Learn from my mistakes... lookback at my botched installation (NorCal PG&E Territory)

[holeydonut]

SGIP or course does not say for 2 you do a max test. You send them in 12 months of green button data, and they just look for the max 1 hour
use. If it is more than batteries requested, (which is only needed for over 2), then its a non issue. But if more, like I and others had, we had to provide data we used that much. Totally fair IMO.

So, you are not on medical baseline in your house? If so, you can keep E-tou-c

No idea on 3

4, well, man, what are they hoping to find?

I was on medical baseline E-1, but was hoping to stay on E-TOU-C since I don't actually have an EV, and I cannot grid charge my Powerwalls through any normal means.

Actually this is happening to something like 10% of customers, and everyone who dares to question the mighty utility lol. It used to be triggered every NGOM, but I think you never had this requirement? Can't quite remember if you bought yours when they still required this or afterwards.

No, I think Powerwalls were finally classified as revenue grade PV metering devices, and the NGOM requirement was removed. I still think it's weird the Tesla PV generation reporting is about 4% higher than Enphase's reporting. I would have assumed Enphase artificially jacked up their own production readings to help convince people they were making lots of suds.

 

[h2ofun]

I was on medical baseline E-1, but was hoping to stay on E-TOU-C since I don't actually have an EV, and I cannot grid charge my Powerwalls through any normal means.




No, I think Powerwalls were finally classified as revenue grade PV metering devices, and the NGOM requirement was removed. I still think it's weird the Tesla PV generation reporting is about 4% higher than Enphase's reporting. I would have assumed Enphase artificially jacked up their own production readings to help convince people they were making lots of suds.

you can stay on tou-c if you are on medical baseline

 

[holeydonut]

you can stay on tou-c if you are on medical baseline

Not if you're me. SGIP rules may say E-TOU-C is a valid TOU plan with medical baseline, but it still tripped in their application review.

I decided to move to EV2-A, and I have since un-enrolled in the medical baseline.

 

[Vines]

For customers with large PV production, it's my understanding that EV2-A is slightly better very often compared with ETOU-C especially when you can actually turn your grid usage to 0 during the peak times. Off peak is quite a bit cheaper. Comparing rates isn't my specialty but my personal system is planned to move over to EV2-A.

 

[h2ofun]

For customers with large PV production, it's my understanding that EV2-A is slightly better very often compared with ETOU-C especially when you can actually turn your grid usage to 0 during the peak times. Off peak is quite a bit cheaper. Comparing rates isn't my specialty but my personal system is planned to move over to EV2-A.

Thanks for those inputs!!! Now, might see soon if the installers can get approval to make my system, even though lots of north facing panels, approved to be very large, like ending up being 25 to 30KW.

 

[holeydonut]

I don't understand... the guy that showed up at my house has literally taken the same pictures the previous guy did; and the guy before that did.

They use their camera phone to snap photos of the batteries, disconnects (yay), sub panels, TEG2, conduit, and that fancy site placard that makes no sense. They don't touch anything or pull any dead-front panels off to inspect anything.

I thought at least the guy today would pull on the disconnects to test the system or request evidence the batteries are able to power home loads. But nope, just need more pictures. I asked the guy what his work order said to get some context on whether he understood what purpose he was out here for since people keep getting sent out here to take the same photos of the same batteries and same panels. He said his work order didn't say why he was here, it just instructed him what to do.

But he said he understood the reason he usually gets dispatched to homes is because SGIP applications from "new" installers typically require photos to prove the installer is actually installing equipment. SGIP doesn't want an outfit just submitting bogus SGIP claims, hoping to collect money without actually doing anything.

I told him that I used Sunrun; not some new local shop that has never submitted an SGIP before. The permits are submitted by Sunrun, and SGIP would easily know this if they searched the permit data with the County. Sunrun and Tesla have been submitting SGIP applications for LG and Tesla battery installations for years. He said "hmmm that's weird" and left.

So yeah, at least this is just at the level of weird inconvenience instead of some project-halting BS. Still hyper annoying and I wonder why they keep needing to do this. Like no wonder PG&E has a tough time making a "fair profit"... they literally pay people to just go around taking pictures after someone else has taken pictures. And some homeowners willingly delay doing the laundry until midnight to compensate for PG&E being PG&E.

I still need to produce that 15 minute interval data though. Everything about PV and ESS is super duper weird.

 

[Redhill_qik]

@holeydonut With all of your issues you had with your install just imagine what it would have been like if you were in Palo Alto.

Palo Alto takes heat over solar permitting

Contractors and Palo Alto residents are awash with horror stories about the city's permitting process, whether for solar systems, generators or electric vehicle chargers.

paloaltoonline.com

Spoiler Alert, they love disconnects also.

 

[holeydonut]

@holeydonut With all of your issues you had with your install just imagine what it would have been like if you were in Palo Alto.

Palo Alto takes heat over solar permitting

Contractors and Palo Alto residents are awash with horror stories about the city's permitting process, whether for solar systems, generators or electric vehicle chargers.

paloaltoonline.com

Spoiler Alert, they love disconnects also.

Yeah, I'm lucky Contra Costa has Garth Robertshaw; and not Rhonda Parkhurst. I'm 99% sure my install would have died in PA. But Contra Costa actually helped me figure stuff out. It was actually Sunrun and PG&E that made me put on all the disconnects. The County guys thought the system didn't need them.


But... oh wow, the Cobalt CEO went on the record to actually put an ounce of criticism? This does not bode well for Cobalt to continue doing work in Palo Alto. Rip.

But other times personalities get in the way, and it seems to take on a life of its own, and becomes a power play or an adversarial situation," he said

You know it's funny, I've heard that Rhonda does this to every install in PA. I thought it was a joke, but it really isn't.

In recent interviews, Coale was one of several contractors who singled out inspector Rhonda Parkhurst, a national expert in electric systems whose passion for imposing requirements that don't exist anywhere else has helped drive contractors out of the city. Some inspectors, Coale said, won't leave a job unless they find something wrong and make you fix it. Parkhurst, he said, seems to go out of her way to make things difficult for solar installers. (Several other contractors echoed that assessment.)

"The torque test that they do on mechanical and electrical systems — no other jurisdiction does that. And if you have Rhonda as an inspector, she'll point at the most difficult panel to reach 100% of the time," Coale said.

 

[Ampster]

I don't know what the process would be for gas.

I did some investigation and to remove gas or move gas is a major hurdle compared to moving electrical service when it is served by overhead wires. In my case I have a 100 Amp Zinscco service panel so I need to replace that anyway.

 

[holeydonut]

AAAHAHHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAH YYAAASSSSSSSSS

SGIP check is in hand. And no PG&E person drove to my house today (whoohhooo).

My piddley PV+ESS system ... 7.0 kWp AC, 3x Powerwalls, new 200 A MSP, some cool stand-off racking, and lots of disconnects is finallllyyyyyy oveerrrrrrrrr. Damn this feels gooooood.

Man they don't make this stuff easy. I still can't believe this project landed on my original budget. Like, I guess if you count my time I'm at a huge deficit. But the net out of cost of everything after whatever offsets came in at $29,565 (the $65 was for some cool new placards). This is going to be worth every penny now that my upstairs AC is set to 73F and it's peak time. And my dinner will be nicely cooked and some nice baked bread. And I'm going to run my dishwasher at 7:30pm. Yaaasssssss

 

[SMAlset]

Glad it was a good day for you and you’re all done and good to go now in a powershut down.

Our system is 8.16kW and 3PWs. Was out today for an errand and saw it was 97F with more days expected until cool temps on Monday I think. Our 3800 sqft home is set to 76F upstairs. Biggest loads coming from our A/C, double oven and charging our cars. Been doing fine and PWs get replenished by 11am-noon from prior days usage. Next few days of continuous high temps will be our first real test of 3 PWs during “summer conditions”. Biggest concern this summer/fall will be actual wildfires as everyone is expecting bad year. Hopefully no flames here (3 lightning complex fires last year were enough) but sure smoke will take its toll on solar output. Will be curious to see how you make out there.

Last year we were having our install with the complex wildfires sending smoke this way and one of the fires like 13 miles away. Sleepless night until wind changed direction. Wasn’t sure if the guys would be out or complete the install. So relieved and happy we’re all set up too. Still think of those not as lucky and still waiting for their installs this year.

 

[holeydonut]

Glad it was a good day for you and you’re all done and good to go now in a powershut down.

Our system is 8.16kW and 3PWs. Was out today for an errand and saw it was 97F with more days expected until cool temps on Monday I think. Our 3800 sqft home is set to 76F upstairs. Biggest loads coming from our A/C, double oven and charging our cars. Been doing fine and PWs get replenished by 11am-noon from prior days usage. Next few days of continuous high temps will be our first real test of 3 PWs during “summer conditions”. Biggest concern this summer/fall will be actual wildfires as everyone is expecting bad year. Hopefully no flames here (3 lightning complex fires last year were enough) but sure smoke will take its toll on solar output. Will be curious to see how you make out there.

Last year we were having our install with the complex wildfires sending smoke this way and one of the fires like 13 miles away. Sleepless night until wind changed direction. Wasn’t sure if the guys would be out or complete the install. So relieved and happy we’re all set up too. Still think of those not as lucky and still waiting for their installs this year.

Yeah, I don't know what happened in recent years, but it seems like we went from a first world situation where energy was just "there" for consumption. This morphed into some weird alternate reality where the PoCos were killing people, and suddenly there were all these gotchas around how reliable energy was. Plus there were all these rules around how/when/why to use electricity.

But solar + Powerwalls means I can go back to the way it was just a few short years ago with using electricity. Turn on lights when I want... set the AC to something comfortable... watch TV when I want... cook a meal when I want... do some laundry when I want. The quality of life improvement is totally worth the money. I don't even care about some financial ROI nonsense hah.

And then of course I'm not checking the news to see if my area is on some PSPS list and I'm not looking at some red-flag whatever website. I know they advertise solar and Powewalls as some weird save-the-planet type of thing or some resiliency type of thing. But really it's just a way to stop caring so much about the electricity. Basically feel like most people who live in states not named California or Texas.

 

[SMAlset]

Husband said he heard on the radio here in SF bay area a FlexAlert has been called for tomorrow. I’ll probably still check the CAL ISO and PG&E outage sites. We have not had a power outage yet with our system on so it will be a new experience from the PSPS we had back in 2019.

We’ve been here for about 30 years and back then we had foggy mornings, cool evenings, fewer people, way less traffic (remember when 85 wasn’t even open yet), fewer electronics, just different weather where Bay area people didn’t have the need for A/C for the few hot, muggy nights we might have. Much larger yards with lots of trees. All adds up to what we have now.

 

[h2ofun]

AAAHAHHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAH YYAAASSSSSSSSS

SGIP check is in hand. And no PG&E person drove to my house today (whoohhooo).

My piddley PV+ESS system ... 7.0 kWp AC, 3x Powerwalls, new 200 A MSP, some cool stand-off racking, and lots of disconnects is finallllyyyyyy oveerrrrrrrrr. Damn this feels gooooood.

Man they don't make this stuff easy. I still can't believe this project landed on my original budget. Like, I guess if you count my time I'm at a huge deficit. But the net out of cost of everything after whatever offsets came in at $29,565 (the $65 was for some cool new placards). This is going to be worth every penny now that my upstairs AC is set to 73F and it's peak time. And my dinner will be nicely cooked and some nice baked bread. And I'm going to run my dishwasher at 7:30pm. Yaaasssssss

My whole house is set at 72 Going to be over 100 for the next few days. I still have like excess 150 kwh per day

 

[Redhill_qik]

I still have like excess 150 kwh per day

Thank you for your service towards a reliable grid in these times of need.

Likewise, I will be drawing zero load from the grid from sunrise through the end of peak while exporting ~40kWh with 12.5kWh during the peak period.

These are the messages that need to be spread to combat the AB1139 proponents.

 

[Zabe]

AAAHAHHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAH YYAAASSSSSSSSS

SGIP check is in hand. And no PG&E person drove to my house today (whoohhooo).

My piddley PV+ESS system ... 7.0 kWp AC, 3x Powerwalls, new 200 A MSP, some cool stand-off racking, and lots of disconnects is finallllyyyyyy oveerrrrrrrrr. Damn this feels gooooood.

Man they don't make this stuff easy. I still can't believe this project landed on my original budget. Like, I guess if you count my time I'm at a huge deficit. But the net out of cost of everything after whatever offsets came in at $29,565 (the $65 was for some cool new placards). This is going to be worth every penny now that my upstairs AC is set to 73F and it's peak time. And my dinner will be nicely cooked and some nice baked bread. And I'm going to run my dishwasher at 7:30pm. Yaaasssssss

How long from PTO to SGIP check in hand?

 

[holeydonut]

Thank you for your service towards a reliable grid in these times of need.

Likewise, I will be drawing zero load from the grid from sunrise through the end of peak while exporting ~40kWh with 12.5kWh during the peak period.

These are the messages that need to be spread to combat the AB1139 proponents.

The AB 1139 proponents (the same who like the joint IOU proposal to the NEM 3.0 process) don't care about your grid export. They've decided to value the benefit of your production at the avoided cost calculator (ACC) rate. And as I noted in some thread I can't find now... that is $0.025 per kWh during the majority of the day. This goes up to like $0.10 at peak time.

Now that they've discounted the benefit you give back to society, they want you to pay for the infrastructure you used to export 40 kWh. Because you exporting on PG&E's grid is a drain on the disadvantaged people. Their argument is so damn annoying, but that E3 company swears up and down you harm Californians at large by having a grid that you don't pay for other than to export basically worthless power.

The irony is not lost on me that if you used power from PG&E they will gladly charge you like $0.50 per kWh. So how they can rationalize that your exported power is worthless while charging others so much to use that power is beyond me.

 

[holeydonut]

How long from PTO to SGIP check in hand?

About 90 days from PTO ... but it was 90 days from passing inspection for me to get PTO. So 180 days from the completion of the system.

 

[holeydonut]

I found something interesting research NEM 3 just now. Apparently PG&E has to publish every quarter a summary of violations/issues they detected or are reported by customers against solar contractors violating the rules. Can you believe this? PG&E goes out of its way to find examples of solar contractors malfeasance and report the incidents/tracking to the CPUC.

But my complaint about PG&E with the CPUC was met with silence and apathy by the CPUC.

Here's the latest tattle data that PG&E published to the CPUC.

https://www.pge.com/tariffs/assets/pdf/adviceletter/ELEC_6063-E.pdf

As a reminder, PG&E sent a worker to my house to perform a service disconnect. Instead of just doing the scheduled/approved event which was already cleared by PG&E's planning team on a valid County permit... the PG&E field worker said he didn't like what he saw and refused to allow work to commence. After taking out the entire work crew's day and leaving my house without power for 8 hours, he later told me he didn't like solar companies and thought I was being conned out of my money on solar and batteries. He was teaching me a lesson that those companies could not be trusted.

PG&E gets to do such behavior with impunity, but some solar contractor accidentally allowing data to slip out of their interconnection portal is violating some BS rules and gets tattled to the CPUC. Give me a break.

 

[Zabe]

About 90 days from PTO ... but it was 90 days from passing inspection for me to get PTO. So 180 days from the completion of the system.

Yeah but PG&E hates you, PTO took 10 days for me.