Rooster6655
Active Member
Don't forget the cars would probably be about 10-15% cheaper if the exchange rates had not been stuff by the Brexit vote when you could get 1.45 dollars to the pound!
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Location unveiled for EU Gigafactory
- Thread starter ACarneiro
- Start date
And about $2.50 before we joined the EU - just saying.
Politics is a manipulation to line pockets from whichever gravy train has the most freight. The UK has been in a downward spiral since we took out massive loans to pay for WW2. Then there is the progressive fragmentation of the 'empire' and then 'commonwealth' and now UK as little factions all jump to become bigger fish in ever smaller ponds. It used to rattle around a steady $5 to the pound before then.
vitesse
Active Member
Rees-Mogg did say the pound was grossly overvalued and it’s a good thing it’s devaluing.
So it’s OK, then...
So it’s OK, then...
Glan gluaisne
Active Member
and dropped again from ~$2.50 to a bit over ~$1.25 since we joined the EU...
The world game of finance poker that effectively sets exchange rates is based on loads of factors, plus a fair bit of intuition by those running investment markets, so the politics of any one country are only a fairly small part of the overall dataset that sets rates. I suspect we may well see the pound rise against the dollar if Brexit does happen, simply because the financial forecasts for the UK, at the moment, look slightly better than those for the EU. Loads of factors at play here, though, including a lot of manipulation by those who profit from rates either rising or falling.
vitesse
Active Member
Vauxhalls are made in Germany! 
To be fair, we have a 2006 runabout second car Astra Club and the paint job is still holding up brilliantly. VAG cars I've had in the past also had excellent paint. Maybe it's a German thing! I had a Honda Prelude VTEC 2.2i from new and the paint didn't last very long.
To be fair, we have a 2006 runabout second car Astra Club and the paint job is still holding up brilliantly. VAG cars I've had in the past also had excellent paint. Maybe it's a German thing! I had a Honda Prelude VTEC 2.2i from new and the paint didn't last very long.
I know!
It’s areas like paint work, body panel alignment, condensation in light units etc that seem to need focus during manufacture and QC. The basics of building a car!
d.c.palmer
10 years of EV driving
I entirely accept the manufacturing arguments re. Brexit/Germany - but the real pity is that we could still have had a Tesla design centre here in the UK. There is still a high level of expertise in automotive engineering in the Midlands and Oxfordshire - look at all the F1 and Formula-E teams here, not to mention JLR and Aston Martin.
At the time of the Model S launch in the UK, Tesla's chief engineer was a fellow Brit, Chris Porritt - formerly at Aston Martin; now at Apple, apparently. Anyway, he and Elon seemed really keen on having a UK design centre at that stage. Now, as with the ongoing disaster that's now Tesla UK service and support, it seems that Tesla's just given up on us.
At the time of the Model S launch in the UK, Tesla's chief engineer was a fellow Brit, Chris Porritt - formerly at Aston Martin; now at Apple, apparently. Anyway, he and Elon seemed really keen on having a UK design centre at that stage. Now, as with the ongoing disaster that's now Tesla UK service and support, it seems that Tesla's just given up on us.
Rooster6655
Active Member
Didn't seem to go back to $2.50 on attempting to leave but who knows maybe it will if we actually do!
The argument about the availability of skilled workers being easier to acquire in Germany and being essential is complete tosh.
I visited a German car factory about 5 years ago and there was hardly a 'native' German in sight.
That's not meant to be a racist comment but the fact that what was required was actually a large pool of unskilled workers to run the production line. There were Germans there of course but mostly they all had been there for years and largely moved off the shopfloor.
The robots however were highly skilled, very productive and strangely a delight to watch!
I visited a German car factory about 5 years ago and there was hardly a 'native' German in sight.
That's not meant to be a racist comment but the fact that what was required was actually a large pool of unskilled workers to run the production line. There were Germans there of course but mostly they all had been there for years and largely moved off the shopfloor.
The robots however were highly skilled, very productive and strangely a delight to watch!
Why do people think having a factory in Germany will magically make panel gaps perfect? It's not that Germany is the fairly land with car fairies...
It's all about in-company design and manufacturing process. It won't become magically better just because it's next to the Merc factory.
I would second this, if any skilled labour is actually that much easier to get it can be easily relocated. If that was actually a consideration they would have built GF3 at Germany first before China.
I'm willing to bet UK will get a factory in some years to come just to serve UK. Tesla does more than just cars and once the range of products increase they will need more factories.
It's all about in-company design and manufacturing process. It won't become magically better just because it's next to the Merc factory.
I would second this, if any skilled labour is actually that much easier to get it can be easily relocated. If that was actually a consideration they would have built GF3 at Germany first before China.
I'm willing to bet UK will get a factory in some years to come just to serve UK. Tesla does more than just cars and once the range of products increase they will need more factories.
d.c.palmer
10 years of EV driving
I'm surprised they didn't decide to expand the existing, Tilburg plant - which would seem to be a more sensible choice.
Some in the media have suggested that Elon wants to shake up the existing German car industry by throwing down the gauntlet on their own doorstep. However, compared to the much-more compatible Dutch (or British) options, he might have a few challenges there. I read an interesting article in Forbes on the perils of US companies trying to set up in Germany. Not only is there the obvious language issue (not all Germans speak perfect English), but things are much-more regimented over there with countless petty rules and regulations - plus, there's a rather different mindset. which might pose a challenge for Californian managers. It'll be interesting to see how they fare…
Some in the media have suggested that Elon wants to shake up the existing German car industry by throwing down the gauntlet on their own doorstep. However, compared to the much-more compatible Dutch (or British) options, he might have a few challenges there. I read an interesting article in Forbes on the perils of US companies trying to set up in Germany. Not only is there the obvious language issue (not all Germans speak perfect English), but things are much-more regimented over there with countless petty rules and regulations - plus, there's a rather different mindset. which might pose a challenge for Californian managers. It'll be interesting to see how they fare…
Midnight Star
Member
Not impressed by the Forbes article - it fails to consider that Tesla already has experience of working with German labour laws, rules, mindset etc following its acquisition of Grohmann Automation a few years ago:
Tesla Grohmann Automation - Wikipedia
Tesla Grohmann Automation - Wikipedia
I agree with Jeremy and the others here, the UK was never realistically a good choice to build a gigafactory and Germany was always a clear choice for multiple reasons, including where the hell would you put such a massive factory! The R&D centre however, may have made sense with the high concentration of auto research centres (most of which are related to F1 and within a 30 mile radius of Silverstone). Still, Germany makes the logical choice again. What better way to intimidate the competition, keep your enemies close and all that
An interesting take:
Elon Musk's plan to build a new Tesla factory in Germany makes no sense. Here's why.
Elon Musk's plan to build a new Tesla factory in Germany makes no sense. Here's why.
12Pack
Member
Meanwhile, I am fighting within my company to expand our manufacturing base in the UK, and the only thing I find worse than Brexit is this local defeatist attitude! Why is is logical to be Germany? UK labor is FAR cheaper (unionised or not), so are utilities - especially if can generate your own, and there is far better access to ports.
@12Pack not defeatist attitude, just common sense:-
1/ Why build 1000's of cars in the UK to ship around Europe
2/ There are companies all ready in Germany that manufacture parts for Tesla, why pay for them to be shipped to England, then cars shipped back to Germany.
3/ Tesla's biggest competition is the German Car manufactures in EU, better to be in their back door.
4/ There are plenty of other reasons I am sure.
As for Brexit, quicker We are out the better for us as a country long term, My opinion of Course
1/ Why build 1000's of cars in the UK to ship around Europe
2/ There are companies all ready in Germany that manufacture parts for Tesla, why pay for them to be shipped to England, then cars shipped back to Germany.
3/ Tesla's biggest competition is the German Car manufactures in EU, better to be in their back door.
4/ There are plenty of other reasons I am sure.
As for Brexit, quicker We are out the better for us as a country long term, My opinion of Course
jimbo_hippo
Member
I have to say that I'm pleasantly surprised by this thread. I'm of the opinion that if you decide to embrace a Tesla you need to employ some grown up thinking and see past all the fluff and flannel. This is confirmed by the fact that on this Gigafactory topic, there have been differing and occasionally opposing views expressed, yet unlike most social media, it's never descended into puerile mud-slinging.
I like that. I like it a lot.
I like that. I like it a lot.
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