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Li-ion Motor's - Inizio

Discussion in 'Electric Vehicles' started by PopSmith, Nov 1, 2010.

  1. PopSmith

    PopSmith Saving for a Model 3

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    This article made me laugh.

    http://jalopnik.com/5678848/li+ion-motors-inizio-if-tesla-were-a-supercar

    Yes, it's Jalopnik so the article is anti-Tesla but I did comment along the lines of "If Tesla has sold ~1300 Roadsters, what makes Li-Ion think they can sell a more expensive car at a much higher volume?"

    The funny thing is, Li-Ion has a very sketchy past (as pointed out in the article). They're hoping to sell 15,000 (not a typo!) of their $139,000 car in the future, all I can say is "good luck".

    As for the (planned) specs:

    40kW[h?] (and a potential upgrade up to 96.7kW[h?]) battery
    Up to 250 miles per charge
    0 to 60 time - 3.4 seconds

    Sounds similar to the Roadster in specs but it's a lot uglier and probably won't come to market if problems like this or this mean anything.
     
  2. Jaff

    Jaff Active Member

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    Wow, did you check out the pic of the interior?...looks like a kids playroom...ugh!!!!
     
  3. PopSmith

    PopSmith Saving for a Model 3

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    That was my thought as well. The steering wheel looks like it's covered in felt and the gauges aren't unique at all, they look like they pulled 'em straight off a Mini.

    When it comes to ergonomics, forget about it! The center console looks like they just randomly cut holes and filled them. Also, why does the on/off (I assume) switch look like an emergency switch?

    inizio_013.jpg
     
  4. Jaff

    Jaff Active Member

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    Maybe because if you buy this car, you'll be heading for trouble...:biggrin::wink:


     
  5. kgb

    kgb Member

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    I hope you read the comments too. The comments to that article were funnier than the article itself.

    My only peeve is that I am tired of people comparing vaporware to actual cars. This Inzio is a future car and should be compared with Tesla's future cars. Only Inzio's current production vehicle would be a fair comparison with a Tesla Roadster... Oh I forgot... they don't have a current production model.
     
  6. pgwoosley

    pgwoosley Member

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    L.A. Auto Show Display

    Li-Ion had an Inizio on display at the Los Angeles Auto Show. I found the body design attractive. The interior was roomy and appeared easy to enter, but the dash was rather plain. The body is quite wide.

    The rear bodywork was swung up exposing the motor, rear suspension, etc. The rear suspension seemed to be substantial. It has a 4-speed transmission. At least in the rear, the car has a space frame structure.

    I am skeptical about the statistics that the literature and the representative quoted on such things as acceleration, weight, range, etc. We shall see.
     
  7. JRP3

    JRP3 Hyperactive Member

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  8. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

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    Munter definitely being a misnomer in this case...

    Couldn't they have told that jazz band to shut up while they were filming? Who let them in to a car show anyway?
     
  9. Dragon

    Dragon Lightning Green Fairytale

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    I did stumble across this car too and was first impressed by the specs in the articles. After some research I found out that almost every article is a mess and mixed the facts without care.
    Most articles gave out the numbers of the RTX-Model stating the price of the R-Model...

    Here are the specs of the three Inizio models on offer:

    R – Rally Model $139.000
    Double Charger (Standard)
    Speed*: Up to 130 mph / 209 km/h
    Acceleration: 0-60 mph / 0-96 km/h in 5.9 seconds
    Range*: Up to 150 miles / 241 kilometers
    Charge Time: Approx. 6 Hours (w/additional charger: approx. 4 Hours, + $3,900.00)
    Batteries: 12 (100Ah for a total of 40.32kWh)
    Cycle Life*: 2500 Full Charges

    RT – Rally Touring Model $189.000
    Triple Charger (Standard)
    Speed*: Up to 132 mph / 212 km/h
    Acceleration: 0-60 mph / 0-96 km/h in 7.1 seconds
    Range*: Up to 250 miles / 402 kilometers
    Charge Time: Approx. 10 Hours (w/additional charger: approx. 5 Hours)
    Batteries: 12 (240Ah for a total of 96.78kWh)
    Cycle Life*: 2500 Full Charges

    RTX – Rally Touring Extreme $249.000
    Triple Charger (Standard) 2 Motors (Standard)
    Speed: Up to 170 mph / 273 km/h
    Acceleration: 0-60 / 0-96 km/h in 3.4 seconds
    Range: Up to 200 miles / 321 kilometers
    Charge Time: Approx. 8 Hours (w/additional charger: approx 4 Hours)
    Batteries: 24 (100Ah for a total of 80.64kWh)


    Taken from this page: X Prize Winner Li-ion Motors begins commercialization with Wave II and Inizio EVs

    Reasuming:
    1. The R-Model has the same max. speed than the Tesla Roadster, but both acceleration and range are worse. The price is higher too.
    2. The RT-Model has the same max. speed than the Tesla Roadster, the same range, but acceleration is much worse. The price is way higher too.
    3. The RTX-Model has significantly greater max. speed than the Tesla Roadster, almost the same range and a better acceleration. The price is still much higher, it's doubled!

    So in the end, compared to the Roadster, there isn't really a progression. Think about that the car will ship 4 years after the first Roadster too.
     
  10. mpt

    mpt Electrics are back

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    I've seen the car up close; it's a tubular space-frame with stuff welded on where they can fit it; it's a kit car like design. They acknowledge that it's a very low volume production solution. I'd expect the cars to be built to order.

    As for the batteries and battery swap; they're in individual boxes; three in the current car, four planned. 60 kWh was talked about which lends weight to a 250 mile range but at 170mph I'd expect the batteries to be flat just as it hit that. As for swapping, yes, with an engine lift and an hour you could swap them.

    All-in-all though, given that it actually does have 'cool factor' unlike Wheego and SmartED, I'd be very happy to see them make it to the road, it'll be the most exotic 'production' street EV until the Model S based 2+2.
     
  11. richkae

    richkae VIN587

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    Tesla could offer an upgrade for the Roadster Sport today to accelerate to 60 in about 3.3 seconds of maybe even a little faster just by making a battery using the cells from the Model S. ( it would shave off 300 pounds of weight )
    It couldnt possibly cost more than $30k
     
  12. Eberhard

    Eberhard #421 Model S #S32

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    no, it does not depend on the batterie. it only depends on the PEM. if they would use the PEM of Model S with 1000A Peak-Output it will do the job.
     
  13. richkae

    richkae VIN587

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    I'm not talking about increasing power output of any part of the system. I'm only talking about reducing weight of the car by reducing weight of the battery.
    Reduce the weight from 2800 pounds to 2500 pounds with the same power and accelerate faster.
     
  14. Eberhard

    Eberhard #421 Model S #S32

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    The batterie cells weight around 600 pound, there is little you can save,maybe 150 pound or less. (2400mA against 3100mA) but then you have less cells. Better having more range?
     
  15. richkae

    richkae VIN587

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    My calculations show that 6831 cells at 46 grams each weigh 691 pounds
    I was mistaken though, I thought they were using 3400 mAh cells, not 3100s. When the 3400 mAh cells are available, you could put together 46 cell bricks instead of 69 cell bricks.
    Then you would have 4554 cells that weigh 461 pounds. Saving 230 pounds, I would hope that you could also save 1/3 of the weight of all the connectors and shrink the size of all the containers which might be 50 more pounds, so a total savings of 280 pounds.

    I may be alone in this, but I don't need more range, I'd prefer the car to be lighter and quicker.
     
  16. richkae

    richkae VIN587

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    I know I went off on a tangent.
    However it is important to realize that the Roadster is Tesla state of the art 2007 - and that nobody has yet caught up to Tesla 2007!
    18650s have improved by 41% since then. ( 3100s vs 2200s )
    If Tesla was developing a new Roadster right now, they surely would use the 3100s.
     
  17. qwk

    qwk Model S P2681

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    Tesla should offer different battery packs for the roadster. Maybe in a few years when there are more roadsters with older batteries, they will.

    Offering a pack with the 3.1 cells would at least get you better range. The performance would likely stay the same, as the motor/pem is air cooled and they already had problems with the 1.5's at a 3.9s 0-60.

    Tesla could also offer a pack with the 3.1 cells that has a shorter range, but increased performance due to weight loss.

    It's going to be interesting to see what they will offer in the future as the roadster ages.
     
  18. JRP3

    JRP3 Hyperactive Member

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    I'd kind of think that would have to be done in the aftermarket as Tesla is going to have their hands full with the Model S and other vehicles. Upgrades for a small handful of Roadsters are going to be a low priority.
     

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