I don't see debt as a friend, but as a tool. I can retire before my 50s. My mortgage is less than my equity which could buy multiple homes or Teslas.
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Leaders and Managers: Flashy Tesla at Work?
- Thread starter Jack Tripper
- Start date
If you're a leader and this matters to you, you should't be a leader.
This is something myself, my wife, and my parents talked about before I purchased my MS a few months ago. As a young (early 30s) black man, if I drive an expensive car, it's a thing.
Now there are all types of considerations that I took into account and reasons why I felt that I could afford it. I looked at the TCO and compared to my Mercedes GLC (I had many of the same feelings when I bought that one as well), it was just going to be cheaper in the long run. I looked at the lower depreciation, the lower maintenance, the 60 miles round trip of commuting, the rebates/tax benefits etc. and could see how it wasn't as big a deal as it looked. Also, going with the 75D meant that I was sticking to the lower end anyway.
But most of that doesn't go through the average person's head when they see me get out the car. Some see it as no big deal, some understand it as a decision about my impact on the environment (though there are definitely less expensive vehicles to do the same thing), some understand that it's becoming more common in the Boston area with the tech boom, some look at it as aspirational and encouraging, and then there are some that see it as me trying to show off/or overextend myself. Those are just what happens with any expensive purchase (car, home, tech gadget, etc.). People don't take into account everything that goes into a purchase, they just make a quick judgement call.
We live in a relatively inexpensive neighborhood (hence the long commute), so I do stand out as one of the nicest cars in the area, though not as much as in other worse off neighborhoods. Where my wife grew up, people did not have a lot of money. However, you still saw some luxury vehicles parked outside some small homes, and it was known that in many cases they were financed by drug money or other illegal activities. So when I park in those neighborhoods to visit friends and family, I know that some think that way.
At the end of the day, I still bought the car I wanted (and have loved every second of it), but as mid-level manager who started at a new job about 4 weeks before I took delivery, I definitely considered the idea of how it would come off pulling up in a ~$90K vehicle. I don't hide it, but I don't flaunt it. I park in a public garage, so it's not like people see me getting into/out of my car every day, but it would be silly for me to not realize that I'm sending a message, whether intentional or unintentional. And when your job relies on you working with other people, knowing what message you're sending is critical.
Now there are all types of considerations that I took into account and reasons why I felt that I could afford it. I looked at the TCO and compared to my Mercedes GLC (I had many of the same feelings when I bought that one as well), it was just going to be cheaper in the long run. I looked at the lower depreciation, the lower maintenance, the 60 miles round trip of commuting, the rebates/tax benefits etc. and could see how it wasn't as big a deal as it looked. Also, going with the 75D meant that I was sticking to the lower end anyway.
But most of that doesn't go through the average person's head when they see me get out the car. Some see it as no big deal, some understand it as a decision about my impact on the environment (though there are definitely less expensive vehicles to do the same thing), some understand that it's becoming more common in the Boston area with the tech boom, some look at it as aspirational and encouraging, and then there are some that see it as me trying to show off/or overextend myself. Those are just what happens with any expensive purchase (car, home, tech gadget, etc.). People don't take into account everything that goes into a purchase, they just make a quick judgement call.
We live in a relatively inexpensive neighborhood (hence the long commute), so I do stand out as one of the nicest cars in the area, though not as much as in other worse off neighborhoods. Where my wife grew up, people did not have a lot of money. However, you still saw some luxury vehicles parked outside some small homes, and it was known that in many cases they were financed by drug money or other illegal activities. So when I park in those neighborhoods to visit friends and family, I know that some think that way.
At the end of the day, I still bought the car I wanted (and have loved every second of it), but as mid-level manager who started at a new job about 4 weeks before I took delivery, I definitely considered the idea of how it would come off pulling up in a ~$90K vehicle. I don't hide it, but I don't flaunt it. I park in a public garage, so it's not like people see me getting into/out of my car every day, but it would be silly for me to not realize that I'm sending a message, whether intentional or unintentional. And when your job relies on you working with other people, knowing what message you're sending is critical.
@shadownddust Great way to articulate some of the subliminal factors that some, but not all of us have to consider when making big purchases. I went through some of this same thought process a few years ago when buying an Audi A7 as a relatively new mid-level manager, and when moving to a much less diverse neighborhood last year.
While I choose not to let others' perceptions guide my decisions - It's important to acknowledge that those perceptions exist, and to be situationally aware.
While I choose not to let others' perceptions guide my decisions - It's important to acknowledge that those perceptions exist, and to be situationally aware.
Driving a Model S doesn't mean you're wealthy, for many it just means a large car payment. Some Model S owners rent apartments and don't own their own homes. Judging someone by the car they drive is lame.
While I agree with your statement on wealth, it can be a pretty significant payment that means that you probably earn a relatively large amount, or have dramatically adjusted your living expenses such that you can afford it (with the exception of the small minority that earn a modest living and have saved for years to purchase it).
I think here we often forget how much knowledge we have of the different battery sizes/years and pricing. Today, I could go and get a preowned MS60 for less than most spend on an entry level luxury vehicle. But most people don't know that, even though it applies to all vehicles. One question I sometimes ask my friends is for them to guess how old a nearby high-end luxury vehicle is and then explain to them that it's actually significantly older (eg a 2008, not a 2012 like they thought) and therefore much less expensive to purchase. But to them an S-Class for example, always looks like a $80K+ vehicle. That's why manufacturers avoid major design shifts, so the vehicles look timeless. The same applies to an MS. Most people just assume it's a $90-120K car, regardless of age, battery size, or options.
And we all judge people on what they drive, even if just to get a sense of how they choose to spend their money. If someone pulls up in a Lambo or Bentley and their coworkers are struggling to make payments on a civic, there's no way we wouldn't at least try to understand the cognitive dissonance that's going on in our heads. There are a number of explanations as to why their situation would allow for them to afford the vehicle, but the immediate reaction for *most* people is one of disbelief and that individual is trying to show off. Now, as Tesla owners, we might not feel that the Model S/X fall into that category, but for some coworkers/employees/managers who are struggling to pay rent, it sure does seem like a pipe dream to be able to afford $1200+/mo on a car.
And if folks really don't think people judge their car, I'll admit that I've done it in the past (and still do to a lesser extent), so there's at least one person out there, and probably a few million more too. Not saying it's right (it isn't), but it's the world in which we live.
whitex
Well-Known Member
Questions by who? Maybe I live in some unique world bubble, but when I read these things I keep thinking, who is going to walk up to you and ask you to justify why you bought a car? Are your neighbors going to come up to you and ask you? Your boss? Revenue Canada investigators?
One of my employee already did. He walked in my office today and said ohhhh I read that the model s is a 100k car. . Wow.....
Your finances are your concern, not anyone else's. I've had people comment on my expensive car habit before and for people who's opinion actually matters to me, I may comment on how their hobby (boat, golf, whatever) plus a typical car payment costs as much as mine. With the Tesla, I get to factor in fuel savings, so it's not much worse than the BMWs I used to drive. If it's somebody I don't know that well, I just tell them my retirement plans involve a massive heart attack at age 62.
I can't imagine it being a big deal, unless you make it seem like it.
I can't imagine it being a big deal, unless you make it seem like it.
It's true that your finances are no one else's concern, but that doesn't mean they won't try to make it. I agree that if you want to buy the car, and can afford it, go ahead and buy the car. But the difference is that depending on the situation, other people may feel a certain way about it. It does go both ways, with stories of people judging their attorney/doctor/accountant etc. if they're driving a beater and seem like maybe times are tough.
An example that a friend of mine asked about was how I felt driving into one of my volunteer activities, where the average person helping out struggles to make ends meet. Obviously, the fact that I'm there means I care and what I drive has nothing to do with what I do with my time/finances to help others, but that doesn't mean that some people won't think (falsely) that I'm just trying to be something I'm not, and that if I really wanted to help, I could donate more money than I am. Again, it's really none of their concern, but that doesn't mean they don't make something of it. And it doesn't have to be direct comments like @Ahzuz, it could be side comments or moments when you feel they're treating you differently than they did before.
Before my MS, when I bought my GLC, my boss drove a ~10 y/o Honda Accord. He obviously could have upgraded, but didn't feel the need. He was completely cool about it. However, a previous manager of mine mentioned he didn't know how I could afford it knowing how much I made. It was a casual comment, and he was mostly joking since he could easily have done some quick math and realized that as a DINK family living where I lived, it wouldn't be hard to believe that I had a few extra hundred dollars a month to put towards a car based on my salary. But if I had a cheaper car...that wouldn't have happened. My friends and I used to joke that it'd be hard to ask for a raise when managers make comments like that.
There are a lot of situations, work or outside of work, where people make certain assumptions about you and your intentions based on your car/jewelry/clothing etc. Nothing is saying you can't make that decision to wear/buy those, but in our society they are often used as signals, and like any other signal, can be miscommunicated/misunderstood.
I kid you not, as I was writing this response, a (different) friend texted me asking how I got so 'rich' (in response to a recent pledge I made to a non-profit we both work with). I told them, I'm not rich, I've just been lucky with some good jobs and gotten comfortable with certain forms of debt, and made certain decisions with where I want to allocate my money. This was after a recent ride I gave them in my MS, so I find it hard to believe that comment was based out of the relatively small (<$300) pledge I made.
If nothing else, driving a "flashy" car can lead to some awkward conversations that you might otherwise not have. Even those of us who don't have people judging them do have those responses prepared for if/when someone asks about the price. Because it's a thing.
An example that a friend of mine asked about was how I felt driving into one of my volunteer activities, where the average person helping out struggles to make ends meet. Obviously, the fact that I'm there means I care and what I drive has nothing to do with what I do with my time/finances to help others, but that doesn't mean that some people won't think (falsely) that I'm just trying to be something I'm not, and that if I really wanted to help, I could donate more money than I am. Again, it's really none of their concern, but that doesn't mean they don't make something of it. And it doesn't have to be direct comments like @Ahzuz, it could be side comments or moments when you feel they're treating you differently than they did before.
Before my MS, when I bought my GLC, my boss drove a ~10 y/o Honda Accord. He obviously could have upgraded, but didn't feel the need. He was completely cool about it. However, a previous manager of mine mentioned he didn't know how I could afford it knowing how much I made. It was a casual comment, and he was mostly joking since he could easily have done some quick math and realized that as a DINK family living where I lived, it wouldn't be hard to believe that I had a few extra hundred dollars a month to put towards a car based on my salary. But if I had a cheaper car...that wouldn't have happened. My friends and I used to joke that it'd be hard to ask for a raise when managers make comments like that.
There are a lot of situations, work or outside of work, where people make certain assumptions about you and your intentions based on your car/jewelry/clothing etc. Nothing is saying you can't make that decision to wear/buy those, but in our society they are often used as signals, and like any other signal, can be miscommunicated/misunderstood.
I kid you not, as I was writing this response, a (different) friend texted me asking how I got so 'rich' (in response to a recent pledge I made to a non-profit we both work with). I told them, I'm not rich, I've just been lucky with some good jobs and gotten comfortable with certain forms of debt, and made certain decisions with where I want to allocate my money. This was after a recent ride I gave them in my MS, so I find it hard to believe that comment was based out of the relatively small (<$300) pledge I made.
If nothing else, driving a "flashy" car can lead to some awkward conversations that you might otherwise not have. Even those of us who don't have people judging them do have those responses prepared for if/when someone asks about the price. Because it's a thing.
whitex
Well-Known Member
Talk to them as if you thought they wanted to know more about Tesla.. Ask them whether they read beyond the headlines and know the price range between a base 75D and loaded P100D (almost 2x). Then ask them if they know how much the new Roadster 2020 is. Then ask if they read about the thruster package. If they are still there, keep talking Tesla until they make an excuse and bail out. They probably won't bring it up again.
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