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LAPD getting P85D's

Discussion in 'News' started by Lump, Sep 11, 2015.

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  1. beeeerock

    beeeerock Active Member

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    Criminals should be happy... all three rear seat positions are equally comfortable - no need to fight to avoid that dreaded middle seat with the drive shaft hump... Dr. Evil's Mini Me could go in the rear facing seat...
     
  2. Pete90D

    Pete90D Fan of Red Lights

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    I've never sat in the back of a cop car, but I'd think with the divider+NG seats there wouldn't be a ton of room for anyone. I wonder if these would even be used for holding anyone or if they would call for backup.
     
  3. Scotty

    Scotty Member

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    I am worried about response times. No, not the 'ludicrous' acceleration time, not even the top end, or the great handling.

    No.... I am concerned if they put the target street address into the Nav system. It will possibly route the car through Kingman, AZ to the Supercharger (before their final destination, which might have been no more than a couple miles from their initial location.:wink:

    Scotty

    (Yeah, the memory is still frsh from a week ago. I was on the 115/35 outside of Peterborough, Ontario, and requested the Toronto Supercharger (about 70 miles). The Nav system reported 'Charging is required to reach your destination". As I scratched my head and looked at the detailed route, I saw that it was routing me within 2 miles of the Toronto SC, but was bypassing it as it directed me across the border and to the Buffalo, NY, Supercharge. After a charge, it then told me to head back directly to the final destination of the Toronto SC.)
     
  4. Oba

    Oba Member

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    There is NO WAY that any police department is going to buy any car that costs even a fraction more than what a Crown Vic costs today.

    [FONT=Source Sans Pro, sans-serif]$36,600 for the Chevy Caprice [/FONT][FONT=Source Sans Pro, sans-serif]police[/FONT][FONT=Source Sans Pro, sans-serif] car[/FONT]
    [FONT=Source Sans Pro, sans-serif]$33,500 for the new Ford Interceptor
    $24,000 for the old Crown Victoria
    [/FONT]


    The "Police Crown Vic"

    The back was big enough for the bulkiest perps. It was deceptively fast, braked well and handled better than you’d think.

    Sacramento County Sheriff Scott Jones, vice president of the California Peace Officers Association, said the vehicle had one more good trait: “(It) could withstand impacts.”

    The spacious interior could hold the gear of modern policing – computers, lights and siren controls, shotgun racks. The seats didn’t squeeze officers wearing protective vests and utility belts loaded with weapon, Taser, digital recorder, a baton holster and handcuffs.
    ment.

    The Interceptor has better handling, safety features and fuel economy than the Crown Victoria without sacrificing interior room, according to police official
     
  5. RobStark

    RobStark Well-Known Member

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    #25 RobStark, Sep 12, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2015
    YES WAY.

    Fleet operators look at Total Cost of Ownership including fueling and maintenance not just the striking price on the car itself.

    As Tesla increases sales so does economies of scale.

    A Model S bumper cover that cost $1300 in 2012 now cost $300.

    We shall see where Tesla is in 2017-18 when the LAPD is done with their evaluation.

    Then there is the fact LA City and LAPD has been directed by the Mayor and City Council to reduce their carbon footprint/increase their energy efficiency.

    Under those parameters Model S may win by default.

    BTW To be clear there is no new Crown Vic. Ford discontinued their large RWD body on frame cars. A few small police departments buy refurbished Crown Vics but that is a dying industry. Model S has to compete with FWD unibody sedans and crossovers from GM/Ford plus the Dodge Charger.
     
  6. Oba

    Oba Member

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    #26 Oba, Sep 12, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2015
    Obviously, the city of LA is a gigantic exception, since the mayor said that's what they'll do (and presumably, he has the authority to pay whatever price is required).

    But, any other town? Just watch the squeal from the opposition when any mayor / county commissioner says that their police / sheriff will spend TWICE or THREE times as much for an Obamamobile. The total cost of ownership won't mean a darn thing. That's not how politics works, and Police / Sheriff is big time politics. The middle of the US won't sign off on this for 20 years, even if it was half the cost (it's not).

    Plus, the Model S is no Crown Vic replacement. I doubt it will handle real abuse that police will dish out, like driving over curbs without bottoming out / breaking wheels / breaking suspension parts. All the old police cars had steel wheels, lots of tire sidewall (no way on 21" tires), etc. There will be a LOT of modifications to any police car as "dainty" as a Model S.

    The pluses that I foresee:

    1) Yes, total cost of ownership, provided the cars survive hard core police duty. After 100,000 miles, the car will be ready for replacement (the average for a police car). In that time, at 20mpg, with $3/gal gasoline is only $15,000 in gasoline for the traditional police car. Let's throw another $5000 for any future price increases or lower mpg, so $20,000 in gasoline. I'll pick the most expensive police car, at $36,600, which makes $56,600 in total costs. We will just assume that repairs, maintenance and outfitting is the same cost for both.

    Electricity isn't free, so figure 2.5 miles per kWh "from the wall" @ 12 cents per kWh = $4800 in electricity. I can tell you that electricity in California is WELL ABOVE the national average of 12 cents. So, the Tesla can cost about $72,000 to be close to equivalent. Of course, this assumes that the value at the end of the period is similar, and its entirely likely that the Tesla will be worth far more than a Crown Vic with 100,000 police miles.

    2) Easy green wash campaign with EV cop cars. Expect the "suits" and executives of police work to be driving these cars, anyway. Light duty stuff, not pounding curbs and grabbing perps.

    3) Warm fuzzies in California with a car built in California. I can foresee some kind of incentive plan from Sacramento that pays cash for government owned cars built in California.

    I suspect that they will want "special" police / city owned Superchargers throughout the region, and an HPWC at 80 amps in every overnight parking stall and service bay.
     
  7. juggie

    juggie Member

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    I'm so disapointed by Tesla to support LAPD "to protect and serve" the goverment This is not progress for man but support of (needless) violance against mankind!
     
  8. sitter_k

    sitter_k Active Member

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    I wonder how the Amsterdam Tesla Taxis are holding up as fleet vehicles
     
  9. taurusking

    taurusking Member

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    This is 2015 and we still are talking about higher costs for repair for MS...I agree the prices have come down but still way too high...I hope the prices come down further
     
  10. dhanson865

    dhanson865 Active Member

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    And you don't think this is just a pilot test and they'll use the Model 3 for full ramp up?

    Cut the cost of the car in half and see how that changes the math.
     
  11. Oba

    Oba Member

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    #31 Oba, Sep 12, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2015
    The Model 3 will not be available for the acquisition in 2017. So, Model S or X is what's available.

    The city will pay more for the green wash. The cars won't handle the abuse like a Crown Vic, so they will be mostly coddled in less rigorous roles. I'd like to know what warranty Tesla will offer them? I'll bet 100,000 miles, full pop coverage. Tesla can't risk having the city bitch about high maintenance / repair costs.

    The police union is a variable. Sure, they'll like racing around in it. But, I think you'll be surprised what they might complain about. Not enough room for their gun, not enough headroom, etc. I doubt seriously that the overall opinion of the car will be low, but its a variable.

    In time, Tesla will develop a real cop car, but Model S isn't it. They need stone simple and solid tires, wheels, simple and dependable door handles, robust suspension bits, boring seats, hard mounts for cop gear, etc. Can you imagine the police chasing a car and the whole LAPD has to slow down due to the 160kW overheat power restriction? That's with news helicopters overhead and OJ speeding off in a 20 year old Ford.

    Again, Tesla has a ways to go to be a cop car.
     
  12. RobStark

    RobStark Well-Known Member

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    #32 RobStark, Sep 12, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2015
    San Francisco and San Jose are more likely to make fleet purchases than Los Angeles.

    Other possibilities?

    Seattle
    Portland
    Eugene
    Berkeley
    San Diego
    Boulder
    Austin
    Madison
    Honolulu
    Santa Fe
    Orlando

    That is just off the top of my head.

    And basically any City in CA with a population over 300k.

    Internationally? Well, lets just start with Oslo,Trondheim and Bergen.

    And Tesla does not nor will they have massive overcapacity to accommodate large numbers of police fleet sales up to 100k units per year like Ford did back in the day.


    BMW makes several fleet sales of motorcycles to American police departments at over twice the price per unit than Harley Davidson based on total cost of ownership.

    CA has TOU rates and EV rates. I am sure large and medium sized Police Departments can negotiate far better deals than $.12/kWh. Particularly with hardwired BEV specific chargers.

    The average LAPD police car will be driven 300k miles before being auctioned off. That is 15k gallons of gasoline. A low projection over the next 5 years is $3.50 per gallon. That is $52,500 on fuel alone.

    Above mentioned cities will be glad to drive Obamamobiles that save them $40k-$45k in fuel.
     
  13. beeeerock

    beeeerock Active Member

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    When you convert the savings into the percentage of a salary, it means you can afford to hire more beat cops. Once the population figures that one out, they'll be demanding EV's so that they can have more police presence in their neighbourhoods.
     
  14. dhanson865

    dhanson865 Active Member

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    The acquisition. You think that is one one and only time this municipality or any other will buy cars?

    Way to focus on the trees and miss out on the beauty of the forest.

    I guess I'm just looking down the road at the overall progress and change coming.
     
  15. IceAge

    IceAge Member

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    20 mpg? These vehicles sit idling and cruise at low speeds more than anything. If LAPD fleet vehicles average over 10-12 mpg, I'd be shocked...


     
  16. Hugh Mannity

    Hugh Mannity Mediocre Member

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    maybe not much of a concern? cop cars don't do many road trips, it's all jaunting around the city and sitting where aerodynamics don't make much difference
     
  17. hobbes

    hobbes Active Member

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    Idling means zero mpg! And the typical stop and go city traffic is not like steady cruising at low speed - at least without regenerative breaking.
     
  18. AustinPowers

    AustinPowers Total Smeghead

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    Yeah baby, yeah ;-)
     
  19. vitaliy

    vitaliy Member

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    During high speed chase there is a need for higher speeds than 155mph & a need to sustain that speed... Current Model S cannot be a full stack police car yet
     
  20. Kevin Harney

    Kevin Harney Active Member

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    Sorry. No. Police will not maintain a chase at over 155 mph. That is what radios are for. Their primary objective is to protect the public not endanger it.
     

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