Letter to Mr. Musk from a 1-day old outdated Model S owner

[MitchJi]

I'm not sure if this has been posted already, link for the AP 2.0 conference call. At a little past fifteen minutes Elon says that upgrading an older car is impractical, like performing spinal surgery:

I think that they possibly could have done a better job transitioning than they did.

OTOH as soon as they made the switch AP 1 stopped working so in this case it was hard to do.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Your logic is flawed. A lease is based on depreciation and a finance charge ... A loss of value over time

The point is - who cares.

You can turn in a lease at the end of the lease. You don't have to sell it. Everything is "know" at the beginning of the lease. Even the ending.

 

[ohmman]

The point is - who cares.

You can turn in a lease at the end of the lease. You don't have to sell it. Everything is "know" at the beginning of the lease. Even the ending.

You've nailed it. I get annoyed by all of the "this is why I lease Teslas" postings around here. Rarely are there any real reasons, just that things progress and people don't want to be left behind. Financially speaking, I haven't seen a very good argument favoring a lease over buying outright (outside of business use). My 2014 non-AP classic S that I own puts me in a better financial position than if I'd leased it. And by the completely misused terms of this forum, it's "outdated" and "obsolete." By the way, it still drives. And on electricity. But yeah, it's "outdated."

The reason people prefer leases is probably because it makes them feel better emotionally. "That's why I lease" can be interpreted as "I don't have to worry about it." Even so, it's insurance that costs something, and that something varies from car to car and feature release to feature release. Some people don't have the stomach for it. I like the flexibility of whatever mileage I want, the liquidity of an ownership market, and not being locked into a previously agreed-upon timeframe.

I'm planning to trade the S in for a Model 3. Who knows when that'll come? And in my case, who cares? I'm on my time.

 

[dsm363]

I understand being upset about this. I really do but this issue just gets repeated every few months. Nothing new. Tesla is always updating and not holding still. As long as you got what you paid for that's the important thing. Some of us waited over 3 years to get a car that was 'outdated' after 6 months when the P85+ came out. It happens and you move on. Tesla can't retrofit AP2.0 onto older cars, simply would cost too much. My car will never have AP 1.0 and I'm fine with that. People knew AP 2.0 was coming out (I was thinking more late 2017) but it was talked about. It's still an amazing car and something to enjoy. It's no less of a car than when you ordered it.

 

[brianman]

Releasing P100D, and AP2 just one month later? What were they thinking? Just postpone the P100D release.

So your proposed solution is to (a) slow down innovation, (b) slow down release of innovation, or (c) both? Those choices are failure IMO.

 

[brianman]

Full autonomy has been advertised by Tesla for years and years.

This incorrect, or I've totally missed it. Please provide a link proving otherwise.

 

[brianman]

Big boys don't make excuses, they accept blame.

Haha. OMG stomach hurts.

 

[Canuck]

Financially speaking, I haven't seen a very good argument favoring a lease over buying outright (outside of business use). My 2014 non-AP classic S that I own puts me in a better financial position than if I'd leased it.

Same here. I've never leased. Even if it made sense financially, which it does not, I don't like the fact the bank owns my car and not me, and they can dictate mileage, etc.

As to business use, people have misconceptions about the financial benefits of leasing, especially for small business owners like me in Canada. Buying is generally more cost effective according to experts on the issue.

Everything is "know" at the beginning of the lease.

Including when it ends and you have to give the car back and are left with nothing.

 

[brianman]

People, people, can't we all just get along?

Realist response: Not achievable.

 

[brianman]

...
And many AP 1.0 buyers thought they could upgrade to it.
If they knew it "wasn't upgradable" many would have waited.
...
The big thing about Tesla has been the fact that their cars "have been" upgradable.

As an owner of a Signature Model S and a P85D and someone who's been following Tesla for roughly 5 years, I don't know where people (you included apparently) got this impression from.

Tesla upgrades are sparsely available, expensive when available, and often take a long time to have scheduled.

 

[Garlan Garner]

As an owner of a Signature Model S and a P85D and someone who's been following Tesla for roughly 5 years, I don't know where people (you included apparently) got this impression from.

Tesla upgrades are sparsely available, expensive when available, and often take a long time to have scheduled.

Done with this thread a while ago. Not coming back.

 

[Akikiki]

Have to live with the pros and cons of Tesla being Tesla. OTA updates, constant improvements, no traditional model years is good for most people....except the people that had a new Tesla delivered juuuuuust before Elon comes out with a host of new upgrades for future Teslas.

One thing good about traditional model years....if you buy a brand new 201X vehicle right out the gate, you know it'll likely be around a year before your vehicle becomes obsolete. With a brand new Tesla? Obsolescence could be less than 24 hours away!

This issue has been debated over and over again. The first time was around the summer of '13 when Tesla added parking sensors. Those that got their car just before it, complained. And its happened many times since. If they were happy to have ordered and taken delivery on Day 1 and Tesla added new improved stuff on Day 2, the owner can be envious but can't expect Tesla to do anything for them that they didn't do for us that bought our cars in the first year. Even though other manufacturers change cars before calendar year ends, they still make changes. If someone doesn't like it, then they can wait until the perfect car for them is available - even if they do without a suitable car for many years.

 

[Canuck]

As an owner of a Signature Model S and a P85D and someone who's been following Tesla for roughly 5 years, I don't know where people (you included apparently) got this impression from.

Same here but it was funny when my daughter came home one night shortly after AP came out and said her friend's father told her to tell me just to download the update to get AP.

Done with this thread a while ago. Not coming back.

No need to announce it.

 

[brianman]

Jesus wasn't wrong when he stood alone in the face of adversity - even death. So...the that reduces the "majority rules" statement to "a possibility".

This isn't the first offensive post you've made in this thread. The racial discrimination and slavery post is another that comes to mind.

You're both hurting your argument and others' opinions of you as a person.

FYI

 

[brianman]

That isn't even true for all ICE cars. There are often mid-year refreshes and changes...

Really if you want a car that is still going to be the latest and greatest a year later you need to look somewhere other than Tesla, because Tesla doesn't like to stand still.

It's simpler than that. If you want to purchase the latest and have it remain the latest, your purchase requires a paradox.

 

[brianman]

This issue has been debated over and over again. The first time was around the summer of '13 when Tesla added parking sensors.

Plus came before that and caused some angst for recent P purchasers.

 

[brianman]

There are no hardware issues getting updates from the earliest Model S's. Now there are concerning AP. We are only talking about AP.

This is incorrect. There is a dazzling set of hardware features and improvements that are not available for 2012 Model S. What makes AP so special your mind?

 

[brianman]

massive strings of dislikes are amazing.

Perhaps you should reevaluate the way you are saying what you say?

I realize there are many ways to respond to feedback but attacking the messenger rarely leads in a positive direction.

 

[Akikiki]

Plus came before that and caused some angst for recent P purchasers.

yes, you are correct. See? Been more than once.

 

[brianman]

Don't care - Done.

Wow. That's the lowest bar I've seen so far for TMC member spinout. My sympathies.