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Louvers not opening during supercharging

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by Marc_GA, Aug 30, 2018.

  1. Marc_GA

    Marc_GA Member

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    #1 Marc_GA, Aug 30, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2018
    I assume the louvers should open during supercharging. Anyone had an issue like this?

    Outside temperature is 85F. Charging at 60 kW at 25% battery. :(

    2014 s85.
     
  2. rooter

    rooter Member

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    If the fans are on the louvers should open. Normally they would while supercharging at that temp.

    If the louvers don't respond it'll throw a warning code. (Which you can't see unless rooted)
     
  3. Marc_GA

    Marc_GA Member

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    Most of the time (last few weeks) it charges, fans on louvers closed. Sometimes fans are very loud.

    Anything to try besides talking to service center? (I am not rooted)
     
  4. jplasmd

    jplasmd Member

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    The front louvers do not always open when the condenser fans are turned on.

    From the "Theory of Operation Guides" section of the 2012-2016 Tesla service manual:

    "Two sets of louvers are fitted to Model S. The front louvers are visible from the front of the car, and the rear louvers are positioned in the ducts between the radiator and the condensers. The rear louvers are referred to as throat louvers."

    So... the center radiator, containing ethylene glycol/H20 coolant, is used initially for battery cooling, including when you supercharge and charge at home. The front louvers will stay closed, while the throat louvers open to allow the condenser fans to draw air thru the radiator, and vent it to the front wheel wells. If this is not sufficient for battery cooling, the AC hen kicks in, and the front louvers open to supply ambient temperature air to the condensers, which dump transferred heat, using R134a (in the USA), from the battery coolant chiller to the condensers.

    Do you find that your supercharging rates are always this low, or are they limited to certain Superchargers? Some Superchargers are dogs, and some Supercharger locations (e.g. Ozona, TX) are dog kennels.
     
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  5. Marc_GA

    Marc_GA Member

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    Thanks.

    When the outside temperature is 80F or warmer it starts at 118 kW and quickly drops to 60-66kW. It stays there until normal tapering. Moving stalls doesn't make it better. This is pretty much every supercharge in daytime (hot). I watched the last few times and didn't see them open at all.

    I've traveled the same superchargers a lot and know which ones to avoid. :)
     
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  6. tls

    tls Member

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    I had the problem you describe, including supercharging rates precipitously dropping as low as 65kW within minutes at a low charge state while the fans kicked on (but louvers didn't open) even in outdoor temps as low as 60F.

    After repeatedly insisting over the phone this was normal (and even saying so once when I was supercharging *at the Paramus SvC* and asked an employee to come look), when Tesla actually took the car in for service the louvers failed to actuate when they tested them; they replaced the louvers and things have been mostly back to normal.
     
  7. AmpedRealtor

    AmpedRealtor Well-Known Member

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    This happened to my 2013 and the louvers needed to be replaced with a "louver retrofit". Apparently there has been a redesign. My louvers also did not open during supercharging and and I received an alert regarding reduced cooling performance while the car was supercharging. In other words, it could not cool the cabin and the battery at the same time so cabin cooling was compromised. I called Tesla service, they saw the error immediately when they pulled up my VIN on their computer, and scheduled me for an emergency louver replacement at a service center closest to my destination. Amazing service!
     
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  8. Marc_GA

    Marc_GA Member

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    Well, I called service and they said they would pull the logs. Haven't heard anything for a few days; it has been a holiday weekend.

    I did another long leg of the trip with 3 superchargers and the louvers did open for every leg and charging was at full speed the entire time. I'm starting to consult the lunar calendar to find some similarities.

    Will wait a few days to see if the SC finds anything.
     
  9. mambro

    mambro Supporting Member

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    I noticed mine were not opening while supercharging and it was 109 degrees outside. Took it in and the Service Center tech plugged his laptop into my car and ran a "thermal scan" and everything came back as good. I was standing there when the test ran and saw them open as part of the test. It only takes a few minutes for the test to run.
     
  10. mrjedistud

    mrjedistud Member

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    I had a situation about a year ago where, once the louvre opened, you would hear rocks and sand rattling around. I assumed this was caused by the rush of wind coming through. Once Tesla diagnosed the problem they replaced the louvre. Here is an excerpt from the invoice:

    Concern: failed thermal test. needs active louver upgrade retrofit
    Correction: Perform 2nd Generation Active Louver Retrofit

    Strangely it was only on one side and there were no active faults visible. I think the rocks/sand were coincidental.
     
  11. JakeP

    JakeP S P4996 / X P6028

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    During a bumper repair on my 2012 S85 we discovered my louver flaps were broken, and no longer functional. Were the Louver Retrofits done out of warranty as Goodwill, or were you asked to pay?
     
  12. sorka

    sorka Well-Known Member

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    If you mean that you're starting to charge at 35% or less and it even then it drops quickly to 65KW when you're not second priority on the stack AND your louver is not opening, then it's defective.

    I had the same issue and I couldn't get over 65KW even when empty during moderate to warm temperatures. Would initially start out at 116K+ but within a minute would drop to 65KW. It was like that for six months.

    I took it to Tesla in Fremont and their TOP diagnostic technician at the time plugged it into their limited 60KW supercharger and told me that it was charging normally.

    I told him that since it's reduced to 65KW on a 120KW charger, that a 60KW charger isn't going to reproduce the issue. He said that since there was no error on the dash there was no problem and that if there was a problem, it would show up on the dash.

    I asked him if he could check the logs. He came back 2 minutes later and said he checked the logs and all was fine.

    So I took it to the Dublin service center the following week. Before I even left in the loaner, the tech came and told me they pulled the logs and there was louver alert that had been there for months and that I had a defective cooling louver.

    They replaced and I had the car back 4 days later and it has supercharged normally ever since.
     
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  13. GlmnAlyAirCar

    GlmnAlyAirCar Member

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    The important takeaway here is that the (visible) louvers do not always open when supercharging, by design.
     
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  14. JakeP

    JakeP S P4996 / X P6028

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    And if your louvers cannot open, you are going to see supercharging speeds throttled, even at low SOC at normal temps with priority position.
     
  15. Buster1

    Buster1 Member

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    Based on the engineering and diagnostics schematics, I still believe the louvers only play a part in the cabin air conditioning system. They don’t appear to tie into the heating/cooling system (series or parallel) for the drivetrain/battery.

    Tesla Thermal Management System - explanation
     
  16. JakeP

    JakeP S P4996 / X P6028

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    Buster1, thanks for that link, those are cool diagrams. But why do you say the louvers don’t appear to tie in? Aren’t the front/center louvers tied directly to the red line? And the side louvers tied to the blue line?
     
  17. Buster1

    Buster1 Member

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    The front radiator is for red line (battery system). There are no louvers for the front radiator. The blue line is HVAC and side louvers.
     
  18. JakeP

    JakeP S P4996 / X P6028

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    What year is your car, and/or what year do these schematics apply to? I am being shown pictures of broken louvers on my car in the front center, not to be confused with the lower front side louvers. I am now wondering if the “Louver retrofit” discussed above (by owners of early VIN cars like mine) may actually be eliminating the front/center louvers on my car?
     
  19. JakeP

    JakeP S P4996 / X P6028

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    Here are some pics of the front center louvers I am talking about. Notice these are vertically mounted, as opposed to the horizontally mounted front lower side louvers.
     

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  20. Buster1

    Buster1 Member

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    Interesting @JakeP . Not sure. I believe that the schematics are for all Model S cars.

    What are the “front center” louvers you speak of? My facelift car doesn’t have that...it just has the side louvers by the fog lights. Edit: just saw your pic above.
     

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