Liquid Tight Conduit with 4awg for wall charger

[Takw]

I am planning on getting this to use with 4awg Red/Black and 8Awg Green. That way i dont have to worry about fitting / connectors... and just pull them all the way from Panel through walls..etc.. and finally into the wall charger.

HYDROMAXX 1 in. Dia x 50 ft. Non Metallic UL Liquid Tight Electrical Conduit Kit with 2 Straight and 2 Angle Fittings Included 4105100050K - The Home Depot

This Flexible, Non-Metallic PVC Liquid Tight conduit, commonly referred to as NM Liquid Tight, flexible conduit, Non-Metallic PVC, Flex PVC and PVC Electrical Conduit is perfect for use in multiple applications

www.homedepot.com

Any thoughts?

 

[roblab]

Ought to work just fine. I used 6/3 with ground and pulled it all the way from the panel to the outlet, though I could have used 6/2 I suppose, but the 6/3 w ground was already wrapped into cable at The Home Depot. Not sure why #4 awg would be any better unless you plan to charge at higher rates. My setup has never shown any heat, so I'm not pulling too many amps. As NO one I know has pulled 4 awg, I would guess it's really not necessary. Just more unnecessary expense. Oh, I see you already have a "wall charger", another unnecessary expense. I've been charging at my 220 volt outlet since I bought my first RAV4EV twenty years ago. Unless you think you'll need to charge REAL FAST instead of overnight, you really won't need #4awg either, is my guess.

 

[Genie]

I am planning on getting this to use with 4awg Red/Black and 8Awg Green. That way i dont have to worry about fitting / connectors... and just pull them all the way from Panel through walls..etc.. and finally into the wall charger.

HYDROMAXX 1 in. Dia x 50 ft. Non Metallic UL Liquid Tight Electrical Conduit Kit with 2 Straight and 2 Angle Fittings Included 4105100050K - The Home Depot

This Flexible, Non-Metallic PVC Liquid Tight conduit, commonly referred to as NM Liquid Tight, flexible conduit, Non-Metallic PVC, Flex PVC and PVC Electrical Conduit is perfect for use in multiple applications

www.homedepot.com

Any thoughts?

Good plan, that could be a clean install. I favor oversize conductors on high current circuits and 4awg is exactly what I would have used if I didn’t already have leftover 6awg XHHW. After all that, I only charge at 24a/6kW.

 

[Genie]

I also used 1” conduit and if I remember correctly the Tesla WC is threaded for 3/4 so I did some minor mod on it, I think I had to grind out the WC threads and use a nut inside to secure the conduit.

 

[ATPMSD]

I am planning on getting this to use with 4awg Red/Black and 8Awg Green.

I assume you are running this as you want a 70-amp circuit so you can run a wall connector at 48-amps and comply with the 80% rule. Since you are running a conduit consider #6 THHN which is rated at 75-amps.

 

[Takw]

I assume you are running this as you want a 70-amp circuit so you can run a wall connector at 48-amps and comply with the 80% rule. Since you are running a conduit consider #6 THHN which is rated at 75-amps.

not really. I have read many post that the 6 awg gets hot and i figure with a bit more, i can get a 4awg and not having to worry that it will get that hot. thats why i am thinking of 4awg.

60A breaker
Red 4 Awg
Black 4 awg
Green 8 awg
1" 50 feet liquid tight conduit.

the conduit comes with 2 elbows - so i will just route this entire 50' ( I Only need 40') from panel into the wall charger directly, without any 90 degree, or joins..etc... and since its flex, i can just turn it and clamp it easily.

 

[ATPMSD]

not really. I have read many post that the 6 awg gets hot and i figure with a bit more, i can get a 4awg and not having to worry that it will get that hot. thats why i am thinking of 4awg.

60A breaker
Red 4 Awg
Black 4 awg
Green 8 awg
1" 50 feet liquid tight conduit.

the conduit comes with 2 elbows - so i will just route this entire 50' ( I Only need 40') from panel into the wall charger directly, without any 90 degree, or joins..etc... and since its flex, i can just turn it and clamp it easily.

Often when people talk about the wire getting hot they are referring to #6 Romex that has its own protective casing, which is why it does not require the use of a conduit. THHN is different. The wires (in your case 3-seperate wires) go into a conduit, so heat dissipation is a little better. And as I recall Romex is rated to 60°C and THHN to 75°C.

There is of course nothing wrong with your plan! #4 wire is just more expensive and harder to work with. Whatever you choose, good luck!

 

[Takw]

oh, i get it.

Often when people talk about the wire getting hot they are referring to #6 Romex that has its own protective casing, which is why it does not require the use of a conduit. THHN is different. The wires (in your case 3-seperate wires) go into a conduit, so heat dissipation is a little better. And as I recall Romex is rated to 60°C and THHN to 75°C.

There is of course nothing wrong with your plan! #4 wire is just more expensive and harder to work with. Whatever you choose, good luck!

Oh i get it. Thanks for the education. that was my sold reason for going with 4awg and when i read about the wires getting hot - i wasnt sure if they are on THHN or Romex. now i think about it they must have been on romex.

Question - with a THHN, if let say it is a 6Awg rather than 4 Awg - the size of the conduit (say 1" versus 3/4") - does it make any difference on heat dissipation or it is just for convenience on pulling wires?

thanks

 

[ATPMSD]

oh, i get it.

Oh i get it. Thanks for the education. that was my sold reason for going with 4awg and when i read about the wires getting hot - i wasnt sure if they are on THHN or Romex. now i think about it they must have been on romex.

Question - with a THHN, if let say it is a 6Awg rather than 4 Awg - the size of the conduit (say 1" versus 3/4") - does it make any difference on heat dissipation or it is just for convenience on pulling wires?

thanks

So you are now beyond me, I suggest going to an electrical store and have a discussion with them. From a heat dissipation perspective I *assume* bigger is better, but it also could be a waste of money. But you still may need 1” due to wire size anyway, so start by checking that.

 

[ucmndd]

There’s zero reason to go with #4 vs #6 in conduit for a 60 amp wall connector circuit unless you’re talking a run of hundreds of feet. At 40 feet you’re just wasting money for zero benefit or added safety.

For 1” conduit you need a step bit to drill out the entry point on the wall connector. Do yourself a favor and run #6 conductors in 3/4” conduit like the unit is designed for and don’t try to outsmart it.

 

[ATPMSD]

It look like 3/4' will be fine, according to this table:

Elliott Electric Supply - Lower Cost, Quality Electrical Supplies, and Personal Service

Electrical Supplies Distributor. Elliott Electric Supply is your local electric supply house. We Deliver Lower Cost, Quality Products, and Personal Service

www.elliottelectric.com

 

[posity]

Due to conduit fill, 3/4" PVC conduit CANNOT be used for 4 awg: SCH 40 PVC conduit is only rated for two 4 awg conductors. It is just plain silly, and a waste of money, to use 4 awg unless running a very long distance. The tables used to select/specify conductor size and conduit fill have been in use for decades in millions of installations - safely - regardless of any nonsense that Internet 'experts' may be babbling. Stick with 6 awg THHN, then you can use 3/4" SCH 40 PVC for your 4 conductors and stay within the 'conduit fill' requirements of the conduit. And with 3/4" conduit, you won't have to modify your wall connector (it's almost like the people at Tesla knew what they were doing when they designed the wall connector)! 6 awg THHN with 3/4" SCH 40 PVC conduit meets code for a 50A protected circuit: meaning it is perfectly safe.

 

[ATPMSD]

40 PVC conduit meets code for a 50A protected circuit:

I was not aware that conduit had an amperage rating. Where did you find this?

 

[DCGOO]

The voltage at my car when idle is roughly 250, dropping to around 235 when pulling 48 amps. Might go lower if the (house) air conditioning is running. Most of that voltage drop is due to the #2 wire feeding my whole house, roughly 120 feet from the utility pole. 2 gauge is standard for aerial drops for 200 amp service, because the weight of the wire is important. If your service is buried, it must be much larger, like 00 or 000. The difference between 6 and 4 gauge is pretty negligible.

 

[Mike Hawk]

OP, you're gonna have a b!tch of a time hooking up your HPWC to 4 gauge.

I've got a ~60 foot run of 2x 6awg hots + 1x 10awg ground THHN in a 3/4" rigid PVC conduit behind drywall, I'm OCD like that, wanted a clean install. Heat is of no concern. There are fill tables for heat/gauge/conductors/amperage/length etc and I'm within code for my application.

Snag the THHN off eBay and the 3/4 rigid PVC and all the misc unions, cable protectors, pvc clamps, fire insulation foam etc @ HomeDepot/Lowes.
Code allows only so many bends in your run so be sure to factor that in. Get a fish from Harbor Freight for cheap (or HD/Lowes). Don't forget conduit lube to help with the fish. Oh and a heat gun if you need to persuade the PVC into a gentle curve or what not.

Don't forget you'll probably need to get it inspected by our county inspector to be legal/insurance. Mine was like a $40 application fee.

*I am not a licensed electrician, do your own research. County inspector however did like my work and passed me. I guess he was used to some janky arse installs from other people though.

Here you can see my install with the orange fire retardant foam going thru the header. I did that little jog over in the conduit to use an existing hole in the header, previous home owner was a wood worker and had 240v runs going to the ceiling to drop down to power his various equipment. I gave myself some extra slack incase I ever wanna do a branch to go power another HPWC off the same circuit, while of course using the connectivity / power share functionality so both HPWC won't draw more than 48a at a time. Now I just need to get the wife onboard to go fully electric

 

[posity]

I was not aware that conduit had an amperage rating. Where did you find this?

Please reread my post - I tried to be clear (apparently I failed). When using conduit, you are required to not completely fill the conduit with wires. This is the 'conduit fill' requirement. There are tables that you use to look up how many current-carrying wires will fit within the type of conduit you are using. For example. 3/4" Sch 40 PVC is rated for a total of four 6 awg THHN current-carrying wires, five 8 awg THHN current-carrying wires, 21 14 awg THHN current-carrying wires. If you are mixing wire sizes within that conduit, there are online calculators to figure out whether your combination of wire sizes is allowed within the size and type of conduit you are considering.

Conduit does NOT have an ampacity limit; it has a conductor fill limit - but the end result is that you must have at least 3/4" SCH 40 PVC to handle a 50A 240V circuit that you've chosen to wire with 6 awg THHN wire.

To the OP: even with 6 awg THHN wire, you've already oversized the wire larger than required by code. 8 awg THHN is all that is required for a 50A circuit in its own conduit. The electrical codes are EXTREMELY reliable and safe, so you can rest assured that with 6 awg wire you've already gone over and above what is required. If you went with 8 awg THHN, you could go as small as 1/2" PVC Conduit and still meet the conduit fill requirements (1/2" Sch 40 PVC Conduit is rated for 3 current-carrying conductors which meets requirements regardless of any configuration of power feeding your home).

 

[Takw]

So this is what i did tonight. I bought this liquid tight 3/4 conduit 50'.

HYDROMAXX 3/4 in. Dia x 50 ft. Non Metallic UL Liquid Tight Electrical Conduit Kit with 2 Straight and 2 Angle Fittings Included 4105034050K - The Home Depot

This Flexible, Non-Metallic PVC Liquid Tight conduit, commonly referred to as NM Liquid Tight, flexible conduit, Non-Metallic PVC, Flex PVC and PVC Electrical Conduit is perfect for use in multiple applications

www.homedepot.com

1) 3/4 liquidtight conduit 50 feet
2) Ran it from panel all the way into garage (one single piece, without any cuts)
3) fished Red 6 awg THHN and Black 6 awg THHN and a Green 8THHN from garage back to panel.
4) 60A Siemens double pole breaker.

I did not install the wall charger yet - too late tonight, but i will do it tomorrow.

The one thing i am unable to find is what is the conductor fill for the 3/4 liquid tight. I am guessing this is the same as Sch40 PVC but the homedepot link doesnt show.

any comments on this setup?

thanks

 

[ATPMSD]

Sounds like a good job! Just make sure you torque all connections to spec.

 

[Takw]

i dont have a torque screw driver - but i have a torque driver wrench (like 2 feet long)

what are some inexpensive way to set proper torque connections with screws rather than buying a torque screw driver?

 

[Genie]

i dont have a torque screw driver - but i have a torque driver wrench (like 2 feet long)

what are some inexpensive way to set proper torque connections with screws rather than buying a torque screw driver?

You don’t need a torque screw driver. Tighten the lugs firmly, and let the wire end relax for minute, then turn again and you might get another1/4 turn. Done.