test results in "optimistic" numbers while the 2-cycle test consistently get near or below real-time numbers. In that sense I don't think Tesla is doing anything wrong with their EPA estimates. I think Tesla/Elon stretches the truth on a lot of stuff, so I'm not being a fanboy defending them. But when it comes to the EPA range estimate, I don't think they're doing anything wrong.

As for the OP, I'm guessing a lot of us would trade in our MYs for an EQS if we're able to do it. LOL! I'm pretty sure I would even though I love my MYP.

 

[Fairchild]

Not to be a pedant, but this isn't true either. The underlying reason for the fraud was higher MPG. With diesel engines (apologies if you already know this) a cleaner burn results in lower MPG. Anyone who owned a VW TDi will tell you that when the emissions were lowered back to acceptable levels (if any levels are really acceptable) the MPG dropped by about 15%, which is a lot and made the financial purchase of a TDi questionable given its higher purchase price and the higher price of diesel compared to gasoline/petrol.

Now Tesla hasn't committed "fraud" in the same sense (lying to regulators) with its EPA range, but it DOES calculate gas savings in its pricing based upon the EPA range. If you only charge your Tesla with superchargers, when you take into account vampire drain, cold weather, highway driving speeds and other factors, running a Tesla isn't any cheaper than running a Prius. In fact it could cost more in some states. I probably realistically get about 180 miles per 100% charge on average throughout the year when those factors are taken into account. I lose close to 100% of charge to vampire drain every month for example, especially in winter.

I'm not equivocating at all, but the underlying motivation for both, is the same. It's a claim about the financial viability of the vehicle and justifying to an extent its additional cost over gasoline/petrol powered cars by claiming greater efficiency. The greater efficiency is true in both cases, but the margins are lower in both cases than the manufacturers claim.

Not at all. Vampire drain, cold weather and highway speeds are nothing compared to the "next to nothing maintenance costs" (oil changes, time in the shop, linkages, carburetors, exhaust systems, radiators, transmission, belts and pulleys, differential, motor rebuilds, on and on.

Electric vehicles have cheaper fuel and maintenance costs. While EVs usually have higher upfront purchase prices, owners can save a lot on operating expenses. A 2020 Consumer Reports study found that EV owners, on average, spend 60% less on fuel compared to internal combustion engine vehicles.

And that's not, in any way considering the environmental pollution cost savings. Priceless.

Study dispels myth that electric cars pollute as much as gas-powered cars due to 'dirty' grid

A new study dispels the persistent myth that electric cars pollute just as much as gas-powered cars because they charge...

electrek.co

 

[Fairchild]

As for the OP, I'm guessing a lot of us would trade in our MYs for an EQS if we're able to do it. LOL! I'm pretty sure I would even though I love my MYP.

Perhaps not if you realize you can have two MYPs for the cost of an EQS.