Lucid Air Will Be Better Than Model S, Says Former Tesla Engineer

[wws]

I had several choices. Model S, Model E (3), Model X, now Model Y (finally Sexy) and soon Model T (semi tractor) and Model P (pickup). Yes, I have my commercial driver's license for driving semis, and have an order in for the P. Already got the S, 3, X. Sex sells! And the lineup is SEXY...

Seems it is actually S3XY CARS. CARS = Cybertruck, ATV, Roadster, and Semi.

 

[XLR82XS]

What GM does with Hummer remains to be seen. I don't like the idea of reviving a dead brand and slapping batteries in it, but I'm not an auto executive...

If it ever comes to fruition that electric Hummer will be a disaster. You're right - slapping batteries in a vehicle not designed from the start as an EV is retarded.

 

[lynnpt2001]

It's a "proper" sedan instead of a hackback, so it's better than the Model S? The Model S being a hatchback was one of it's best features!

I've been able to my all my kid's stuff back and forth to college. That just would not be possible in a normal sedan.

100% agreed, why do most people want the SUV for the hatchback and space, why not get the best of both worlds...

 

[dingyibvs]

I'm very interested in the Lucid Air. I really want a classic luxury car, and I think an EV with its quieter, smoother drivetrain is a natural progression of luxury vehicles. It's my personal taste and I understand that many don't want the same. For me, I'd much rather pay for high end leather, bespoke design, etc. than autopilot, summon, or other things which I won't use. People have different tastes, so the more choices the better IMO.

I just hope Lucid offers a soft, cushy suspension as well. It's annoying how every car tries to be a sports car these days. Lucid stating that the 1000hp is just a byproduct of having a large battery gives me hope that they're not just chasing performance numbers.

 

[diplomat33]

Here is a nice interview with Lucid CEO, Peter Rawinson:

How The Lucid Air Electric Car Can Achieve 400 Mile Of Range | Digital Trends

 

[MX_2017DE]

I think this article reflects in detail the balancing act those new companies are in:
- Build a perfect best in class brand new EV -> very expensive, few customers or
- Build a mass market model (-> less efficient) medium price (still not cheap), more customers.

The mass model won't be luxury either and it won't be better than a current Tesla.
One (the only?) advantage will be 900V architecture and maybe a brand new design.

Mr. Dyson "threw away" his attempt to build a luxury EV from scratch because it won't be profitable.
So I wonder if the Lucid will ever be. Just to produce high end cars may not be enough to survive.
And I don't know if Lucid has such a deep breath to survive until mass market models will be available.

As I said before, I appreciate competition and I like the design of Lucid.
But when it comes to production/sales they all boil with water.

 

[diplomat33]

Lucid will unveil production version of the Air with pricing and specs on Sept 9:
Lucid Motors to unveil production Air electric car with pricing and specs on Sept 9 - Electrek

 

[dingyibvs]

I think this article reflects in detail the balancing act those new companies are in:
- Build a perfect best in class brand new EV -> very expensive, few customers or
- Build a mass market model (-> less efficient) medium price (still not cheap), more customers.

The mass model won't be luxury either and it won't be better than a current Tesla.
One (the only?) advantage will be 900V architecture and maybe a brand new design.

Mr. Dyson "threw away" his attempt to build a luxury EV from scratch because it won't be profitable.
So I wonder if the Lucid will ever be. Just to produce high end cars may not be enough to survive.
And I don't know if Lucid has such a deep breath to survive until mass market models will be available.

As I said before, I appreciate competition and I like the design of Lucid.
But when it comes to production/sales they all boil with water.

There's a segment between high end (>$100k) and mass market(<$40k) though. That's where most versions of the M3 fall currently. I think there's a large segment of consumers who just want a traditional car with a capable electric drivetrain. If Lucid can achieve that, particularly before the traditional automakers do, I think they can find plenty of customers.

I know personally I'd want a car with a few more buttons, some nice leather, more upscale cabin, HUD, etc. that you find in almost every other luxury vehicle and I could care less about FSD, summon, arcade, and whatnot. I think it's entirely possible that a carmaker can invest less in the Tesla-exclusive type of technologies and put that money in more mainstream luxury amenities to come up with a compelling car at similar price point as the M3.

 

[diplomat33]

Lucid Air scores an industry best aerodynamic coefficient of only 0.21, beating both the Model S and the Porsche Taycan:

Lucid Air looks to dethrone Tesla Model S and Porsche Taycan with killer aerodynamics

 

[ICUDoc]

Lucid Air scores an industry best aerodynamic coefficient of only 0.21, beating both the Model S and the Porsche Taycan:

Lucid Air looks to dethrone Tesla Model S and Porsche Taycan with killer aerodynamics

Hard to believe that a car with a “vortex-generating air intake system”, as the Teslarati article says, could have a low Cd. I await the car actually existing for sale and tested with real road tyres.
Sounds pretty impressively slippery. Wonder what the frontal area is?

 

[redalf]

One of the things that makes Lucid Air promising, to my eyes, is how much of their technology is designed in house, obviously that's a lesson taken from Tesla, but its a lesson many other automakers seem stubborn to learn. As Tesla has shown, that kind of vertical integration is what makes it possible to improve tech on the manufacturing line as soon as an improvement is viable, rather than waiting for a new model year and new equipment, as well as OTA updates that are substantial engine and battery improvements, rather than simple software changes that most automakers are limited to. Lucid Air in general seems to be one of the first companies coming along to actually try and evolve the EV, instead of just making a heavy ICE vehicle that takes advantage of some extra torque. Even Rivian, another EV company which I'm also excited about, is still taking a fairly conventional approach. Lucid has (claimed) to improve the volt architecture, the battery pack (which they've been in development with Formula E on for a while), the motors, which are spec'd out to be incredibly powerful especially for the size and weight they are claiming they'll come in at, and the crazy drag rating that was mentioned above, and all done in-house. I think when/if it comes out it'll be a real exciting entry to the market.

That said, the big knock against it is it'll probably also be 4-5 years too late. By the time it comes around, it'll not only be the 400 mile Tesla that's already out there, but VW, Audi, BMW, Porsche, Jaguar, Mercedes, all will likely have some version of an EV luxury sedan. Luxury sedans already kind of a niche market, and for EVs it looks like it'll quickly become a more crowded one.

 

[diplomat33]

That said, the big knock against it is it'll probably also be 4-5 years too late. By the time it comes around, it'll not only be the 400 mile Tesla that's already out there, but VW, Audi, BMW, Porsche, Jaguar, Mercedes, all will likely have some version of an EV luxury sedan. Luxury sedans already kind of a niche market, and for EVs it looks like it'll quickly become a more crowded one.

The key will be if the Lucid Air can really stand out. If the Lucid Air can be compelling enough for consumers to pick it over other luxury sedans, then I think Lucid has a chance. So far it looks very promising. The Lucid is not just a beautiful car with great luxury and great range but it also has excellent FSD hardware too and promising full self-driving. Lucid is going with Mobileye which has excellent FSD. If the FSD software can deliver true autonomous driving then the Lucid Air could be the total package. Who would not want a beautiful, luxurious, 400 mile, true full self-driving EV? Personally, on paper, I think the Lucid Air beats a lot of the EVs from Porsche, Audi, Jaguar etc...

 

[Stavanger]

Model S Plaid is also tri-motor. He probably could put more HP quicker? perhaps
- battery? we shall see.
- Charging Network? how will that work out
- Price ?
- As Sandy Munro says - easy to build high priced low volume - who cares (only the wealthy can afford anyway)
Porsche 800v and Lucid 900v How many Taycans will Porsche make/sell?
real interesting 2020.

Porche seems to be selling really well actually. I saw my first Taycan maybe 1-2 months ago, but now I see them daily where I live and its not the same car.

 

[Brando]

Porsche seems to be selling really well actually. I saw my first Taycan maybe 1-2 months ago, but now I see them daily where I live and its not the same car.

We shall see IF they sell even 10,000 in 2020 world wide.

selling really well - sure.

 

[Mr X]

I certainly hope a *2021 electric vehicle is better than a 2012 Model S

 

[5JMJ]

September is shaping up to be an eventful month, with Lucida unveiling on the 9th and Tesla having battery day on the 15th it will be interesting to see if Tesla unveils an updated Model S that is competitive with Lucids specs. I saw the teaser mentioned 442 miles of range which beats the current Long Range+.

 

[diplomat33]

Lucid Air gets a EPA estimated range of 517 miles! And no, that is not a typo.
Lucid Air to top Tesla Model S with astonishing 517-mile estimated EPA range

It will be interesting to see how the real world range compares to the EPA range. And that is the most expensive, long range version, but that is still incredible.

 

[teslasuperfan]

It will be interesting to see how the real world range compares to the EPA range. And that is the most expensive, long range version, but that is stil incredible.

Here is the real world range test reported by Motor Trend. Basically confirmed the EPA range.
https://www.motortrend.com/cars/lucid/air/2021/2021-lucid-air-first-ride-review-range-test/

 

[diplomat33]

Here is the real world range test reported by Motor Trend. Basically confirmed the EPA range.
https://www.motortrend.com/cars/lucid/air/2021/2021-lucid-air-first-ride-review-range-test/

That's great news. Battery ranges are totally competitive with ICE ranges now IMO.

I expect Tesla to improve their ranges soon, especially after battery day.

 

[BlindPass]

I think this article reflects in detail the balancing act those new companies are in:
- Build a perfect best in class brand new EV -> very expensive, few customers or
- Build a mass market model (-> less efficient) medium price (still not cheap), more customers.

The mass model won't be luxury either and it won't be better than a current Tesla.
One (the only?) advantage will be 900V architecture and maybe a brand new design.

Mr. Dyson "threw away" his attempt to build a luxury EV from scratch because it won't be profitable.
So I wonder if the Lucid will ever be. Just to produce high end cars may not be enough to survive.
And I don't know if Lucid has such a deep breath to survive until mass market models will be available.

As I said before, I appreciate competition and I like the design of Lucid.
But when it comes to production/sales they all boil with water.

You just also described Tesla. A non-luxury, but expensive low-volume car in the S/X, and a very expensive mass market car in the Model 3.

Tesla should be a decade further in getting their production costs down compared to a start-up. As they’ve recently heavily promoted, one of their biggest advantages going forward is in the machine that makes the machine. Their current production quality doesn’t suggest that, but they’re still a decade past Lucid and Rivian.